贾斯汀·西尔维斯特谈泰勒与特拉维斯、碧昂斯、梅根·马克尔以及为何混乱总能胜出

现在就去 pira.com 享受三十天无风险试用。

Try it risk free for thirty days now at pira.com.

那就是 pira, pura,.com。

That's pira, pura,.com.

我超级喜欢 Justin Sylvester，他是 Justin 和 Kelty 评选颁奖季节目的另一半，今天他来庆祝这一年的流行文化。

I absolutely love Justin Sylvester, the better half of Justin and Kelty take award season, is here to celebrate the year in pop culture.

今年流行文化中最重要的事情就是 Justin 推出了我认为是今年最标志性的播客——Yestergaze。

Now the most important thing that happened this year in pop culture is that Justin launched, I think, the most iconic podcast of the year, Yestergaze.

Justin，跟我们说说 Yestergaze 吧，你们都做些什么？

Justin, tell us about Yestergaze, what you guys do.

它已经演变了。

It has morphed.

最初的构想是某种东西。

The original idea was something.

现在它已经演变了，你们俩正在走红。

Now it's morphed, and you guys are going viral.

每次我看视频时，我都觉得，哇，这个比Lady Gang还要火。

Every time I watch a video, I'm like, oh, this has so much pop more popular than Lady Gang.

首先，我管《Yestergaze》叫我的有氧运动，因为我的播客主持人嘴皮子太厉害了，我都不知道他接下来会说什么。

The first of all, Yesterday's, I call it my cardio because my podcast host has a tongue on him, and I don't know what the he's gonna say.

所以我通常就坐在那儿。

So I'm normally sitting there.

我的心率都飙到120了，天啊。

My BPMs, my heart rate is at, one twenty, bitch.

就像我在跑马拉松一样。

Like, I'm running a marathon

但《Yestergaze》原本是个回顾过去的播客，我们讨论2000年代和2010年代初期有多疯狂。

with this

那时候真是那个劲儿。

but Yesterday's was supposed to be a podcast where we look at the past and talk about how the early two thousands and twenty tens were really that girl.

那时候真是那个劲儿。

They were that bitch.

我们仍然会做这件事，但现在我们会讨论更多当下的事情。

And we still do that, but now we talk about more current things.

这个播客对我来说已经有点变成每日流行资讯了。

And the podcast has kinda turned into daily pop for me a little bit.

它又回到了那种早期的日间节目风格。

It's it's going back to that that, you know, early daytime.

我们来聊聊这个。

Let's talk about it.

我们深入谈谈吧。

Let's get into it.

我对自己的表现相当满意。

And I'm pretty impressed with myself.

我会听自己的播客。

I listen to my podcast.

我从不听自己说话。

I never listen to myself.

但我的播客，OW。

But my podcast, OW.

然后笑了。

And laughs.

真棒。

Good for you.

太好了。

It's so good.

嗯。

Yeah.

很棒。

It's great.

那就是你知道它很棒的时候。

That's when you know it's good.

确实很棒。

It really is great.

你可以听一下。

You can listen no.

真的很棒。

It's great.

昨天的节目，我喜欢的是你们一直紧扣主题。

Yesterday's and what I like about it is you guys stay on the topic.

比如，你们说点什么，然后围绕它展开，接着就继续往下走。

Like, you you say something and then you do your bit on it and then you move on.

你们很少有那种松散的内容，我觉得这就是你们的BPN这么高的原因，贾斯汀。

There's not a lot of, like, loose I think that's why your b p n is so high, Justin.

很少有那种让人觉得‘哦，这部分有点无聊’的松散结尾。

There's not a lot of, like, loose ends where you're like, oh, this got a little boring.

它直接用幽默、深刻又荒诞的内容砸在你头上。

It's like, it's literally hitting you over the head with funny, thoughtful, ridiculous.

真的很棒。

It's great.

所以昨天的《Lady Gang》，如果你在找点什么听，你们的播出日是哪天？

So yesterday's, Lady Gang, if you're looking for something to listen to what what day is your day

今天？

today?

星期二。

Tuesdays.

不是。

No.

《Lady Gang》还不错。

Lady Gang's okay.

听完《Lady Gang》之后，你可以听《Yestergays》。

So after you listen to Lady Gang, you can listen to Yestergays.

你知道我们该做什么吗？

You know what we should do?

我们干脆就把它做成一个旁支播客系列吧。

We just we should just start dropping them as a tangent feed.

是的。

Yeah.

我们应该。

We should.

也。

Too.

我爱这个。

I love that.

是的。

Yeah.

砰。

Boom.

砰。

Boom.

我们完全

We totally

本该很棒的。

shouldn't be great.

你不必回答，但我总是忍不住笑，因为你知道，我们当时也有个节目叫《Lady Gang》，和《Pop Daily Pop》差不多同期播出。

You don't have to answer it, but I always giggle because, you know, we had our show Lady Gang on e around the same time that pop Daily Pop was around.

我的意思是，你们的寿命远远超过了我们。

I mean, you guys outlasted us way beyond.

但你们的《Daily Pop》播客收入比当年做电视节目时还高吗？

But are you making more money on your podcast version of Daily Pop than you ever did on the TV show?

但愿如此。

I wish.

但愿如此。

I wish.

你会的。

You will.

我希望如此。

I hope.

你会的。

You will.

我真的真的这么希望。

I really I really do.

我希望他们能真正解决这个问题。

I hope they really figure this out.

你知道，我觉得我们现在正处于一个绝佳的时机。

You know, I feel like we're in a sweet spot.

唯一的问题是，如果你听播客，就会明白这一点。

And the only thing is and if you listen to the podcast, you'll get this.

我的播客搭档讨厌所有人。

My podcast cohost hates everybody.

比如，他讨厌每一个

Like, he hates every

那种？

that like?

身体。

Body.

我觉得穷，因为他讨厌亚马逊。

I feel broke because we he hates Amazon.

他讨厌塔吉特。

He hates Target.

他讨厌沃尔玛。

He hates Walmart.

他讨厌这个。

He hates this.

他讨厌那个。

He hates that.

我说，

I'm like,

你必须做出选择。

you have to choose.

品牌。

Brands.

他讨厌品牌。

He hates brands.

我就像，你必须做出选择。

I'm like, you have to choose.

所以他也很讨厌身体。

So he hates body too.

他讨厌钱。

He hates money.

他只需要继续讨厌名人，而热爱品牌。

He needs to just keep the hate towards the celebrities and then the love of the brands.

这就是你接受脏钱的方式。

Here's how you accept dirty money.

这就是你接受脏钱的方式。

Here's how you accept dirty money.

我确实这么做

I do

一直都在这么做。

it all the time.

我。

Me.

你拿这笔钱，因为事情是这样的。

You take that money because here's the thing.

我们为什么要把钱交给错误的人？

Why do we want money going in the hands of the wrong people?

这是一个恶性循环。

It's a vicious cycle.

如果你不开始接受这些脏钱，你就无法积累自己的财富，也就无法用你的财富去做善事。

If you don't start taking that dirty money, then you can't start building your own wealth to then do good things with your own wealth.

然后你可以用你自己的财富，捐给你真正相信的机构。

And then you can take your own wealth, and then you can make your donations to the places that you truly believe in.

你只是坐在那里，不拿那些反正会落入他人之手的脏钱，这并不能帮助任何人。

By sitting back and not collecting the dirty money that's gonna go to somebody anyway, you're not helping anybody.

你只是穷困潦倒。

You're just broke.

我同意。

I agree.

谢谢。

Thank you.

我喜欢脏钱。

I'm I'm into dirty money.

是的。

Yeah.

我爱脏钱。

I love dirty money.

全是脏日子。

It's all dirty days.

你能买到的最肮脏的钱。

Dirtiest money you can buy.

全都肮脏。

It's all dirty.

污秽不堪。

Filthy.

我知道。

I know.

每次我都想，贾斯汀，你知道对你来说，什么样的品牌合作会特别棒吗？

Every time I'm like, Justin, you know what would be, like, such a great brand for you to partner with?

我会看到布莱克利的视频，然后是可口可乐。

I'll see a video of Blakely being like, and then Coca Cola.

我心想，天啊。

And I'm like, damn.

不行。

No.

贾斯汀需要支付他的房贷。

Justin needs to pay his mortgage.

好吧。

Okay.

行了。

Alright.

我现在带你们回到一月，给你们看贾斯汀的选择。

I'm taking you all back to January, and I'm giving you Justin's choice.

以下是我们在一月需要记住的三件事。

Here are the three things we would like to remember from January.

梅根·马克尔有了新节目。

Meghan Markle has a new show.

休·杰克曼和萨顿·福斯特做了我们一直以为他们会做的事——宣布他们在一起了。

Hugh Jackman and Sutton Foster did what we thought they were doing the whole time, announced that they're together.

嗯。

Mhmm.

海蒂·蒙塔格有一首冠军流行歌曲。

And Heidi Montag has a number one pop hit.

操。

Bitch.

天啊，一月真是疯狂。

Man, January was wild.

还有火灾，杰西卡·辛普森离婚了，这标志着布莱克、罗恩·布莱克和贾斯汀的开始。

And the fires, and Jessica Simpson got divorced, and it was the start of Blake and Ron Blake and Justin.

贾斯汀·巴尔多尼。

Justin Baldoni.

天啊。

Jesus.

不是。

No.

当时有点这样的传闻。

That was going around a little bit.

TikTok 停机了十四个小时。

And TikTok went dark for fourteen hours.

你还记得 TikTok 消失的那次吗？

Remember when TikTok went away?

哦，对啊。

Oh, yeah.

天啊。

Oh my god.

真是太遗憾了。

It was a shame.

把一切都偷走了。

Stole everything.

第一个是什么

What was the first one

你说的？

you said?

梅根有了自己的节目。

Megan getting her own show.

是的。

Yes.

我认为，老实说，一开始就应该做特别节目。

Which I think, honestly, it should have been specials.

从第一天起就应该是特别节目。

It should have been specials from day one.

是的。

Yes.

我不需要一整季八集的梅根。

I don't need a full eight episode, Megan.

我需要的是米妮·凯林来两小时，你最喜欢的厨师来一趟，看看那些孩子的后脑勺，去鸡舍转转，卖我一瓶酒，我就满足了。

What I need is two hours of Mindy Kaling coming in, your favorite chef coming in, seeing the back of those kids' heads, going to the chicken coop, you know, sell me a bottle of wine, and I'm done.

我最不需要的，就是连续八小时提醒我你有多无聊、根本不了解自己。

The last thing I need is a reminder for eight hours that you're boring and don't know who you are.

对不起。

I'm sorry.

阿门。

Amen.

对不起。

I'm sorry.

我但

I But

我仍然在看。

I still watch it.

本该做节日特辑的。

Should've done the holiday specials.

比如，我想坐在这里，把它当背景播放，梅根·马克尔的节日特辑。

Like, I want to sit here and put it on the background, the Meghan Markle holiday special.

然后我会看一个万圣节特辑。

And then I would take a Halloween special.

我会选一个夏至特辑。

I would take a summer solace special.

哦，就像，

Oh, like,

我，我，一个特辑。

I I a special.

等等。

Wait.

等等，你这么说其实很有道理，因为如果她不想在电视上展现真实的自己，这就是最好的方式——拍个特辑。

This is actually you're you're, like, really making a lot of sense because if she wants to not have to be her true self on TV, that is the way to do it, a special.

我的意思是，我不是说像朱莉安·赫夫这样的人真的在这么做，因为我知道她性格开朗又迷人。

I mean, I I'm not saying this is what, like, people like Julianne Huff are doing because I know she has a sparkly wonderful personality.

但当她拍特辑时，你就会觉得，哦，一个穿着漂亮裙子、笑容甜美的女孩。

But, like, when she does specials, you're just kinda like, oh, a pretty girl in a pretty dress with, like, a a good smile.

我们根本不会走进她的厨房，和她那些假惺惺的好朋友聊天。

Like, we don't get in her kitchen and talk to her with her fake best friends.

我不是说她真有这些朋友，但你说得对。

Like, not that she has them, but you're right.

如果你在拍特辑，我们并不需要了解你的全部细节。

It's we don't need to know the ins and outs of you if you are doing a special.

我们只想知道你是如何让圣诞节变得特别的。

We wanna know how you make Christmas special.

是的。

Yeah.

你就像是个出镜讲话的人。

You're just like a talking head.

是的。

Yeah.

如果你想保持神秘，想像碧昂丝那样，特辑就是最好的方式。

And if you wanna be elusive, if you wanna be like Beyonce, like, the special is the way to go.

但问题是，人们看到钱，尤其是名人。

But the problem is people see money, especially celebrities.

他们看到的都是美元符号，然后就想：你知道吗？

They see dollar signs and they're like, you know what?

我们就这么做吧，因为钱就在那儿。

We're just gonna do this because the money is right.

但有时候，长远规划才是正确的做法。

But sometimes playing the long game is the way to actually go.

我觉得梅根·马克尔从来不做长远打算。

Like, I think Meghan Markle is never playing the long game.

我是绝对不会让奥普拉做那个采访的，除非哈里的书出版之后。

Like I wouldn't have never given Oprah the interview until after Harry's book came out.

因为如果哈里的书先出版，他在书里把家人曝光了。

Because if Harry's book came out first and he wore his family the out in that book.

好吧。

Okay.

一旦你把家人曝光了，那我也可以把你的家人曝光。

And once you wear your family out, then I can wear your family out.

如果他先说出来，她会更有公信力。

It would've gave her a lot more credibility if he had said it first.

我们这些急于求成的女演员不擅长长远布局。

Us desperate actresses are not good at the long game.

急于求成的女演员不擅长长远布局，因为所有人都催你趁热打铁。

Desperate actresses are not good at the long game because everybody screams at you that you got to strike while the iron's hot.

所以她当时处于‘ Suit Meghan’模式。

So she was in suits Meghan mode.

她本该处于‘公爵夫人 Meghan’模式，说：等等，奥普拉。

She should have been in the duchess Meghan mode and said, hold on, Oprah.

等等。

Hold on.

我准备好了再给你打电话。

I'll call you when I'm ready.

阿门。

Amen.

好。

K.

你说得对。

You're right.

你说得对。

You're right.

这是个好观点。

That's a good point.

说到碧昂丝，牛仔风格不错。

Speaking of Beyonce, cowboy okay.

我们二月就要搬家了。

We're moving on February.

牛仔队终于赢得了年度专辑奖。

Cowboy quarter finally won album of the year.

太棒了。

So good.

太棒了。

It was so good.

顺便说一下，50。

By the way 50.

好的。

Okay.

我最喜欢的歌手卡姆凭借《牛仔卡特》赢得了格莱美奖。

My favorite artist, Cam, did win a Grammy for Cowboy Carter.

只是想让你们知道，每次你们取笑我最喜欢她的时候，我就想大喊一声。

Just wanted you guys to know every time you make fun of me for her being my favorite artist, so just shout

出来。

out.

恭喜。

Congrats.

我们有肯德里克的超级碗，老鹰队在超级碗中击败了酋长队。

We had the Kendrick Super Bowl, and the Eagles won the Super Bowl over the Chiefs.

哦。

Oh.

而且我们还有肯德里克。

And we had Kendrick.

肯德里克一个人就把喇叭裤潮流带回来了。

Kendrick single handedly brought us the bootcut gene back.

没错。

Yep.

就好像一月给了我们太多，二月只好说：我们只给你超级碗和碧昂丝了。

It's like January gave us so much that February is like, we're just gonna give you the Super Bowl and Beyonce.

你所需要的全部，就是二月的肯德里克·拉马尔。

And that's All you needed all you needed was Kendrick Lamar in February.

这就足够满足一切了。

That's that was enough to fulfill it all.

对吧？

Right?

天啊。

Oh my god.

德雷克真可怜。

Poor Drake.

顺便说一下，看着美国人在收视率最高的节目中狠狠羞辱德雷克，我感到特别难受。

By the way, I felt so terrible for Drake watching America slay his ass on the most watched.

想象一下，如果你最讨厌的敌人上了美国最盛大的节目，称你是恋童癖，会怎么样？

Like, imagine if your worst enemy went on the biggest show in America and called you a pedophile.

这简直太疯狂了。

Like, that is the craziest thing.

对吧？

Okay?

而且每个人都跟着合唱。

And everyone was singing along to it.

德雷克到底对我们做过什么？不就是给了我们无数神曲和舞曲吗？

Like, what did Drake ever do to us but give us bops and hops?

我们到底在干什么？

Like, what what what are we doing?

我的意思是，他那个小 smirk 和那条小喇叭裤，那一刻简直完美。

I mean, with the little smirk and his little bell bottoms, I mean, there was nothing better than that moment.

这个小个子男人就像拿破仑一样。

This tiny little man was just like a Napoleon.

他就像是说：我要把你击垮。

Like, he was just like, and I shall take you down.

然后塞雷娜说：他们跟我们不一样。

And then there's Serena being like, they not like us.

他们跟我们

They not

不一样。

like us.

他得到了前女友。

He got the ex girlfriend.

他搞到了前女友。

He got the ex girl.

想象一下，他们把你前男友带到节目上，踩着你的坟头走。

Imagine them bringing your ex boyfriend onto the show to grip walk on your grave.

这太疯狂了。

It was crazy.

谁更小气？

Who's pettier?

50美分还是肯德里克·拉马尔？

Fifty Cent or Kendrick Lamar?

哦，我觉得是50美分，因为这事持续得更久。

Oh, I think fifty well, fifty because it's been going on for longer.

没错。

Yeah.

那可是老家伙了。

That's old man.

他玩的是持久战。

He played the long game.

他玩的是持久战。

He played the long game.

他正在打持久战

He's playing the long

他本可以把这些视频剪成小片段发布。

He could have released those videos as little snippets.

他本可以，你知道的，多做点，我的意思是，他在网上做了很多挑衅，但他就是想等到了假期，人们都在刷视频的时候。

He could have, you know, done more on the I mean, he did a lot of trolling on the Internet, but he was just like, let me wait until it's the holiday season, and people are binging.

他们在家。

They're home.

他们准备好了。

They're ready.

他们已经受够了。

They're over it.

你懂我的意思吧？

You know what I mean?

比如，感恩节的电影都播完了，我就趁这个时候放出这个精心制作的内容。

Like, the the Thanksgiving movies have happened, and let me just drop this, you know, well crafted.

它

It

把《怪奇物语》挤出了前十名。

knocked stranger things off the top 10.

《怪奇物语》当时排在第四名左右。

Stranger things is was, like, number four.

当时全是关于迪迪的内容。

It was, like, all Diddy.

他说他还有大约一百五十小时的迪迪私人视频，正在陆续发布到YouTube上。

And he says he has, like, a hundred and fifty more hours of the private Diddy videos, and he's releasing shit on YouTube.

我简直等不及了。

I just cannot wait.

因为Netflix他简直是个怪物。

Because Netflix He's an animal.

因为他们根本没涉及那么多内容，连碰都没碰。

Because there's so many things they didn't get into, like, didn't even touch.

然后他说，我要做这个。

And then he's like, I'm doing this.

我要把其他所有东西都发布到YouTube上。

I'm releasing all the other shit on YouTube.

所以这才是我期待的事情。

So that's what I'm excited about.

哇。

Wow.

简直太惊人了。

It's just like Damn.

我完全入坑了。

I'm I'm so in.

让我们把这份能量带到2026年吧。

Like, let us take this energy into 2026.

别做个更大的喷子。

Don't Be a bigger hater.

梅根·马克尔，太美了。

Meghan Markle, like, it's too pretty.

说到梅根，我们根本不想做好人。

Like, going back to Meghan, it's like, we don't want to be good.

我们被什么吸引？

What are we drawn to?

卑微的报复。

Petty revenge.

对。

Yes.

即使现在也是。

Even now.

还有，看看萨布丽娜·卡彭特。

Also, look at Sabrina Carpenter.

我们之前在《Lady Gang》上聊过这个。

We talked about this a little bit ago on Lady Gang.

她刚上《Lady Gang TV》的时候，还试图扮演一个媒体训练有素、从不犯错、让父母都认可的公主。

She came on Lady Gang TV when she was still trying to be, like, the media trained princess that didn't do anything wrong and that parents still approved of.

这婊子一在舞台上开始做性爱姿势，立马就爆红了。

That bitch blew up as soon as she started doing sex positions on stage.

没错。

Yep.

没错。

Yep.

这是由于

It's by

话说回来，真的太对了。

the way, it's so true.

这就是我现在在笑西德尼·斯威尼的原因。

It's the reason I'm laughing at Sydney Sweeney right now.

嗯，不是笑西德尼·斯威尼本人，而是笑她的团队，因为他们还没搞明白这一点。

Well, not Sydney Sweeney herself, but her team because they haven't figured that part out.

但我认为，那些老牌公关和经纪人有时会保护一线明星，但他们的方式错了，因为他们不够年轻，不懂得什么才能让你在丑闻中脱身。

But I think sometimes that old guard of publicists and agents safeguard those A list celebrities and they do it in the wrong way because they are not young enough to know what gets you in and out of a, you know, scandal.

比如在Instagram和TikTok出现之前，你是个名人。

Like back in the day before Instagram and before TikTok were a thing, you were a celebrity.

你做错了事。

You did something wrong.

我们发现你和别人有个私生子。

We found out that you had a secret baby with somebody else.

你八个月都没吭声。

You didn't say shit for eight months.

人们就忘了这件事。

People forgot about it.

你付钱给那位女士封口了。

You paid the lady off.

她说那不是你的孩子，而你却一直装下去。

She said it wasn't your kid and you just kept it going.

这就是过去你摆脱丑闻的方式。

That's how you got out of scandal back in the cut.

但现在事情发生得如此迅速

But now that things are so immediate

当你被困在，我

when you're stuck in the, I

我说，当你被困在烘干机里时，我总说这就像一只猫在烘干机里。

say you, when you're stuck in the dryer, I always say it's like a cat in the dryer.

一旦你意识到自己在烘干机里，就必须尽快出来，ASAP Rocky。

Once you figure out you're in your dryer, you have to get the out of it ASAP Rocky.

那种老派的死扛着 hoping 它会消失的方式，现在行不通了，宝贝。

The old school way of staying in something and hoping it's gonna go away, that ain't happening, babe.

我们有怀旧星期四。

We have throwback Thursdays.

我们有遥远星期三。

We have way back Wednesdays.

我们有话题标签。

We got hashtags.

人们觉得这会永存。

People are it's gonna live forever.

所以要抢先一步

So get ahead of

它。

it.

嗯。

Yeah.

我认为，对于悉尼·西布利来说，一个大问题是她完全没有幽默感，也不会自我调侃。

I think with Sydney Sweeney, a big problem is she has no sense of humor and, like, no self deprecation.

我觉得如果她能稍微自嘲一下，大家可能会更喜欢她，但她太严肃了。

I think if there is, like, a way for her to, like, poke fun at herself a little bit, people would like her a little bit more, but, like, it's too serious.

这正是

This is the

演员的问题所在。

actress thing, though.

这就像莉娅·米歇尔做过最棒的事，就是她那个关于自己读不了书的段子，当她接受并玩转了这些‘我读不了’的梗时。

It's like it's like the best thing Lea Michele ever did was that, like, whole thing about her being, like, when she leaned into that she couldn't read, like, all the I can't read jokes.

对。

Yeah.

那时我就想，对啊，莉娅。

That's when I was like, oh, yeah, Lea.

你太有趣了。

Like, you're so funny.

你明白我的意思吧？

You know what I mean?

但对不起，我试试。

But try I'm sorry.

我知道她是你的朋友，但我在夸她，所以没关系。

I know she's your friend back about, like, but I'm giving her compliments, so it's fine.

我觉得这太好笑了。

Like, I think it was so funny.

当她和乔纳森一起玩这个梗的时候，你会想，天哪。

Like, when she when her and Jonathan leaned into it, you're like, oh my god.

你懂的。

You get it.

当你看评论时，你就明白我们觉得你很荒谬。

Like, you're reading the comments and you understand that we think you're ridiculous.

是啊。

Yeah.

你得懂这个笑话才行。

You need to be in on the joke.

那你得懂这个笑话。

Then You gotta be in on the joke.

李米歇尔是世界上最才华横溢的人之一。

Lee Michelle is one of the most talented people in the world.

她人也非常好。

She's also very nice.

我和她的互动都非常愉快。

I have had the best interactions with her.

我度过了最美好的时光。

I've had the loveliest times.

她邀请我去看她的演出。

She invited me to her shows.

我真的很喜欢她。

We have like, I love her.

但再说一次，那种老派的好莱坞方式，我希望她能早点向人们展示真实的自己，因为我觉得这一切根本不会发生。

But again, that old school Hollywood way, I wish she would have shown people the real side of her earlier on, because I feel like this whole thing would have never happened.

这浪费了我们和她太多时间，但我能理解。

It wasted so much time for us and her Like but I get it.

她当时和那些老派人物在一起，每月花一万美元请公关，还有那些大经纪人，他们都说：别说话。

She was with the old guard, with the $10,000 a month publicist, and the big agents who were like, don't say anything.

真是该死。

And it's like, goddamn it.

我真希望有个黑人同性恋能冲进去说：嘿，老姐，听我说。

I wish a black gay could get in there and be like, you know what, bitch?

你该说这些话的。

You should say this.

对。

Right.

不。

No.

你说得对极了。

You're absolutely right.

我认为，作为一个社会，当我们看到《欢乐合唱团》首播时，情况就是这样。

And I think it's like we are, as a society, like, when glee, for instance, premiered.

那时福克斯电视台对你的一言一行都管得特别严。

This was when Fox was very on you about your p's and q's.

他们不想引发任何争议，因为他们已经花了数百万美元来让这部剧走红。

They don't want any controversy because they've spent millions and millions and millions of dollars to make this show popular.

而那时，任何错误的争议都可能毁掉一个项目。

And back then, the wrong controversy could really ruin a project.

但现在，争议越多越好，因为人们就是想去看那些被说成荒谬、疯狂或各种极端的人和事。

Now the more controversy, the better because people just wanna go and they wanna check out the thing that the person that's so ridiculous or so crazy or so whatever.

所以，老派的好莱坞需要跟上现实，比如西德尼·斯威尼的情况。

So it's like the old school Hollywood needs to catch up to the fact like Sydney Sweeney.

如果她能放得开一点、不那么完美，事情会简单得多，因为人们真的很喜欢真实不羁的人。

It would be so much easier for her if she could just be messy because people really like messy.

我觉得她可能本来就是这样的。

And I think she probably is.

这就是为什么

Well, it's like that's why

人们喜欢混乱。

People love messy.

就像操，人们就是喜欢混乱。

Like shit with people love messy.

比如以前在《单身汉》节目里，你根本不能在季播结束前发任何东西。

Well, like, with real back in the day on The Bachelor, like, you weren't allowed to post at all until the season was over.

但现在你看《摩门智者》这类节目，他们播出期间在互联网上制造的戏剧性更多了。

And now you watch shit with Mormon Wise where they're literally having way more drama on the Internet while it's airing.

你简直要惊呼：天啊，这是怎么回事？

You're like, holy shit, what's going on?

这正是在喂养这头野兽。

That's feeding the beast.

这也让现在的真人秀变得如此有趣，因为人们正在实时互相攻击。

And that's what makes reality now so interesting because people are just like going after each other in real time.

你就会觉得，我正在亲身经历一部肥皂剧，而它正在播出

And you're like, I'm living the soap opera while it's

时候。

time.

太棒了。

That's amazing.

说到肥皂剧。

Speaking of the soap opera.

就是WWE。

It's WWE.

就是带反派角色的WWE。

It's WWE with heels.

这就是它的本质。

Like, that's what it is.

没错。

Exactly.

每个人都有一个斗士。

It's everybody has a fighter.

每个人都有那么一点，你知道的，一种特质。

Every person has a, you know, a thing.

前几天我重看了《比佛利娇妻》第一季，真搞笑，那时候人们觉得那么离谱的事情。

Like, I was rewatching season one of real housewives of Beverly Hills the other day, And it's so funny what people thought was so outrageous back then.

我记得当时人们做T恤，上面写着‘卡米尔，你真是个骗子’，我走在街上时，人们觉得凯尔说卡米尔撒谎是件天大的事。

Like I remember people making t shirts and saying, you're such a liar Camille, like in public, when I would walk out in public, people thought that was, like, such a big deal that Kyle called Camille a liar.

你能想象吗？那时候这已经是底线了？

Like, can you imagine that that was the threshold back in the cut?

他们现在说：

They're like Now

现在人们都要进监狱了。

people are going to jail.

现在人们每天都在叫别人‘婊子’。

Now people are, like, calling people cunts on a daily basis.

太疯狂了。

Like, it's so crazy.

确实如此。

It really is.

嗯，这其实就是《主妇》节目的本质，就像WWE一样。

Well, that's, like, really what housewives is is like the WWE.

我刚才正好在想这个。

I was actually just thinking about this.

我最近在读一本关于WWE的书，挺奇怪的。

I'm reading a book weirdly about the WWE.

书里有一些零星的片段。

Like, it has, like, sprinklings.

我当时就想，等等。

And I was like, wait.

这不就是《主妇》节目的真实写照吗？

This is what real housewives is.

就像，她们在扮演自己，但是一种被提升过的版本，而她们所聚焦的戏剧性情节，如果没有摄像机拍摄，她们根本不会遇到。

Like, the they are in they are playing themselves as, like, an elevated version of themselves, and the drama that they're focusing on is, like, part of the storyline that they would never be dealing with had the cameras not been rolling.

我们本质上就是WWE迷。

Like, we are essentially WWE nerds.

天啊。

Oh my god.

我们

We

是的。

are.

没错。

Yeah.

没错。

True.

你确实是。

You are.

好吧。

Okay.

三月份的时候，我得告诉你，当黛米·摩尔在奥斯卡上意外落选时，我很难过，因为我们以为她会赢得那个奥斯卡奖。

In March, I have to tell you, it was very hard for me at the Oscars when Demi Moore had the Oscar upset because we thought she was gonna win that Oscar.

那是一个完美的故事线。

It was the perfect storyline.

天啊，这么多年过去了。

It was like, oh my god, all these years after.

而且在那之前她已经赢得了不少奖项。

And she'd won a bunch leading up to it.

她穿了一件完美的礼服来赢得奥斯卡奖。

She had the perfect dress to win an Oscar.

然后她输了。

And then she lost.

输给了一个刚拍了第一部电影的女孩，这也没关系。

To a girl who, like, made her first movie, which is fine.

她也很棒。

She was amazing too.

埃诺拉。

Enora.

麦迪逊。

Madison.

那是一部很棒的电影。

Which was a great movie.

但我很难过。

But I was sad.

我至今还没能释怀。

I still haven't gotten over it.

但他们就是这样。

But they do that.

他们喜欢天真型的新人。

They like an ingenue.

他们喜欢让人注定失败。

They love to set people up for failure.

嗯。

Mhmm.

而且说实话，看看黛米·摩尔的脸，她真的以为那个角色是她的，所有人都告诉她那是她的。

And honestly, looking at Demi Moore's face because she really thought it was hers, everyone had told her that it was hers.

我告诉过布拉德·戈尔茨基，就是这个了。

I had told Brad Gorecki, this is it.

一定要选对裙子。

Make sure you pick the right dress.

这简直太疯狂了。

Like, this is crazy.

是啊。

Yeah.

我忘了奥斯卡奖青睐的是那种票房只有275万美元、主演才24岁的电影。

And I forgot that the Oscars like a movie that makes $2.75 at the box office starring someone that is 24 years old.

听说过。

Heard of.

你从来没听说过。

You've never heard of.

如果当时在剧情上做一点调整，让这部电影横扫所有奖项，那该多好。

And I the one tweak that the substance could have made that would have made it the it would have swept everything.

如果他们没有把她塑造成健身教练，而是把她设定为一位年长的色情演员，因为好莱坞热爱性工作者。

Had they make her instead of making her character a fitness instructor, they could have made her a aging porn star because Hollywood loves sex workers.

他们喜欢

They love

年长的色情演员。

the aging porn star.

脱衣舞娘和色情片。

Strippers and porn.

她本会赢得奖项的。

She would have won it.

嗯。

Yeah.

你说得对。

You're right.

该死。

Damn.

这就是贾拉女士生病的原因。

Is why Jara is the lady sick.

因为什么比脱衣舞娘更胜一筹呢？那就是一位年迈的色情女星。

Because what trumps a a stripper is a aging porn star.

明白吗？

Okay?

搞定。

Boom.

搞定。

Boom.

等等。

Wait.

另一部电影是关于脱衣舞娘的吗？

Was the other movie about a stripper?

她是个是的。

She was a Yes.

她不是只是嗯。

Didn't she just Yeah.

她是个脱衣舞娘，然后开始为了钱跟这个男人发生关系。

She was a stripper, and then she started having sex with this guy for money.

所以她也是性工作者。

So she was also a sex worker.

是的。

Yeah.

最糟糕的。

Was the worst.

贾斯汀。

Justin.

这就是为什么贾斯汀对我来说如此重要，不仅作为朋友，更作为顾问。

This is why Justin is so important to my life, not only as a friend, but as an adviser.

因为如果你们觉得我会是个出色的教练，贾斯汀可清楚得很。

Because he like, if you guys think I would be a great success coach, Justin knows what the fuck's up.

他真的懂。

He really knows.

凯尔·理查兹能成为出演时间最长的主妇的原因。

Reason why Kyle Richards is the longest running housewife.

因为贾斯汀在挑选重聚时的造型。

Because Justin's picking the reunion look.

贾斯汀在决定我们去商店假装购物时要带哪款爱马仕包。

Justin is deciding what Birkin we're taking to the store to fake shop.

贾斯汀呢，你知道的，就是在提供建议。

Justin is, you know, advising.

我全包了。

I'm doing it all.

他是在给女士们当顾问。

He's lady sitting the ladies.

我全包了。

I'm doing it all.

我是贾斯汀·西尔维斯特。

I'm Justin Sylvester.

我是布莱克·李·索恩顿。

And I'm Blake Lee Thornton.

欢迎收听《昨日凝视》，这档播客我们将剖析历史上最重要的流行文化时刻，并给予它们应得的酷儿之爱。

Join us for Yestergaze, the podcast where we break down the most pivotal pop culture moments in history and give them the queer love that they deserve.

那些在拨号上网时代让我们激动不已的事情。

The things that got us riled up during dial up.

那些本该是分手的接吻。

Those makeouts that should have been breakouts.

还有那些被定格在流行文化中的经典瞬间。

And the drops that were cemented in pop.

我说的是宾尼弗。

I'm talking Binnifer.

泰拉对阵娜奥米。

Tyra versus Naomi.

汤姆·克鲁斯跳上沙发的那一幕。

Tom Cruise jumping on that couch.

还有更多更多。

And so much more.

所以请给我们评分，并在苹果播客、Spotify 或你收听音频内容的任何平台订阅我们。

So please rate us, subscribe to us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or anywhere you get audio related content.

我们还接受 Venmo 转账。

We also take Venmo

以及 Cash App。

and Cash App.

ACH？

ACH?

或者信用卡号也可以。

Or credit card number as well.

我们很灵活。

We're we're malleable.

嗯。

Yeah.

我们今天是同性恋。

We We're gay today.

你正在收听《女郎帮》。

You're listening to the Lady Gang.

好的。

Okay.

四月，流行文化史上最大的事情发生了。

In April, the greatest thing in pop culture ever happened.

我们去了太空。

We went to space.

天哪。

Oh my god.

我们去了吗？

Did we?

我超爱这个。

I loved it.

我们去了太空。

We went to space.

我要说一件没人会喜欢的事。

I I'm gonna say something that no one's gonna enjoy.

我觉得凯蒂·佩里和那个小达西挺可爱的。

I thought Katy Perry and the little Daisy was quite lovely.

因为你会这么做。

Because you would do that.

你肯定会这么做。

You would totally do that.

我是觉得，应该是通过你女儿的名字达西来体现的。

Like, I thought it was through your daughter's name, Daisy.

她当时是在为达西制造一个特别的时刻。

She was, like, making a moment for Daisy.

我的意思是，我无法想象，都飞到太空了，却想着‘让我拍点画面，给人们看看’，而不是看着窗外的地球。

Like, I think I mean, I can't imagine going all the way up to space and being like, let me look let me give the people some footage instead of looking out the window at Earth.

你懂我的意思吧？

You know what I mean?

我肯定会一直举着摄像机。

Like, I would've been camera.

她还在上面展示了她的巡演日期。

She also was putting on her tour dates.

她打开那只蝴蝶，里面竟然有她的巡演日期。

She, like, opened up that butterfly, and it had her tour dates on it.

顺便说一下，她就像说，如果我要死了，

By the way, she is like, if I'm gonna die,

那就干吧。

let's do it.

对。

Yeah.

而且，老实说，杰克，如果我们计划好了去太空的行程，同时下周还要推出周边商品，你不觉得我们会

And, like, honestly, Jack, if we had a planned trip to space and then we also were launching merch the next week, don't you think we'd

穿着周边商品吗？

be wearing merch?

我不介意这些周边商品。

I don't mind the merch.

我以为他们对这套服装很兴奋。

I thought they were hyped the outfit.

宣传一下日期。

Shouting out the dates.