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大家好，欢迎回到《建筑暖通科学》节目。
Hello, and welcome back to Building HVAC Science.
我们的播客旨在培养更优秀、更专业的暖通空调和建筑性能领域人才。
Our podcast aims to create better, more knowledgeable HVAC and building performance pros.
我认为可以通过帮助这两个专业领域的人士更好地理解彼此及其工作环境来实现这一目标。
I think we can achieve this by helping the two professions better understand each other and the world that they work in.
说到工作环境，与Aaron Hussak的这次对话非常有趣。
Speaking of working in the world, this conversation with Aaron Hussak is a really interesting one.
亚伦是我多年前的一位朋友，他回顾了自己曲折的职业道路：从2000年代中期从事太阳能行业，到后来从事建筑性能与BPI培训，再到在加州弗雷斯诺创立了一家名为Balance Comfort的公司。
Aaron's a friend of mine from a long time ago, and he traces his winding path from working in solar in the mid two thousands to building performance and BPI training and to founding a company called Balance Comfort in Fresno, California.
这家公司最初只是一家小型家庭能源评级机构，但通过自主发展逐步涉足隔热、暖通空调和防风改造领域，最终四次入选《Inc.》杂志评选的5000强企业榜单。
That started out as a small hers and energy rating firm, but it bootstrapped its way in insulation, HVAC, and weatherization, eventually landed on the Inc.
在短短几年内，公司规模从130万美元迅速扩张至1200万美元。
5,000 list four times, scaling from 1,300,000.0 to 12,000,000 in just a few years.
在此过程中，亚伦亲身经历了快速增长的复杂性，包括急速招聘、依赖退税政策、发现财务和人力资源后台管理的严重漏洞，以及应对加州复杂的法律环境，并将这些经验教训与我们分享。
Along the way, Aaron learned and retells us of the complex realities of rapid growth, hiring quickly, depending on rebate programs, uncovering serious gaps in back office accounting and HR, and navigating California's legal landscape.
而当PG&E突然取消了一项占公司半数收入的节能改造项目时，情况变得异常艰难，当时亚伦还正面临一些个人问题。
And then things got really rough when PG and E abruptly pulled a weatherization program that made up half of this company's revenue, right as Aaron was also dealing with some personal issues.
最终，该公司在2005年初被收购，让亚伦得以艰难脱身。
Ultimately, came through and acquired the company in early two thousand and five giving Aaron a hard earned exit.
但通过这段经历，他谈到了自己的坚韧不拔，以及为何态度比能力更重要。
But from this experience, he talks about his perseverance and why attitude beats aptitude.
他还向我们描述了他对新公司Sequoia Geo的愿景，Geo代表生成引擎优化（Generative Engine Optimization），这是他的人生新篇章。
He also describes for us his vision for a new company, his next chapter, Sequoia Geo, where Geo stands for Generative Engine Optimization.
请收听本期节目。
Please listen to this episode.
亚伦将与我们分享他宝贵的经验见解，以及如何在这个AI与GEO营销的新时代中把握机遇。
Aaron's got some great insights to share with us in terms of his experience and what you can do in the new world of marketing with AI and GEO.
让我们一起来收听这期与亚伦·胡萨克的对话。
Let's listen to this episode with Aaron Husak.
嘿，各位。
Hey, folks.
欢迎回到建筑暖通科学播客。
Welcome back to the Building HVAC Science Podcast.
我是埃里克·基瑟，那边是伟大的比尔·斯彭先生，还有今天的特别嘉宾亚伦·胡萨克先生。
Eric Kiser here, the great mister Bill Spone right over there, and a special guest today, mister Aaron Husak.
我想我发音没错吧。
I think I pronounced that right.
我说对了吗，亚伦？
Did I get that right, Aaron?
完全正确。
You nailed it.
谢谢。
Thank you.
太好了。
Sweet.
没错。
Right.
我喜欢把事情做对的感觉。
I love it when I get things right.
你来这里是想跟我们介绍一下自己，也许还有你的经历和现在的工作。
But you're here to tell us about yourself and maybe where you've been and what you're doing now.
听起来你现在在做一些新的事情，所以我们很期待今天能了解这些。
It sounds like you're doing something new now, so we're excited to learn about that today.
是的。
Yeah.
艾伦，我们十四、十五年前就认识了。
And Aaron, we met fourteen, fifteen years ago.
没错。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
那时候你刚开始接触建筑科学或者说建筑性能测试。
And you were just getting into building science then or building performance testing.
那时候发生了什么？
What was going on back then?
是的。
Yeah.
2006到2010年间，其实我当时在做太阳能行业，2008到2009年的金融危机让这个行业陷入了困境。
So 2006 to 2010, I was in solar at that time actually, and the financial crisis threw that for a loop back in 08/00/2009.
我2010年进入建筑性能领域，我们大概就是在那之后不久认识的。
I had gotten into building performance in 2010, and I think we met shortly after that.
对。
Yep.
这段旅程让我从建筑性能领域起步。
The journey took me from building performance.
实际上我曾担任过约一年的BPI培训师，通过一个资助项目在加州各地巡回授课。
I actually was a BPI trainer for about a year traveling the state of California through a grant program.
之后，我在家乡弗雷斯诺找到了一个做检测的机会。
And after that, found an opportunity to do testing back in Fresno, which is where I grew up.
当时我在圣地亚哥，艰难地决定从圣地亚哥搬回弗雷斯诺，并于2012年创立了Balanced Comfort公司。
So I was down in San Diego, made the difficult decision to move back to Fresno from San Diego, and founded Balanced Comfort in 2012.
Balanced Comfort最初是上门为住宅进行能源审计。
And so Balanced Comfort started out as going out and doing energy audits for homes.
我们当时做的是加州特有的HERS二级测试，包括鼓风门管道测试、红外摄像头检测，然后根据发现为客户提供报告。
We were doing HERS two testing, which is unique to California, going in doing a blower door duct test, infrared camera, and then providing customers with a report based on what we found.
这个业务持续了大约三年，之后该项目逐渐终止。
And that ran for about three years, and then that program started to end.
于是我们将公司业务转向机械和管道工程一段时间。
So we shifted the company over to doing mechanical and plumbing engineering for a while.
我意识到这将面临多大的挑战。
I found out how challenging that was going to be.
之后我开始与当地一家当时从事空调业务的承包商合作，并成功说服他们涉足建筑性能领域。
And then I started working with a local contractor who did air conditioning at the time and was able to influence them into getting into building performance.
在那之前，他们只做设备更换业务。
For that, they were doing just change outs.
炉子更换，空调更换。
Furnace change out, AC change out.
那时候，刚启动了一个叫'加州能源升级计划'的项目。
Back then, was called the Energy Upgrade California program that had just gotten started.
于是我就去跟他们说，看，我拥有参与这个计划所需的所有资质认证。
And so I went in and said, look, I've got all these certifications that you need in order to work with this program.
我们何不合作呢？
Why don't we work together?
他们正好有个机会来了。
So they had an opportunity come up.
我就去做了能源审计。
I went out, did the audit.
老板过来问我，你愿意去给客户做展示并提供这些升级方案吗？
The owner came to me and said, do you wanna go out and present this and offer these upgrades to the customer?
于是我就去了，那时候他们的平均报价是7500美元。
So I went out and at the time, their average ticket was $7,500.
我出去后，展示了两套管道系统、一台空调机组和保温材料，我清楚地记得和他们坐在厨房餐桌旁时，他们说‘好的，我们继续推进这个项目’。
Went out, presented two duct systems, an AC unit, insulation, And I remember very clearly sitting at the kitchen table with them and them saying, yeah, let's go forward with this.
于是第二天我走进办公室说‘好的，我们开始吧’。
And so I walked in the office the next day and said, okay, let's go.
他们完全被震撼了。
And they were just blown away.
那是一个23,000美元的项目。
It was a $23,000 job.
他们当时的反应是‘好吧’。
And they were like, okay.
这里面蕴藏着巨大机遇。
There's a huge opportunity here.
这促成了我们之间持续约五年的合作关系。
So that led to a relationship working with them for about five years.
在此期间，开始让Balanced Comfort公司涉足保温材料业务。
During that time, started to get Balanced Comfort into insulation.
于是我们开始通过Balance Comfort安装隔热材料，后来我还考取了暖通空调和总承包商的执照，都是为了Balance Comfort。
So we started installing insulation through Balance Comfort, and then eventually got my HVAC and general contractor's licenses, so for Balance Comfort.
我觉得我听到了所有这些经历中的一个共同点。
I think I hear a common thread through all this.
你在每个方面都有非常扎实的基础知识，或者说你主动去获取了那些知识。
You had really good foundational knowledge in each of these aspects, or you sought that knowledge.
你能稍微谈谈这是你有意为之，还是说只是顺理成章发生的下一步？
Can you talk a little bit about if you did that purposefully, or was it just like the next logical thing that happened?
我很想说这一切都是我计划好的。
I would love to say that I planned this all out.
我们都希望如此。
We all would.
我最喜欢做的事情之一就是冲浪。
One of my favorite things to do is surf.
在弗雷斯诺我没什么机会冲浪。
I don't get to do that much in Fresno.
但把它想象成冲浪一样。
But but think of it like riding the wave.
抓住一个机会，顺势而为，看看它能带你去哪里，然后你会看到下一个机会就在地平线上，于是你又朝那个方向前进。
You've got an opportunity, and you run with it, and you see where it goes, and then you see the next opportunity coming up just over the horizon, and you go towards that next.
这基本上就是我的做法。
So that's essentially what I did.
我进入暖通行业的路径非常不典型。
I came into HVAC from a very nontypical path.
当时我在做HERS评级，会出去告诉承包商'你的过冷度有问题'。
I was doing HERS ratings, and I'd go out and say, your subcooling is off.
承包商会问'那我该怎么修？'
Contractor would say, well, how do I fix it?
这其实不归我管。
That's not really my deal.
这是需要你自己解决的问题。
This is for you to fix.
所以对我来说有一个巨大的学习曲线。
So there was a huge learning curve for me.
那时候在2009/2010年，圣地亚哥燃气电力公司——无论你喜欢与否——他们提供了一些极好的培训课程。
And back then, 09/2010, San Diego Gas and Electric, love them or or not, they had some fantastic training courses.
现在它被称为可持续能源中心。
It's now called the Center for Sustainable Energy.
你几乎每天都可以去学习建筑科学方面的新知识。
You could go almost every day and learn something new about building science.
大约两年时间里，那里就是我的课堂。
And for about two years, that was my classroom.
因此我能够在那里向专家们亲身学习大量建筑科学知识。
And so I was able to learn a tremendous amount about building science hands on from experts down there.
这些机会在其他地方几乎不可能获得。
Those are opportunities that I wouldn't have had just about anywhere else.
所以这对我的职业生涯是一个巨大的进步。
So that was a huge advance in my career.
因此，在那里学习基础知识，正如你所说，让我能够以不同的视角看待事物，并从不同的角度处理暖通空调问题。
And so learning the basics down there, to your point, allowed me to look at things differently and approach HVAC from a different standpoint.
听起来你一直单打独斗，后来成为企业家，然后开始雇佣员工。
And all the while, it sounds like you were solo, and then you became an entrepreneur, and then hired people.
能带我们了解你公司这些发展阶段吗？
Can you take us through those upgrades in your company?
好的。
Yeah.
2010年时，我们在圣地亚哥创办了一家公司，当时很多工作都是我们自己做的，比如Hirsch评级、BPI审计之类的工作。
So back in 2010, we had started a company in San Diego, and we were doing a lot of the work ourselves, Hirsch ratings, BPI audits, stuff like that.
当我回到弗雷斯诺加入Star Balance Comfort后，我开始招聘并培训人员和我一起进行能源审计，因为独自一人每天完成多项审计确实很有挑战性。
When I moved back to Fresno to Star Balance Comfort, I started hiring and actually training people to do energy audits with me because doing several audits a day by yourself was really challenging.
就在那时，每天的需求量是三到四次审计，晚上还得回去处理所有这些数据。
It's just at that time, the demand was three or four audits a day, and then it would be going back to process all of that data at night.
所以这非常耗时。
And so it was very time consuming.
因此，我必须适应与团队合作，尽可能获取最佳信息。
And so that was something that I had to adapt to in working with people to get as best information as I could working with them as possible.
起初，是他们为我们提供了这些机会。
At first, they were providing us with the opportunities.
他们会派我们去审核住户。
So they were sending us homes to go audit.
后来这项支持取消了，他们不再提供住户资源，于是我不得不组建一个地推团队。
That eventually went away and they didn't provide the homes anymore, so I had to grow a canvassing team.
我们组建了地推团队挨家挨户推广，为客户提供完全补贴、实质免费的能源审计服务。
And so we built a canvassing team to go door to door to offer what were fully subsidized, essentially free energy audits to customers.
提供免费能源审计比想象中更具挑战性，因为人们总觉得其中有猫腻。
And offering free energy audits is more challenging than it should be, because people think that there's some catch to it.
是啊。
Yeah.
肯定有套路。
There's a hook.
是的。
Yeah.
怀疑。
Suspicion.
没错。
Yeah.
我来自服务业。
I had come from the service industry.
我从小就在餐厅工作。
I had worked in restaurants growing up.
所以客户服务对我来说很自然。
And so customer service was very natural to me.
管理、领导力这些是必须学习的，而理解如何让人们做你真正需要他们做的事，而非他们想做的事，我得说至今仍是个挑战。
Management, leadership, those things had to be learned, and understanding how to get people to do what you really need them to do, not necessarily what they want to do, I would say, is still a challenge.
但你在转型过程中显然一直关注着各种信号。
But you've paid attention to signals along the way, obviously, as you made these shifts.
你能想到任何具体促使你转向不同方向的事情吗？
Can you think of anything specific that signaled you to look in a little different direction?
是来自客户的反馈吗？
Was it feedback from customers?
是来自项目的反馈吗？
Was it feedback from programs?
还是单纯的经济环境因素？
Was it just economic conditions?
是的。
Yeah.
这是个很好的问题。
That's a great question.
我认为推动我走到现在的因素就是坚持，以及持续以各种方式不断进取。
I think the things that helped drive where I've ended up is just persistence and just continuing to get after it one way or another.
我与2015年开始合作的承包商结识，是通过参加当地的国际商业人脉网络组织（BNI）。
My connection to the contractor that I started working with in 2015 was out of I was going to the local business networking international, the BNI group here in town.
我恰好通过那个场合认识了他们，并向他们提供了HERS评级服务，但他们拒绝了。
And I happened to meet them through that and offered them HERS rating services, and they said no.
后来我又去找他们，说‘如果这样做呢？因为你们没有资质参与这个返利项目’。
And I went back to them and I said, what if we do this because you guys don't have the certifications to do this rebate program?
那时候，他们正在向进行升级的客户投入大量资金。
And back then, they were throwing substantial dollars at customers who made upgrades.
我的意思是，这是基于模型的，客户根据他们所做的升级和实施的建模，能拿回3050到7000美元不等的返利。
I mean, it was based on the model, and customers were getting $3.05, $7,000 back depending on the upgrades they made and the modeling that was performed.
因此客户利用这些项目能获得巨大收益。
So there was a huge upside for customers to take advantage of those programs.
所以当时只是观察市场可能的走向，但同时也没有坐等事情发生。
So it was just seeing where the market might be going, but then at the same time, it wasn't waiting for things to happen.
而是主动出击，即使不确定结果会如何，也要想办法促成一些事情。
It was going out and figuring out how to make something happen even when I wasn't sure what that was going to look like.
所以你用一种平衡的方式做到了这一点，双关语有意为之。
So you did it in a balanced way, pun intended.
是的。
Yes.
绝对如此。
Absolutely.
亚伦，我很好奇，除了比尔那些绝妙双关语之外，是什么思考过程让你决定取这个名字。
Aaron, I'm curious what thought process led you to name it other than Bill's great puns there.
是什么样的思考过程让你选择了'平衡舒适'这个名字，背后有什么故事吗？
What thought process brought you into balanced comfort, and what was the history behind that a little bit?
我的目标始终是弄清楚某件事的成本是多少、会带来什么收益，以及什么对房主真正有意义。
My goal had always been to identify what does something cost, what is gonna be the benefit, and really what makes sense for a homeowner.
给公司命名——就像我最近刚做的那样——是个挑战。
And naming a company, as I just had to do recently, is a challenge.
这并不容易，因为你想要一个贴切的名字。
It's not something that's easy to do because you want something that fits.
它需要有一定的独特性，因为这个名字还得和网站相配。
It needs to be somewhat unique because it's gotta work with the website.
你不想要一个太长的名字。
You don't want something that's too long.
但说到‘平衡舒适’这个名字，其实所有的功劳都归功于我妻子。
But in terms of the name Balance Comfort, all of the credit goes to my wife, actually.
是她想出了这个名字。
She came up with the name.
那时候她还是一名瑜伽教练。
Back then, she was a yoga instructor.
于是她想出了这个名字，我们把一些相关信息提供给了Kick Charge公司，我们的品牌设计就是与他们合作的。
And so she came up with the name, and we fed some of that information over to Kick Charge, who we had worked with for our branding.
这就是他们如何设计出那个房子图案和禅意瑜伽姿势来代表平衡舒适的。
And that's how they came up with that house that house and zen yoga type pose for balanced comfort.
但这真的很棒。
But it was fantastic.
它很突出，而且效果很好。
It stood out and, yeah, it worked well.
但进行能源审计并真正尝试平衡家中的一切确实很有意义。
But it just it made a lot of sense with doing the energy audits and really trying to balance everything out in the home.
我经常被问到，你们卖床垫吗？
I got a lot of, do you guys sell mattresses?
或者这是一家鞋业公司？
Or is this a shoe company?
不是。
No.
但当我解释我们的业务后，他们就会说，哦，明白了。
But once I explained what we did, they were like, oh, okay.
对。
Yeah.
这确实说得通。
That does make sense.
我要祝贺你四次登上Inc 5000榜单。
I wanna congratulate you on achieving the Inc 5,000 list four times.
这太棒了。
That's amazing.
是啊。
Yeah.
那真是疯狂。
That was wild.
2019到2023年是一段疯狂的时期，那时业务真正开始腾飞。
2019 to 2023 was a crazy time, and that's when the business really started to take off.
2019年我们加入了PG&E的低收入家庭节能改造项目。
So 2019, we got into the weatherization program, the low income weatherization program here with PG and E.
我们当时展望2020年时还在感叹，天啊。
And we were looking at 2020 and going, oh, man.
这将是非凡的一年。
This is gonna be amazing.
我们开始扩充团队。
We started to staff up.
我们开始为节能改造项目购置卡车。
We started buying trucks for weatherization.
说到购置卡车，我指的是那些价值3000美元的厢式货车，我们自己动手改装，整个过程全靠自力更生和最低限度的投入才得以实现。
Now when I say buying trucks, I mean $3,000 vans that we were outfitting ourselves, and it was a lot of bootstrapping and bare bones work that made that happen.
但没错，我们成功加入了节能改造项目，业务开始腾飞。
But, yeah, we got into the weatherization program and we started to take off.
当时我们展望2020年，预计能突破500万美元的营收。
So we were looking at 2020 thinking that we were gonna be able to exceed $5,000,000 in revenue.
2019年我们的营收是130万。
From 2019, we did 1.3.
进入2020年后，众所周知，疫情爆发了。
So we go into 2020, and as everyone knows, we had the pandemic hit.
2020年3月，太平洋煤气电力公司叫停了所有业务。
And in March 2020, PG and E said everything stops.
他们禁止我们进入客户家中——这点我能理解。
You cannot go into people's homes, which I get it.
这完全合情合理。
That makes total sense.
他们当然不想承担任何责任。
They don't want any liability there, of course.
于是25名员工，整个业务被迫停摆。
So 25 people, entire operation gets shut down.
我真的不想解雇任何人。
I don't really wanna lay anybody off.
我们被认定为必要行业。
We were deemed essential.
前一年我拿到了暖通空调承包商执照，没想到这么快就用上了。
The year prior, not realizing I would need it so soon, I'd gotten my HVAC contractor's license.
所以在2020年，我说好吧，咱们赌一把，看看结果如何。
And so 2020, I said, alright, let's roll the dice, let's see what happens.
我们转型进入暖通空调领域，并对原有的25名员工进行了培训。
And we launch into HVAC, and we get the 25 people that we had on staff trained.
他们大多数人都表示想学习并掌握这项技能，因为他们原本是从事房屋保温工作的，那可是地球上动手能力最强的一群人。
Most of them said, yeah, I wanna learn this and figure out how to do it, because they were weatherization guys, which those are the handiest people on the planet.
他们几乎能搞定家里任何维修工作，只是不够专业。
They can do virtually anything in the home, but they're not specialized.
所以安装整体式空调机组对他们来说并不算大跨越，因为他们已经具备所有工具。
And so installing a package unit wasn't a huge leap for them because they already had all the tools.
他们掌握了大量相关知识。
They had a lot of the knowledge.
这只是一个方法，以及背后的实施过程。
It was just a how, and then the process that went behind that.
于是我们开始安装暖通空调系统。
So we started installing HVAC.
我们聘请了一些暖通空调技术员来协助开展这类工作，业务逐渐起步。
We hired some HVAC technicians to help us going out and doing that kind of work, and it started to take off.
很大程度上要归功于我们的团队，但再次强调，这又回到了坚持不懈的精神上。
And a lot of it is due to the team that we had, but again, going back to that perseverance.
关闭业务不是可选项。
Shutting things down was not an option.
正因为这种心态，你会在过程中不断解决问题。
So because of that mindset, you just figure things out along the way.
所以我们坚持了下来，实际上在2020年超额完成了目标，因为最终节能改造项目恢复了。
So we pushed through and we actually exceeded our goal in 2020 because eventually the weatherization program came back.
节能改造项目在那年晚些时候恢复了。
So weatherization program came back later that year.
我们同时也在做暖通空调业务，业务开始真正腾飞。
We were doing HVAC as well, and things started to really take off.
这是我们快速增长阶段的开始。
That was the beginning of our rapid growth phase.
我们在Inc 5000榜单上的巅峰时期是2011年5月。
Our peak on the Inc 5,000 list was 05/2011.
对于不了解的人，Inc 5000是《Inc》杂志对私营企业及其三年营收的排名。
And for those that don't know, Inc 5,000 is Inc Magazine's ranking of privately held companies and their revenue over a three year period.
三年期间的收入增长。
So revenue growth over a three year period.
我记得现在的门槛是200万美元。
And I believe the threshold is 2,000,000 now.
这是你必须达到的最低收入标准。
That's the minimum revenue that you have to do.
在你那个时候，确实如此。
At your point, yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
于是我们从130万增长到550万，次年更是突破了1200万美元。
And so we went from 1.3 to 5.5, and then the year after that, we did over 12,000,000.
那真是相当疯狂。
And so it was pretty wild.
我们疯狂扩张，不断添置卡车。
We were growing like crazy, bringing on trucks.
我们当时招聘了各种类型的人才。
We were hiring all kinds of people.
我们达到了巅峰时期。
We had our peak.
从2020年初的25人团队，我们一度发展到133人。
We had a 133 people from 25 people at the beginning of 2020.
确实，那段经历让我们收获颇丰，吸取了很多教训，同时也充满了乐趣。
So, yeah, there was a lot that was learned there, a lot of lessons, and yeah, it was a lot of fun at that time as well.
True Tech曾登上过那份榜单。
True Tech appeared on the list.
虽然我们从未突破3500名的门槛，但七次入围榜单。
We never got above like the 3,500, but we were on the list seven times.
是啊。
Yeah.
能上榜本身就是一项成就，因为许多提交申请的公司最终都未能入选，而且上榜后也会面临诸多挑战。
Just getting on the list is an achievement because there's a lot of companies that submit that don't get on the list, and getting on that list comes with challenges.
我得说，当公司规模较小且处于增长阶段时，实现这种增长相对容易；而一旦规模扩大后，要继续保持那样的增长速度就困难多了，那时你面对的是惊人的数字。
I will say that it's easier to do when you're smaller and you're growing, as opposed to once you're larger to continue to hit that growth paces, like you're doing insane numbers at that point.
然后到了2023年，年中时PG&E公司取消了与我们的合作项目。
And then 2023, halfway through the year, PG and E pulled the program from us.
我们与供应商之间出现了分歧，他们因此实质上终止了该项目。
There was a disagreement between us and our supplier, and they essentially shut down the program due to that.
而就在那时，情况变得更具挑战性了。
And that's when things got much more challenging.
当时，我们大约50%的收入都来自那个项目。
And so we, at that time, were doing about 50% of our revenue through that program.
几乎一夜之间，这个项目就被我们失去了。
And just about overnight, we had that pulled out from under us.
那一年，尽管失去了这个项目，我们仍然实现了1700万美元的业绩。
That year, we ended up doing 17,000,000 even though we had that program pulled out from under us.
我们一直在努力，实际上我们原本的目标是将公司发展到3000万。
We were trying we had built the company up to actually try to get to 30.
那是我们那一年的目标。
That was our goal that year.
回想起来，那简直太疯狂了。
Looking back, that was just crazy.
但我们当时有足够的人力来实现它。
But we had the manpower to do that.
于是那段非常艰难的时期开始了。
So that began a very difficult time.
我们不仅失去了那个项目，那年晚些时候，我还失去了双亲。
Not only did we lose that program, but later that year, I actually lost both of my parents.
所以我花了很多时间陪伴他们，同时还要应对失去半数收入来源的挑战。
And so I was with them a lot, and at the same time trying to deal with the challenges in losing half of our income revenue stream.
2023年真是糟糕的一年。
'23 was a bad year.
到了2024年，我们尝试转型，把所有业务转向当时正在做的管道工程。
And then 2024, we tried to pivot and move everything over to we were doing plumbing at that time.
将所有业务转向管道和暖通空调领域，专注于恢复，实际上还冒险尝试了另一个节能改造项目，但最终效果不如之前的项目理想。
Move everything over to plumbing and HVAC and doing just recover, and actually rolled the dice with another weatherization program that didn't end up panning out as well as the other program had.
因此，我们的应收账款周期从PG&E的两到三周付款变成了这个新项目的六个月。
So our receivables went from getting paid about every two to three weeks from PG and E to six months with this other program.
我们手头有大量应收账款，却无力支付应付账款。
We had a huge amount of receivables and no way to pay our payables.
所以，是的，情况变得相当艰难。
And so, yeah, it got pretty difficult.
幸运的是，在24年年中时，我们找到了一位合作伙伴伸出援手，他们最终收购了公司。
Fortunately, midway through '24, we were able to find a partner that came in to help us out, and they ended up ultimately purchasing the company.
这对我们来说简直是救命稻草。
And that was a lifesaver for us.
这意义重大。
That was huge.
在他们的帮助下，我们得以顺利退出。
So was able to exit with their assistance.
但是，没错，那是一段艰难时期。
But, yeah, it was a tough time.
那确实是个巨大的挑战。
It was a real challenge.
所以
So
是啊。
Yeah.
我是说，找到那样的合作伙伴可能是个重大挑战。
I mean, that could be a big challenge finding something like that.
不过我有几个问题，听你讲述这些时让我感到好奇。
I've got a couple questions though that made me curious in there while you were talking about all this.
你在极短时间内招聘了大量员工。
You're bringing on a lot of employees in a really short period of time.
在这个过程中你遇到了哪些挑战？那种超高速增长带来了什么困难？
What are some of the challenges you found around doing that and really that super rapid growth in there?
招聘员工容易吗？不仅要招到人，还要招到能胜任这些岗位的优秀人才？
Was it easy to find employees and not only employees, but good quality employees to fill those spots?
是的。
Yeah.
这是个好问题。
That's a good question.
我一路走来学到的一点是，对我们三人来说，评估一个暖通空调技术员是否专业很容易。
So one of the things that I've learned along the way is for the three of us, it's easy for us to evaluate if an HVAC technician knows what they're doing.
你可以轻松地提问，给他们一套工具，就能判断他们是否懂行。
You can ask them pretty easily and hand them a set of tools and figure out if they know what they're talking about.
但会计或人力资源专业人员就不同了。
With accountants or HR professionals, not so much.
要判断他们是否真正精通自己的专业领域会困难得多。
It's harder to determine whether or not they really understand their craft or their trade, if you will.
所以我们录用的人，从简历和面试来看，都像是能胜任工作的。
And so we brought on people who, on paper and in meeting with them, seemed like they could handle the job properly.
有一年我们以为进入下一年时会有盈余。
There was one year that we thought that we were going into the next year that we had a surplus.
我们有大量收入需要花掉，因为我们盈利了，结果却发现——账目经过审计了吗？
We had tons of revenue that we needed to spend because we were profitable and come to find out, have the books audited?
没有。
No.
事实并非如此。
That was not the case.
实际上，情况恰恰相反。
Actually, the opposite was true.
这是我学到的重要一课：仅仅因为某人在会计或人力资源领域工作了一段时间，并不必然意味着他们擅长这份工作。
And so that's one of the things that was a big learning experience for me is just because you've got someone that's been in accounting or HR for a period of time, it doesn't necessarily mean that they're good at it.
虽然说出来显得很傻，但我太习惯于评估技术岗位，以至于忽视了如何评估一些办公室职位和行政人员。
And it seems silly to say that out loud, but I got so used to evaluating technical positions that I overlooked how to evaluate some of the office positions and the office staff.
如果没有完善的支持体系，事情就会变得更加困难。
And without that support structure in place, it makes things that much more difficult.
否则你以后会遇到意外情况，而这些本可以通过前期完善文件工作来避免。
Or you get surprises later on down the road that some paperwork could have cleaned up at the beginning.
我们在加州，只要有人对你使个眼色，你就能提起诉讼。
We're in California, so somebody looks at you the wrong way and you can file a lawsuit.
这太疯狂了。
It's insane.
我在这一方面学到的教训是：对错根本不重要，作为老板的你依然得支付律师费。
One of the things I've learned about that side is it does not matter if you're right, You still have to pay the attorney, you being the owner.
提起诉讼的人无需支付任何费用。
The person filing it doesn't have to pay anything.
他们那边是零风险。
There is zero risk on their end.
所以他们可以随意去起诉。
So they can go out and file.
律师会免费接手他们的案子，而你却要花钱请律师来证明自己是对的——这简直荒谬至极。
The attorney is just gonna pick up their case at for nothing, and you have to pay your attorney to prove that you're right and that it's wild.
所以，确保你有一支稳固的后勤支持团队对业务增长至关重要。
So, yeah, making sure that you've got a solid support staff in place is critical to that growth.
那么，经历这个过程后，你有没有发现什么特别好的方法或工具来甄选后勤支持人员，甚至是技术人员？
Well, going through that process, did you identify anything that you would really call out as good tools to identify people for that support staff, or even the technicians?
或者流程之类的。
Or process, whatever.
是的。
Yeah.
当然。
Sure.
我认为最重要的是，你不能害怕。
I think most importantly, you can't be afraid.
我觉得有些人会有这种心态——我自己遇到过这个问题，就假设别人也会遇到。
I think some people will get a mindset, I had this problem, so I'm assuming other people do as well.
你会觉得‘不，我很好’这种状态。
Where you think, no, I'm good.
我已经搞明白了。
I've got this figured out.
我对自己的工作有足够了解，能够应付。
I know enough about what I'm doing to handle it.
我不需要外界的帮助或支持。
I don't need outside assistance or support.
因为如果我当时请了会计或人力资源之外的第三方来查看情况，他们可能会说‘这些都乱套了’。
Because if I had brought in a third party who's not vested in the accounting side or the HR side to take a look at things and they went, hey, this is all messed up.
那本会非常有帮助。
That would have been very helpful.
那在当时对我本会极其有用。
That would have been extremely useful to me at the time.
在安装或技术方面，我觉得这对我们大多数人来说更容易些，因为如果我们熟悉那行工作，就能看出问题所在，或者通过跟车观察发现问题。
On the install or the technician side, I think that's easier for most of us just because if we're familiar with that line of work, we can see or we can do ride alongs and understand what's wrong there.
在这方面，如果有人不合适，那就是时候让他们离开了。
And on that side of things, if someone's not a good fit, then it's time to let them go.
态度远比能力重要。
Attitude is way more important than aptitude.
如果有人入职，他们在行业里摸爬滚打多年，技能非常过硬。
And someone comes in, they've been in the industry for a long time, they've got a really strong skill set.
但如果他们态度恶劣，就别留着了，这会传染给公司其他人。
If their attitude is garbage, don't hang on to them because it will infect the rest of the company.
一颗老鼠屎坏了一锅汤的说法再正确不过了。
And the one bad apple saying could not be more true.
这种经历我遇到过很多次。
I've been through that many times over.
所以我的另一条建议是：拖延解雇对谁都没好处。
So I think that's the other advice is that you're not doing anybody favors by waiting to let somebody go.
这些见解相当深刻，我觉得。
Some pretty powerful insights there, think.
接着说，你现在在做些不同的事情。
Moving on, you're doing something different now.
你说你在24年退出了，是吗？
You said you exited in '24, was it?
实际上，是在25年出售了业务。
Actually, sold the business at the '25.
25年。
'25.
好的。
Okay.
大约一个半月前，我和新业主谈过，说，嘿，我完全退出公司会是什么情况？
And then about a month and a half ago, I talked to the new owners and said, hey, what does it look like for me to fully exit the company?
因为我最初以总经理身份留任，后来担任管道经理。
Because I'd stayed on as initially general manager and then plumbing manager.
新业主们非常棒。
And the new owners were great.
他们为我们，尤其是我个人做了很多，我感激不尽。
They did a lot for us, for me personally, and I can't thank them enough.
但我逐渐看清了自己的热情所在，那些我真正享受做的事情，我想过去一年左右的时间帮助我认清了这些。
But I just kinda seen where I was passionate, the things that I really enjoyed doing, and I guess the last year or so helped me realize what those were.
对我来说，这一直是关于营销的——与客户沟通，真正理解客户心理需求，并帮助他们理解所提供的服务。
And it's always been about marketing for me, communicating to the customer, really understanding what the psychology of what customers are looking for, and helping translate what services are offered to them.
所以这一直是我的热情所在。
And so that's something that has always been a passion of mine.
我一直在内部告诉大家，嘿，虽然我以为自己还会拥有Balance Comfort，但我下一个想创办的企业会是家营销公司。
I've been telling people just internally, hey, the next business that I wanna start, thinking that I would still own Balance Comfort, the next business that I wanna start would be a marketing firm.
这听起来就让我觉得非常有趣。
It just sounds like a lot of fun to me.
于是我决定这就是我想做的事。
And I decided that's what I wanna do.
这就是我现在的状态。
So that's where I'm at now.
公司叫什么名字？
What do you call the company?
新公司名为Sequoia Geo，拼写是g e o。
New company is called Sequoia Geo and that's g e o.
geo实际上代表生成引擎优化（generative engine optimization），类似于大多数人熟悉的SEO（搜索引擎优化）。
And the geo actually stands for generative engine optimization, which is how it's kinda like most people are familiar with SEO, which is search engine optimization.
GEO是关于如何在AI引擎中提升排名的。
GEO is how to rank for AI engines.
所以这并不一定是重点，只是个有趣的名字，而且正好可用。
And so that's not necessarily the focus, it was just a fun name and it was available.
不过，是的，我们经常与AI打交道，这也是我在过去一年到一年半里观察到的新趋势，我感觉自己有点落后了。
But, yeah, we work with AI quite a bit and that was something else that I was seeing happening over the past year, year and a half, and I felt like I was falling behind.
所以我创办SequoiaGeo的动机之一，就是能真正深入并更好地掌握AI技术，理解它对行业乃至未来意味着什么。
So one of my motivations for starting SequoiaGeo was so that I could really dive into and get a better handle on AI, what that means for the industry, and really the future.
这个过程非常有趣。
That's been a lot of fun.
听起来这是最近才发生的事。
It sounds pretty recent.
我看到你们确实有个网站，我们会确保把它放在节目说明里。
So I see you do have a website, and we'll make sure we put that in the show notes.
是的。
Yeah.
非常感谢。
Appreciate that.
你们有客户了吗？
Do you have customers?
我就直说了。
I'll just be blunt.
有的。
Yeah.
实际上我们现在有两个客户。
We actually have two customers right now.
其中一个是朋友介绍的。
One was a referral from a friend of mine.
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他们在蒙大拿州，实际上是一家设备拍卖公司。
They're out in Montana, and they're actually an equipment auction company.
这个业务挺有意思的。
It's kind of an interesting business.
还有一家我们正在合作的窗户公司。
And then there's a window company that we're working with as well.
所以目前我们已经启动了两家客户。
And so we've got two that we've gotten started with right now.
我还有几家感兴趣的在谈。
I've got a few others that are interested.
我的做法是从承包商的角度出发。
And my approach is that from a contractor standpoint.
我曾经是承包商，现在转做市场营销。
I was a contractor, and now I'm doing marketing.
再次说明，这是进入新行业的非传统方式，就像我之前带着Hirsch评级进入暖通行业那样。
Again, another non traditional approach to a new industry, like what I had done with Hirsch ratings going into HVAC.
我能设身处地站在业主的角度思考，理解他们的处境。
I can see and put myself in the owner's shoes and look at, okay, I understand where they are.
从营销角度来看，这是我们需要做的。
Here's what we need to do from a marketing standpoint.
基于此，我会给出这样的建议，并采取相应策略。
Here's what I would recommend based off of that, and take that approach to it.
那么假设今天有人访问你的网站，整个互动流程会是怎样的？
So say somebody lands on your site today, what happens like in the process, the engagement process?
所以他们主动联系了。
So they reach out.
我会先收集一些基本信息，然后深入进行一些分析。
I'm gonna get some basic information to start, and then I get to dive in and do some analysis.
这是我能与建筑科学紧密相关的一点——有海量数据需要我为客户挖掘调查，了解他们在网络上的表现情况、呈现方式、哪些方面强或弱，重点确实在于本地化，主要是针对搜索引擎优化，以及他们如何展现。
That's one of the things that I can relate really closely to building science is there's tons and tons of data that I get to dig through and investigate for customers to understand if they're showing up online, how they're showing up, what areas are strong or weak, and focusing really on the focus is local, mostly for search engine optimization and, yeah, how they show up.
所以我需要做大量工作，虽不完全是测试，但对公司进行研究和调查。
So I get to do a lot of, not quite testing, but research and investigation on a company.
我可以对此深入研究，这让我非常享受。
And I get to geek out about that, which I really enjoy.
所以真正要做的是打好基础。
So really establishing a foundation.
然后从那里出发，你想把公司带向何方？
And then from there, it's where do you wanna go with a company?
并了解，我们是否打算保持小规模？
And understanding, are we intending to keep this small?
我们预计每天要增加多少通电话？
How many calls are we looking to add a day?
你希望从这里走向哪里？
Where do you wanna go from here?
因为经历过增长阶段，我可以引导他们说，要实现这个目标需要做到这些，看看这是否真的是他们想做的。
Because having done the growth, I can help guide them and say, well, this is what it's gonna take in order to do that, and see if that's really what they're interested in doing.
你给出的建议，之前你提到过客户教育。
The advice you give, you talked earlier about customer education.
这是否也是你热衷钻研并试图转化为营销语言的部分？
Is that part of the what you geek out on and then try to translate into the marketing language?
是的。
Yes.
在与企业沟通方面，确实如此。
In terms of speaking to businesses, is.
实际上，更多时候需要的是从企业到他们的客户、再到业主的翻译转换。
Really, the translation is often more times necessary from the business to their customers, to a homeowner.
在这方面，很多时候是要识别出他们以为正在发生、但实际上并未发生的情况。
On this side, it's a lot of times, it's identifying what they thought was happening that actually isn't happening.
遗憾的是，这种情况非常普遍。
And that's very common, unfortunately.
我会给你一个最基础的例子，那就是谷歌商家资料。
And I'll give you probably the most basic example, and that's the Google Business Profile.
熟悉谷歌商家资料的人都知道，这是谷歌为你设置的一个非常基础的页面，需要你去完善内容。
For those familiar with their Google Business Profile, they understand that this is a very basic page that is set up by Google for you that you go and build out.
你必须认领它。
You've gotta claim it.
但大多数人忽视的是，那个页面没有优化。
But where most people miss is that that page is not optimized.
这是谷歌的产品。
And this is a Google product.
这是他们的。
This is theirs.
它没有得到应有的优化。
And it's not getting optimized in the manner it should.
所以你没有足够清晰地向谷歌说明你的业务。
And so you're not telling Google what you do clear enough.
这就是我看到很多人忽视的地方，因为你可以在谷歌商家档案上发帖，但很少有公司这么做。
And that's where I see a lot of people miss, because you can post on Google Business Profile, very few companies do that.
最近我发现，我在与一家泳池公司合作时，他们网站链接是错的。
I've seen recently, I was working with a pool company, the link to their website was wrong.
那个域名不是他们的。
The domain wasn't their domain.
它链接到了菲律宾的一个垃圾网站。
It was to like a spammy site out of The Philippines.
我甚至不知道那里发生了什么。
I I don't even know what happened there.
但这些全都是你向谷歌发送的信号。
But these are all signals that you're sending to Google.
如果你的谷歌商家资料设置不正确，谷歌就会对你的企业失去信任。
And if your Google business profile isn't set up correctly, Google loses trust in your business.
如果谷歌不信任你，他们就不会把你展示给客户。
And if Google doesn't trust you, they're not going to show you to customers.
所以你可以做所有页面SEO工作，写文章，确保关键词都正确无误等等。
So you can do all of the on page SEO work, writing articles, getting all your keywords right, everything else.
但如果你的谷歌商家资料没有优化，那就相当于你漏掉了最基础的步骤。
But if your Google business profile isn't optimized, it's like the most basic step that you're missing.
很多时候，我只需看一眼就能大致了解情况，判断他们是否真正关注业务动态。
That's oftentimes just looking at that, I can get a sense of what's going on and if they're really tuned into what's happening with the business or not.
我认为关键在于，你在不同阶段确实执行了自认为应该做的事，通过外部视角审视内部运作，从而要么验证假设，要么消除误解。
I think it's that you actually are doing what you thought you should have done at different points, having an outside view of what's going on inside so that either assumptions are confirmed or just fallacies are dispelled.
是的。
Yeah.
这与客户在家中的体验并无二致。
It's not unlike what customers experience in their home.
空调运转良好。
The AC runs well.
对。
Yeah.
但其他方面呢？
But what about all these other things?
它实际运行的效率究竟如何？
What efficiency is it actually running at?
在客户营销及其营销支出方面，你同样需要审视。
In terms of customers marketing and their marketing spend, you look at it the same way.
你每月在SEO上投入多少资金？
How many dollars are you putting into SEO a month?
而目前你实际从中获得了什么？
And what are you actually getting out of it right now?
因为对大多数承包商来说，这不是他们熟悉的领域。
Because for most contractors, this is not something they're familiar with.
这是他们的黑匣子。
This is their black box.
他们不知道它应该是什么样子。
They don't know what it should be.
并不是说它过于复杂。
And it's not that it's overly complicated.
只是他们从未接受过这方面的培训。
It's just that it's not something that they've ever been trained on.
对大多数公司而言，这正是存在巨大机遇的地方，值得深入挖掘——即便他们已有代理机构，或认为有人已负责此事，仍有优化和改进的空间。
That's where there's a huge opportunity for most companies to really dig into this, even though they have an agency, even though they have somebody they think has taken care of it, there's opportunities there that could be fine tuned or improved.
我在你们网站上看到，你们通过博客公开分享发现与见解，同时也帮助验证了自身的专业能力。
And I see on your website, you're openly sharing with a blog your discoveries or insights with others and helping to validate your expertise too.
不。
No.
我认为教育同样如此，这与我过去在客户家中采取的服务方式如出一辙。
I think that education and it's the same approach that I would take with customers when I was in their home.
我正努力教育他们，让他们理解这一点，无论他们是否与我合作。
I'm trying to educate them so that they understand it, whether or not they work with me.
我不希望他们出去买一个过大的系统，因为你不需要五吨的设备。
I don't want them to go out and get an oversized system, because you don't need a five ton.
这栋房子不需要五吨的系统。
This house doesn't need a five ton system.
安装过大的设备反而会有害。
Putting on would be detrimental.
营销也是如此，公司如何分配营销预算以及他们拉动哪些杠杆来促进增长或识别正确的客户。
It's the same way with marketing and where companies are spending their marketing and what levers they're pulling to help them grow or identify the right customer.
那么当你现在与企业及AI或大型语言学习模块合作时，你观察到这些企业、AI与消费者之间的关系变化速度如何？毕竟消费者才是你们最终想要触达的目标。
So when you're working with companies and AI or large language learning modules today, how fast are you seeing those relationships changing between companies, the AI, and the consumer really is where you're trying to get to ultimately.
对吧？
Right?
通过这种方式连接承包商和消费者。
Connect that contractor and the consumer through that.
是的。
Yeah.
现在市面上有很多声音说，你需要改变策略来专注于在ChatGPT中的排名。
And there's a lot out there right now that, oh, you need to change what you're doing to focus on ranking in chat GBT.
根据我所接触的所有资料，我发现很多之前在谷歌上表现良好的做法，在这些AI引擎上同样适用。
From everything that I'm consuming, material wise, I'm finding that a lot of what you were doing before to do really good on Google is gonna be similar to what we'll do really good on these AI engines.
无论是ChatGPT、Perplexity还是其他任何平台。
So on ChatGPT, or Perplexity, or whichever one it is.
但这一变化非常迅速。
But that is evolving very fast.
新的——我不想说是功能，而是新的机遇每天都在涌现。
And new, I don't wanna say features, but new opportunities are evolving daily.
我认为这为承包商利用AI技术开辟了机会，他们可以在实际工作中运用这些工具，并在网站上展示使用成果。
And I think it opens up opportunities in terms of AI for contractors to start leveraging these things and utilizing them in the field, and then actually showing how they're using it on their site.
我有个朋友开始使用一款叫Plod的工具。
I've got a friend of mine that he started using, I think it's the Plod.
就是那个做笔记的。
It's the note taker.
就是可以夹在身上的那种。
The thing you clip on.
对。
Yeah.
没错。
Yeah.
他开始使用那个了。
He started using that.
他的公司叫Julian。
His company's called Julian.
他会是个不错的嘉宾，你们可能认识他。
And he would be a good guest for you guys know him probably.
Jason？
Jason?
Jason。
Jason.
是的。
Yeah.
他已经上过节目了。
He's been on already.
哦，太棒了。
Oh, awesome.
明白了。
Gotcha.
是的。
Yeah.
你们确实请过他了。
You did.
那太好了。
That's great.
但他没怎么提Plaud。
But he didn't talk about Plaud too much.
对。
Yeah.
他前几天在我的一条帖子下留言说一直在用Plaud，这太棒了，因为它能记录家里所有的谈话内容。
So he commented on a post of mine the other day that he's been using Plaud, and that's fantastic because it tracks everything that you're talking about in the home.
如果能把这些信息放到网站上，AI会非常喜欢。
If you can take that information and then put it on your website, AI will love that.
AI非常喜欢结构化的内容。
AI really likes structure.
所以如果你能用项目符号或列表呈现，AI会更容易抓取这些信息。
So if you can put in bullet points or lists, AI likes to pick up on those things.
但它同时也会寻找故事性和大量内容，因为我们的搜索方式正在改变。
But it's also gonna be looking for stories and a lot of the content Because the way that we're searching is changing.
我们的搜索方式，对部分人而言是当下，而对更多人来说将是六个月后。
How we search for things, for some of us it's now, and then for more of us it's gonna be six months from now.
我们从‘附近的管道工’变成了‘我的浴室有管道问题’，这种长句子或冗长的问题。
We've gone from plumbers near me to I have a plumbing problem in my bathroom, this long sentence or drawn out question.
现在，如果你的网站上有些内容能紧密匹配那些更长的提问形式，你就会更频繁地出现。
Now, if you have something on your site that closely matches those longer form questions, you're gonna start to show up more often.
利用AI工具从现场提取数据并在线展示，实际上会帮助你获得更好的排名。
And using AI tools to pull data from the field to display it online is actually gonna help you rank better.
因此，将其中部分内容转化过来是关键。
And so it's getting some of that translated over is key.
非常有用的信息。
Very good info.
你刚才提到的关于Plaud的事，我知道有Plaud，还有几个类似的设备，本质上都是在监听对话。
Something you brought up there about Plaud, and I know there's Plaud, there's I think a couple other similar devices out there that are essentially listening to conversations.
就隐私问题而言，你发现了什么？
What are you finding as far as privacy concerns around that?
人们是否必须明确指出他们在录音？
Are people having to actually point out that they're recording while they're doing that?
尤其是进入别人家里时，我能理解这可能是一些人担心的问题。
Or especially going into people's homes, I can see where maybe that would be a concern to some people.
确实如此。
Absolutely.
这也是我之前向他提出的问题。
And, it was a question that I had posed to him.
这还取决于你所在州的法律。
It will also depend on the laws in your state.
有些州会要求双方都同意说'是的，可以在这里录音'。
Some states are gonna require both parties to say, yeah, it's okay to record the audio here.
所以我认为最佳做法是告知客户，'嘿，这对你有帮助'。
So I think the best practice is to let your customers know, hey, this is helpful.
这会让体验变得更好。
This is gonna make this for a much better experience.
然后你确实需要确保制定了完善的隐私政策，因为这也确实会引发一些担忧。
And then you really need to make sure that you've got a good privacy policy in place and an established privacy policy because that does raise some concerns as well.
但我认为对客户坦诚相告是最重要的，让他们知道'嘿，事情是这样的'。
But I think being upfront and honest about it with a customer is the most important thing and letting them know, hey, here's what's happening.
因为如果他们事后才发现，对你来说会很不利。
Because if they find out after the fact, it's not gonna work out well for you.
这样不好。
It's not good.
我认为在这种情况下坦诚至关重要。
I think being upfront is critical there.
听起来是个很靠谱的建议。
Sounds like some solid advice to me.
我是说，和其他事情一样。
I mean, works like anything else.
如果你要去客户家里，告诉他们你要做什么。
If you're going into a customer's house, tell them what you're gonna do.
如果弄坏了东西，意外难免发生，要提前告知，第一时间说明情况，承认错误，并确保会妥善修复。
If you break something, accidents happen, tell them upfront, tell them first thing, hey, we screwed up, we're gonna make sure it's fixed and fixed right.
是的。
Yeah.
当你遇到这些新情况时，如果始终坚持记录并消化这些信息，你的流程就会变得更严谨。也许你会在开始前准备一份简短声明，因为从前两次工作中吸取的经验会对未来产生影响。
And when you do encounter those new situations, if you are always recording and digesting these things, then your processes get tighter, and maybe you have a little disclosure statement before you go in because you learned something two jobs ago that has impact going forward.
我们当时正在进行一些工程，承包商列出了一长串免责事项。
We were having some work done, and the contractor has a very long list of things that are excluded.
他说：'这些情况很可能不会发生，但如果真的发生了，这些都在免责范围内。'
He said, These aren't going to happen, probably, but if they do, these are excluded.
他学会了如何避免惹上麻烦。
He's learned to keep himself out of trouble.
是啊，而且很可能是吃过苦头才学会的。
Yeah, and likely learned the hard way.
没错。
Yeah.
所以要把这些用惨痛教训换来的经验转化为未来的价值，让它们变得有意义。
So take those lessons that you've learned the hard way and make them valuable in the future so that this thing is worth something.
对。
Yeah.
这提供了很多机会，比如可以把内容导入聊天工具，获取转录文本后从中获得反馈。
It opens up a lot of opportunity to take that, dump it into, say, chat, take the transcript, put it into chat, and then get feedback from chat.
这里有哪些可以改进的地方？
What could be better here?
我该如何提升？
How could I improve?
随着时间的推移，你就能从这一切中提炼出这个提示。
And then over time, you've got this prompt from all of this.
你可以基于所有这些客户互动，打造出自己定制的GPT模型，这只是利用它变得更智能的一种方式。
You've got your own custom GPT that you can build out based on all of these customer interactions, and that's just leveraging it to become smarter.
在我们结束这次录音之际（对你来说是早晨，对我们则是下午），你有什么想对听众说的结语吗？
As we wrap up here on this recording, morning for you, afternoon for us, What closing thoughts would you like to leave for our listeners?
首先，非常感谢能有机会来到这里。
First of all, thank you very much for the opportunity to be here.
非常感谢。
Appreciate it.
谢谢您的时间。
Thank you for your time.
是的。
Yeah.
我认为结语应该是：像检查房屋那样审视你的业务，尤其是营销策略，并开始做一些诊断分析。
And I think closing thoughts is inspect your business the way that or your marketing in particular, the way that you would inspect a home, and start doing some diagnostics.
因为市面上确实有很多价格实惠，甚至免费的工具。
Because there's really affordable, sometimes free tools out there.
其中不少还提供14天的试用期。
A number of them come with a fourteen day trial.
你可以在自己的网站上测试这些工具，检查网站速度、排名等这类指标。
You can test stuff out on your website, check the speed, check your ranking, things of that nature.
如果你想发展业务，这些工具对实现目标至关重要，同时也不要忽视基础工作。
And if you're looking to grow, those are essential to doing those things, and don't overlook the basics.
太棒了。
Excellent.
感谢你的参与，亚伦。
Thank you for joining us, Aaron.
祝你好运连连。
Wish you lots of luck.
未来一年左右你会参加什么会议或活动吗？我们或其他人有机会见到你吗？
Be attending any conferences or anything where we might see you, others might see you in the coming year or so?
我真的很喜欢参加各种会议。
I really enjoy going to the conferences.
我得查查日程安排，看看我们这边海岸附近有没有即将举办的活动。随着业务的逐步建立，我肯定会寻求拓展并与更多人合作。
I'll have to check the schedule and see if there's anything on our coast coming up, but I'll definitely be, as I'm getting this established, be looking to branch out and work with more people.
听起来不错。
So sounds good.
太好了。
Excellent.
在你离开前简单问一下，如果有人需要联系你，有什么方式能找到你呢？
And real quick before you leave, what's a way somebody can get a hold of you if they need to?
如果他们访问我的网站sequoiageo.com，这可能是找到我最便捷的方式。
So if they go to my website sequoiageo.com, that's probably the easiest way to find me.
我在Facebook上也很活跃，账号是Aaron Husock，最近也开始在LinkedIn上频繁发帖。
I'm also very active on Facebook under Aaron Husock or I'm started posting more on LinkedIn as well.
以上任一方式都是联系我的好途径。
But any one of those would be a good way to reach out.
好的，非常感谢你的询问。
So, yeah, appreciate you asking.
太棒了。
Excellent.
再次感谢。
Thanks again.
谢谢大家。
Thank you, guys.
谢谢，亚伦。
Thanks, Aaron.
保重。
Take care.
感谢收听本期与亚伦·胡萨克的对话。
Thanks for tuning in this episode with Aaron Husak.
我们讨论了平衡舒适区、残酷教训、规模化发展以及借助AI重新开始等话题。
We talked about balanced comfort, brutal lessons, scaling, and starting over with AI.
如果您正在寻找播客中提到的任何工具或测试仪器，或者只是泛泛而谈，不妨看看trutechtools.com提供的产品。
If you're in the market for any tools or test instruments mentioned in the podcast or just in general, take a look at what trutechtools.com has to offer.
Trutechtools.com。
Trutechtools.com.
您可以使用优惠码hvacbs，在大多数商品上享受不错的折扣。
And you can use the offer code h v a c b s for a nice discount on most products.
如有任何疑问或想推荐话题，请联系marketing@TruTechTools.com。
If you have any questions or wanna suggest a topic, reach out to us at marketing@TruTechTools.com.
请注意，我们讨论的某些话题需要专业技术培训才能正确理解或安全执行。
And please note some of the topics we discuss require technical training for proper interpretation or safe execution.
所以如果您是受过训练的专业人士，可以立即行动。
So if you're a trained pro, you can proceed immediately.
如果不是，请咨询并聘请专业人士。
If you're not, please consult with and hire a pro.
《建筑HVAC科学》播客由Tru Tech Tools有限公司制作。
The Building HVAC Science podcast is a production of Tru Tech Tools Limited.
特此声明，我是Tru Tech公司的所有者。
In full disclosure, I'm the owner of Tru Tech.
所表达的观点取决于发言者，可能来自我的嘉宾、我的共同主持人或我自己。
The opinions expressed to those of my guests, my cohost, or myself, depending on who is speaking, of course.
感谢您收听本期播客，并期待您再次收听《建筑暖通科学》播客的更多内容。
I wanna thank you for tuning into this podcast and hope you come back again to listen to more of the Building HVAC Science podcast.
保重。
Take care.
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