"离职访谈（宣泄特辑）"（与Matt和Bowen）

谁是《周六夜现场》的导演，谁执导了文化奖？

Who's the director of SNL, who directed the Culture Who directed

文化奖。

the Culture Awards.

那对我来说，就像是那个想法的表面开始出现裂痕。

Was like, that was kind of like the veneer cracking on like that idea for me.

无论如何，周三彩排时我哭了，因为我讲了真话，而且在那个地方，从来没有人会这样说。

Anyway, I cried on Wednesday at the read through because I was telling the truth and because there are no other occasions for someone to say that at that place.

对。

Right.

因为我们必须

Because we have to

只是要显得搞笑、讽刺。

just like be like funny and like ironic.

而且所说的内容和它应该如何被接受之间存在一种折射。

And there's a refraction of like what's being said and how it should be received.

而且，我完全承认，那个Delta One小品真的是完全自我放纵。

And like, I will absolutely cop to the fact that that Delta One sketch was, like, completely self indulgent.

因为，我能做什么呢？

Because, like, what am I gonna do?

这样也没关系。

Like That's fine.

讲个直白的笑话就行。

Tell a straight like, give a straight joke bag.

有一瞬间，我以为你的部分是因为它 weirdly 感觉像你做的80年代趋势预测师周末更新片段。

Well, for a second, I thought that your because it did weirdly feel like you for the 80 trend forecasters weekend update piece Mhmm.

因为那是80年代的最后一件事。

To be the last thing because that was eighty's last thing.

是的。

Yes.

我觉得这也说明了那是80年代的最后一件事，而她在节目中待了十年。

And I think that that also speak the fact that that was eighty's last thing, and she was on the show for ten years.

是的。

Yes.

而且她并不一定拥有，像你那样的平台。

And she wasn't necessarily well, she was not given that type of platform like you were given.

我们应该说，非常非常

And we should say very, very

很少有人有。

people have.

很少有人拥有这样的机会。

Very few people have been given that.

是的。

Yes.

我觉得这其实相当罕见。

I think it's, like, actually quite rare.

所以我想问的是，随着事情的发展，你知道，这在剧本朗读时的感觉就是这样，现在都快到12月了，52了。

And so I guess my question is, as it's going, and you know what that's what that's felt like at the read through and everything like that, and it's getting to be like, it's, you know, it's December, 52.

你有没有想过，这件事可能不会发生？因为某种程度上，你已经经历过那种时刻了，之前穿 costumes 时遇到过被砍掉的情况吗？

Did you think there was a possibility that it would not happen because in a way you you had that moment and therefore, like, you you've been in the costume before when things are cut?

我真的在节目被砍的时候穿过这套服装。

Literally, I've been in the costume when things are cut.

这完全令人崩溃，因为你当时情绪已经绷到极致了。

It is completely devastating because you are just like emotionally on edge.

你正在为某件事做准备。

You're gearing up for something.

你明明已经穿好了装备，准备好了，结果它却被取消了。

Literally, you are in the gear for something and then like it gets taken away from you.

我想说的是，因为《星期三》这件事，再加上那一周的安排，我其实已经很幸运了，毕竟主持人是阿里，音乐嘉宾是雪儿。

I want to say that, like, because of the Wednesday thing and just, like, going into that week at all, I was already, like, blessed by the fact that it was Ari as the host, Cher as the musical guest.

是的。

Yeah.

太疯狂了。

Wild.

我整个想法是，你们怎么能在那之后继续呢？

My whole thing was, how were

你怎么可能在那之后还留下来？

you supposed to stay after that?

在那之后，你根本不可能再回去。

You could never have gone back after that.

我以为过了第五十季，就不可能了，我当时想，我不明白你为什么这个季度还要回来。

I thought after the fiftieth, it could never I was like, I didn't understand how why you were coming back this season.

坦白说吧。

Like, just to be candid.

因为我觉得那是第五十季之后了。

Because I was like, it's after the fiftieth.

你明白我的意思吗？

You know what I mean?

感觉其他人会离开，结果你却回来了。

Like, it felt like other people were gonna leave, and then you went back.

而现在，我非常感激你回去了，而且

And now it's like, I'm so grateful you went back and

经历了那些。

had that.

非常感激我回去了。

So grateful I went back.

而且，随着夜晚的进行，我完全平静了下来。

And, like, as so as the the night's going on, like, I was completely zen about it.

嗯。

Mhmm.

无论哪种方式都可以。

Either way was okay.

无论哪种方式都可以。

Either way was okay.

嗯。

Mhmm.

因为AD在那里。

Because AD was there.

我只是觉得，抱歉，当时有一种情感的爆发。

There was just, I'm sorry, there was like an outpouring.

是的。

Yeah.

那些我很久没联系过的人，还有那些，抱歉。

People that I hadn't heard from and people that like I I'm sorry.

就是人们。

It's people.

这感觉就像一件特别美好的事，我之前说过，当我站在地板上时，环顾四周，基本上所有在那里工作过的人

It just felt like a really beautiful thing where I was saying earlier, like, as I get on the floor, like, I look out, it was like, basically, like, everyone who worked there

嗯。

Yeah.

都出现在了现场。

On the floor showing up.

我环顾四周，心想，我真是太幸运了，能在这里工作。

And I just looked out and I thought, I'm so lucky that I ever got to work here.

我真是太幸运了，能做出这样一个几乎毫不掩饰的表态——我爱你们所有人。

And I'm so lucky that I get to make this, like, little statement that's, like, barely veiled where I'm like, I love you all.

嗯。

Mhmm.

我当时就觉得，我真是太幸运了。

Like, it was I'm so lucky.

是啊。

Yeah.

而且这里并不是像你说的那样，情感会如此赤裸裸地展露的地方。

And it's not really like a place where like you said, like, where emotions get laid bare like that.

我觉得人们可能只记得节目中的高光时刻，觉得那里似乎就是那样的。

I feel like people may remember highlights of the show where it feels like that might be the case.

但你日复一日、年复一年地在这里工作，你知道这并不是一个你可以自由表达‘我此刻的感受’并负责任地宣之于口的地方。

But you working there day in and day out, year after year, you know that it's not some place where it's like you're necessarily, like, free to be like, hey, this is how I'm feeling, and I'm expressing it exactly responsibly.

完全正确。

Totally.

等等。

Etcetera.

所以我想问你的是，你觉得因为参与这个节目以及由此经历的各种事情，你在情感上有了怎样的成长？

And so that was a question I had for you is how do you think you've emotionally grown as a result of being on that show and the experiences that you've had doing it?

我觉得自己的情感成熟度被加速了，就像你知道的，总统任期如何让人衰老一样，没错。

I feel like I've been accelerated in terms of what you know how, like, a presidency ages you, like Yes.

一届就十二年左右？

Twelve years or whatever in one term?

我觉得，完全说不上来。

Like, I feel, like, completely I don't know.

要么我成熟了，要么我腐烂了。

Either I'm like ripened or I'm like rotten.

嗯。

Yeah.

我经历了各种各样的情绪。

I've experienced the full spectrum of things.

你说得对，在那里工作会让人情绪完全失控。

Because you're right, like working there is completely dysregulating emotionally.

是的。

Yeah.

你要么飞黄腾达，要么彻底跌入谷底。

Like either you are soaring or you are, like, completely in the dumps.

这就是现实，孩子，没办法。

And that's just how, like it's like them's the breaks, kid.

就像一场喧嚣、夸夸其谈的秀。

It's like that it's like a show busy, blowhard.

我不是在说具体哪个人，但你总会不断被某人、某事或某个事件提醒：天啊，事情就是这样的。

I'm not saying this is anyone in particular, but it's just like you are constantly reminded by someone or something or some event where you're like, God, this is just how it is.

事情就是这样的。

This is how it is.

每周你都会经历一个项目上发育过程的浓缩版。

And every week you get like a condensed version of like a developmental process on a project, let's say.

杰西·戴维·福克斯写过这个，SNL（《周六夜现场》）中的三个词都关乎时间。

And Jesse David Fox writes about this, like all three words in SNL, Saturday Night Live are about time.

而且

And

这是一种时间在情感上、身体上、流程上和创意上不断向你逼近的感觉。

it is just time sort of like encroaching on you emotionally, physically, process wise, creatively.

所有这些压力都压在你身上。

Like it is all those things bearing down on you.

如果你有时间去学会如何应对这一切，那你就会为其他所有事情做好充分准备。

And then if you have the time to figure out how to like deal with all of that, then you will be so well equipped for everything else.

无论你是演员、编剧、服装部门，还是节目中的任何其他岗位，都是一样的。

And that doesn't matter if you're on the cast, if you're a writer, if you're in the wardrobe department, if you're in any other place at that show.

这真是令人惊叹。

Like it is, wow.

那里的每个部门都汇聚了最了不起的人，他们带着一种务实的态度准时到场、认真工作，从不自负。

Every department there is a convocation of the most amazing people with this workmanlike attitude about showing up and doing the job and not having an ego about it.

当然，有时你也会有自负的时候。

And then, course, there are moments where you have an ego about it.

这是一种集体性的氛围。

It is like a collective thing.

我想，可能曾经有人觉得，我在某种程度上与众不同。

And, like, I guess there was, like, some perception that, like, I felt, like, exceptional in any way.

我真没有这种感觉。

I really didn't.

每当我获得一些关注时，我最真实的本能总是把功劳归于所有在那里工作的人。

Anytime I got, like, some shine on me, my genuine instinct was always to make it about everyone who works there.

我的确注意到了你这一点。

I mean, I do notice that about you.

正因如此，我才特别高兴那个时刻发生在节目结尾，因为正如我所说，我当时心想，哇，真棒。

Like and I and that's why I was so happy that that moment happened at the end of the show because, like I said, I I was like, oh, wow.

这件事给80分对他来说已经很像他的风格了。

It would be very like him for this thing with 80 to be enough for him.

当然。

Absolutely.

很高兴你得到了比这更多的分数。

Really happy that you got more than that.

因为我觉得，我的意思是，你今天已经做了好几次了。

Because I do think I mean, you've done it several times today.

你分享了自己的经历，还提到你试图让我也融入其中。

You've made your experience, and you've mentioned you've tried to bring me into it.

这跟我一点关系都没有。

I ain't got nothing to do with this.

是的。

Yes.

你有关系。

You do.

你实际上已经经历了所有这些事情。

You have you experienced, like, all of this stuff in a way.

我想说的是，并不是每个人看完这个节目后都能准备好以创造性的方式积极影响职场。

And I one thing I wanna say is that not everyone leaves that show and is, like, ready to positively impact the workforce creatively.

我可以告诉你这一点。

I can tell you that.

当然。

Sure.

所以，你能保持情感、创造力和人性的完整，这简直是一种壮举。

And so the fact that you are leaving intact emotionally, creatively, and, like, in terms of your humanity is is like, you know, it's a feat.

别无他法。

There was no there was no other way.

我想说，就像塞思·迈耶斯说的那样，嗯，就是这样。

I'm gonna say, like, it's that Seth Meyers thing where he's like Yeah.

不，是迈克·舒马赫告诉塞思的，你会一辈子谈论这件事。

Or no, Mike Shoemaker told Seth, you're gonna be talking about this for the rest of your life.

比如，你拿到这份工作的时候，简直太棒了。

Like, when you got the job, it's like, congratulations.

你这辈子都会谈论这件事。

You're gonna be talking about this for the rest

一辈子。

of your life.

没错。

Yeah.

对我来说确实如此。

That is true for me.

我会尽量把这件事的谈论控制在合理的范围内。

I will try to keep it at like a reasonable volume.

天啊。

I am like, oh god.

抱歉。

Sorry.

这些想法一个接一个地涌向我。

These these these thoughts are just coming at me.

不，当然了。

No, of course.

Polar，Amy，在她主持了本季第二集后的派对离开前，把手搭在我肩上，看着我的眼睛说：我们在彼岸等你。

Polar, Amy, before she left the after party when she hosted the second episode this season, puts a hand on my shoulder, looks into my eyes and goes, we're all waiting for you on the other side.

我当时就想：操。

And I was like, fuck.

是啊。

Yeah.

这太多了。

That's so much.

这太疯狂了。

It's like, this is crazy.

我知道。

I know.

然后这就像提醒了我，天啊，我在这里工作。

And then that was like a reminder of like, oh my god, I work here.

而且这就像

And like, this is like

还有另一面。

And there's another side.

还有另一面。

And there's another side.

而且它

And like, it

真的感觉我好像已经死了。

does feel like I've died.

而且，我的一位偶像仿佛在俯视着我，告诉我，甚至80岁也说过，这之后会有一个美好的生活等着你。

And and like, there's like one of my heroes is like looking down at me and like telling me like and even, like, 80 has been like, there's a really nice life waiting for you after this.

嗯。

Mhmm.

你会每天想念它。

You'll miss it every day.

克里斯滕·韦格。

Kristen Wiig.

她给你发消息了吗？

Did she text you?

当然她发消息了。

Of course she texted.

她几周后就会到这里。

Well, she'll be here in a couple weeks.

她几周后就会到这里，当然她给我发消息了。

She'll be here in a couple weeks, but of of course she texted me.

然后我给她回了消息。

Then I texted her back.

我当时说，克里斯滕，我永远忘不了你第一次在这里主持的时候。

I was like, Kristen, like, will never forget, like, the first time you hosted when I was here.

我的意思是，你告诉我的是，要好好享受，因为这是世界上最有趣的工作。

Like, the thing you told me was enjoy it because it's the funnest job in the world.

我记得她跟我说过这句话的时候

I remember when she said that to

你。

you.

我从来没忘记。

Never forgot.

你知道吗，我们在拍摄《Pomme Royale》的时候聊过这个话题。

You know, we were talking when we were shooting Pomme Royale, we were talking about this.

我记得我当时对她说，因为她自己也收到过类似的送别。

And I remember, like, saying to her, like because she too also got, like, a send off like that.

我不太想透露我们聊的具体内容，但当时我心里确实这么想。

And I remember I not to share too much about what we talked about, but I was kind of I was kind of in my mind.

我当时想，你最好的朋友。

I was like, your best friend.

而且作为一个观看并喜爱这个节目、认同节目遗产的人，我觉得你值得拥有这一切，我当时就想，我们怎么才能让他拥有一个美好而温馨的时刻呢？

And also as someone who watches the show and enjoys the show and the legacy of the show and felt you deserved it, I was like, how do we make it so that he gets, like, a good, nice moment?

而且，我觉得从整体来看，最终的结果可能已经超出了你最疯狂的想象。

And, like, I think I think that ultimately in terms of the totality of what it could have been, it probably was, like, beyond your wildest dreams.

远远超出。

Beyond.

我想问的是，有了这些经历，艾丽安娜会不会成为你心目中有史以来最喜爱的主持人？

I guess my question is with that, like, does Ariana become de facto your favorite host of all time?

是的。

Yeah.

我的意思是，根本不存在其他答案。

I mean, there's there's there's no other answer.

莎伦才是我最喜欢的。

Sharon's my favorite.

抱歉，是凯克·帕尔默。

Sorry, Keke Palmer.

抱歉，凯克，你曾经统治过一段时间。

Sorry, Keke You reigned for a while.

抱歉，蕾吉娜·金。

Sorry, Regina King.

我

I

我非常喜欢整个过程的无私精神。

I loved how unselfish the whole thing was.

你明白我的意思吗？

You know what I mean?

就像，要拥有如此多的自信和明星气质，才能在第四次主持时如此投入，感受到她身上的能量，她首要的目标是服务好这个小品，这意味着要尊重，比如，

Like, because it takes so much confidence and, like, so much star quality to come in there like her for her fourth time hosting and knowing you felt on her in her in her energy, the being there with you, that a, her number one goal was servicing that sketch, which meant honoring, like,

当时正在发生的

what was happening for

你的感受，而她就那么坚定地站在你身边。

you in it, and she was so there right next to you.

但更重要的是，她那种积极的态度，她会回来，多次主持这个节目。

But b, the, like, positivity she had that she's gonna come back and do that show many, many other times.

因为并不是每个主持人都会说：‘好吧，我放弃这六分钟最后一小段，让给这个剧组成员。’

Because not every host would be like, yeah, let me give up the whole last sketch of this six minutes of the time for this cast member.

但她做到了，她真的这么做了。

But it was her, and she did that.

这不仅仅是因为她是个好朋友。

And it's not only because she's a good friend.

而是因为她是一位非常专业的主持人，完全不把自己的时间看得那么重要，我觉得这非常酷，值得特别提一下。

It's because she's a really professional host who doesn't have, like, an ego about her time there, which I think is, like, pretty cool and worth calling out.

奇儿根本不需要亲自出来走一趟。

The fact that Cher did not have to walk her ass out there.

没错。

No.

还有奇儿那件事。

Oh, and the Cher thing.

嗯，好吧。

Well, okay.

我会说到雪儿那件事的。

I'll get to the Cher thing.

就这个短剧本身而言，我想说的是，我唯一的愿望是我们能让更多其他演员参与进来。

I want to say in terms of the sketch itself, like my only wish is that, like, we had gotten, like, a bunch of other cast in there.

理想情况下，整个剧组都应该参与，因为这只是我个人的想法，我不知道，并不是要传达什么，但就是，我只是想和其他人一起在那里。

Ideally, the entire cast in there because it is just like me just like, I don't know, not imparting anything, but it's just like, I just, I want to be there with like the other people.

这确实只是后勤安排的问题。

It did just come down to logistics.

就像我们当时有迈基和莎拉在后面清理混乱场面。

Like we did, we had like Mikey and Sarah there in the back just like cleaning up the mess.

哦，所以那个蛋奶酒机器本来应该是出故障然后到处喷洒的。

Oh, and so like the eggnog machine was supposed to like be on the fritz and like spray everywhere.

它本来是要喷向基尼的。

It was supposed to spray Keeney.

它本来应该喷到简身上。

It was supposed to spray Jane.

它本来应该喷到那些被喷到的人身上。

It was supposed to spray the people it was spraying.

它变得有点——太多了。

It just kind of got- Too much.

它变得太多了。

It got to be too much.

在演出前、彩排后，洛恩找到我和塞莉斯特，他说：我觉得你们俩自己演就好，直接投入情感就行。

And Lorne came up to me and Celeste before the show, after Dress, and he was just like, I think it's better if it's just you guys, and you just play into the emotion of it.

他是对的。

He was right.

然后塞莉斯特和我心想，洛恩·迈克尔斯

And then Celeste and I were like, Lorne Michaels

很懂制作。

knows how to produce.

所以Celeste回来写了那段。

So Celeste came back to write that.

Celeste回来写了那段。

Celeste came back to write that.

我们也写了其他一些东西。

We wrote some other stuff too.

我们写了一个切丽家族重聚的桥段，我真的很遗憾。

We wrote a Cher family reunion, which I'm so sad.

哦，这是个桥段。

Oh, this is a thing.

我们稍后再谈切丽。

We'll we'll get to Cher later.

这是个桥段。

This is a thing.

你那边结尾还是被删了不少内容。

You were still getting shit cut at the end.

当然。

Of course.

这完全没问题。

It's it's totally, totally fine.

他们不会说，好吧，你可以有这个，但不能什么都想要。

They're not like, well, you can have this, but you can't have everything.

我从不看。

I never look.

我总是说，嗯，对。

And I'm always like, yeah.

嗯。

Yeah.

嗯。

Yeah.

剪掉，就是剪掉我的部分。

Cut, like, cut my stuff.

比如，凤凰的那部分还是被剪掉了。

Like, Phoenix still has his stuff cut.

嗯。

Yeah.

这根本不是个事儿。

It's not a thing.

你不会，我不一定觉得

You don't I don't necessarily think

你在节目上拿不到白金卡。

You don't get a platinum card at the show.

不。

No.

我另外一点是，可能是一种比较温和的方式，比如我会得到一个指定的，我和Dizmux聊过这个，也和詹姆斯·奥斯汀·约翰逊聊过。

And and my other thing was, like, was, like, a soft thing maybe where, like, I would get, like, there was a designated like, I was talking to Dizmux about this and James Austin Johnson about this.

感觉确实会有一个指定的鲍文位置，出现在周三的精选名单上。

Like, it did feel like I would get like, there would be like a designated Bowen spot in list of picks on Wednesday.

我就觉得，这该是我该走的时候了。

I'm like, that's also my cue to leave.

我不想让我的存在挤占了其他人的空间。

Like, I do not want the footprint to be edging out other people.

我真的发自内心地这么说。

Literally, I'm honest to God.

这真的很有风度。

That's really noble.

那并不是每个人都有这种感觉。

That was it's it's Not everyone has that feeling.

我当时就想，不行。

I was just like, no.

不行。

No.

不行。

No.

不。

No.

不。

No.

不可能就这些。

That can't be it.

嗯。

Yeah.

你知道什么时候该走。

You know when it's time to go.

对。

Right.

我当时就想，这是泰勒·斯威夫特说的。

I'm like, this is this is Taylor Swift said that.

泰勒·斯威夫特，那位传奇人物。

Taylor Swift, that legend.

但是

But

所以不管怎样，那位女继承人拍了部纪录片。

So anyway The heiress toward documentary.

你能想象吗？

Can you imagine?

能。

Yes.

我能想象。

I can.

我能想象。

I can.

等等。

Wait.

等等。

Wait.

等等。

Wait.

等等。

Wait.

我还有其他很多事情。

I have so many other things.

等等。

Wait.

哦。

Oh.

哦，是的。

Oh, yes.

我希望那个作品中还有其他演员。

I I wish there were other there were other cast in that piece.

我们确实只是不得不，比如

We we did just have to, like

如果非得选一个的话。

If there had to be one.

如果非得选没有的话。

If there had to be no.

停下。

Stop.

基南。

Keenan.

他当时在那儿。

He was there.

天啊。

Oh my god.

基南。

Keenan.

我非常高兴他们这么做了。

I was so happy they did that.

来吧。

Come on.

我的意思是，是啊。

I mean Yeah.

每个人。

Everybody.

而且，呃，我不知道，老兄。

And, like, I don't know, man.

我真的不敢相信我能在那儿工作。

That is a really I can't believe I got to work there.

我在小品里说过，我会一直重复这句话。

And I said in the sketch, that is the thing that I will like keep saying.

就像，我无法相信，感觉这事发生在别人身上。

Like, I can't It feels like it happened to someone else.

我很庆幸这事发生在我身上。

I'm so glad it happened to me.

我要把你拉入这段经历，因为我得告诉那里的一位很棒的舞台经理，珍娜·罗萨塔诺。

I am going to pull you into this experience because I got to tell Jenna Rosatano, the stage manager there, one of the many wonderful stage managers there.

她是个传奇。

She's an icon.

她是个传奇。

She's an icon.

但她说，除了阿里之外，她哭得比任何人都厉害。

But I, she kind of cried the hardest out of anybody besides Ari.

我当时对珍娜说，首先，她说了一句话，彻底击垮了我，这可不是我在自夸，她只是说：我从未见过，她对我说，她在那个舞台上见过太多行为。

I was like, Jenna, you Well, first of all, said something that like destroyed me, which was, and this is not me like bragging, she just goes, I never She goes to me, and she's seen a lot of behavior on that floor.

她说：在你在这里的七年里，我从未见过你提高嗓门或对任何人不友善。

She's like, I've never seen you raise your voice or be unkind to anyone in the seven years that you were here.

这对我来说意义重大。

Which, like, means a lot to me.

是的。

Yeah.

这对我来说意义重大。

It means a lot to me.

所以当你离开时，每个人都感动得哭了。

Well, that's why everyone hit the floor when you when you were leaving.

但我告诉她，詹娜，从我第一次见到你起，你就对我特别友善，因为当时我来到演播室外面的走廊，就在提示卡旁边，那里能隐约听到舞台上的情况。

But I told her, was like, Jenna, from the very first time I met you, you were just so kind to me because I came down to the hallway out outside of the studio, just like right by cue cards because you could kind of hear what's going on on stage.

我走下舞台，去听你的试镜。

I was like, came down to the floor to listen to your screen test.

因为我只是想靠近一点，不知为何，想为你传递一些能量之类的。

Because I was, I just wanted to, I just wanted to like be close and just like, I don't know, send energy or something.

然后你就在那里，问我：‘你迷路了吗？’

And then she was there and she was like, are you lost?

我回答：‘没有，没有。’

And I was like, no, no.

我只是我世界上最好的朋友此刻正在舞台上，我只是想看看他表现得怎么样。

I just my best friend in the whole world is on stage right now, and I just wanna I just wanna see how he's doing.

然后她完全崩溃了。

And then she she completely breaks down.

她问：‘上面那个是你最好的朋友？’

She's like, that's your best friend up there?

那你就好好待着吧，想待多久都行。

Well, then stay as long as you want.

我觉得她就像一座桥梁。

And just she I see her as like a bridge.

我不知道。

I don't know.

对，没错。

Like Yeah.

完全正确。

Totally.

每次和她在一起，我都会想到你，总会想起她对我有多友善，以及她有多爱你。

I always think of you when I'm with her, and I always think about how kind she was to me and how she loves you.

我知道。

I know.

我希望我能让她看到

I wish I could She see

她爱你。

loves you.

我们会去的。

We will go.

我们会回去的。

We will go back.

她想

She wants

去吸大麻然后看《黑道家族》。

to get stoned and watch the Sopranos.

哦，咱们赶紧走吧。

Oh, let's fucking go.

给我们做点千层面吧。

Make lasagna for us.

天啊。

Oh my god.

这听起来太棒了。

That sounds fucking awesome.

她真的很棒。

She's she's amazing.

詹娜·罗斯塞塔诺。

Jenna Rossetano.

詹娜·罗斯塞塔诺。

Jenna Rossetano.

一个意大利女人嗑了药，然后看《黑道家族》。

A Italian stone getting ripped and watching the Sopranos.

她他他妈的

She's the fucking

每一个，我只是，天啊。

every I just oh god.

对不起，我的混乱。

I'm sorry, my mess.

我的意思是，不。

I mean, no.

我的意思是，从整体上看，这真的是一件疯狂的事。

I mean, like, it is it is such a crazy thing in totality.

比如，有很多时候我看着它，心里想：我简直不敢相信这真的发生了。

Like, there have been so many moments where I'm watching it, and I'm like, I can't believe this is happening.

我简直不敢相信这真的发生了。

I can't believe this is happening.

然后在某个时刻，这种转变变成了我完全沉浸在这种体验中，接着看着你出演这部剧。

And then at some point, that transition to, like, me, like, completely just, like, marinating in this experience and then, like, of watching you do this show.

然后它在那一刻结束了，我当时独自一人观看，感觉太疯狂了。

And then it ended in that moment, and I was like I I was like I was, like, alone watching it, which felt so crazy.

当然。

Of course.

而且，当然，我们所有朋友都在从你的化妆室给我发消息，他们都在那儿。

And, like, of course, all of our friends are texting me from the the your dressing room, and, like, they're all there.

我能闻到、感受到那种气氛。

And I I could, like, smell it and feel it.

我能感觉到房间里有多热。

I could feel how hot it was in the room.

我就想，天啊。

Like I was just like, god.

真的就是这样。

Like, it really is.

但那感觉并不像结束，反而有种尘埃落定的感觉。

But it didn't feel it it felt conclusive.

是的。

Yes.

它并不像终结。

It did not feel final.

哦，有意思。

Oh, interesting.

你明白我的意思吗？

You know what I mean?

我的意思是，这感觉像是为这一章画上了一个完美的句号，但并不觉得你会再回到那个节目当主持人。

Like, it felt like it was, like, a wonderful way for this to conclude this chapter, but it didn't feel like like, you'll be back on that show hosting.

你明白我的意思吗？

Like, you know what I mean?

而且我觉得你能和这个节目以及所有在那里工作的人保持如此美好的关系，真是太棒了。

Like and I think it's so great that you get to have this great relationship with the show and everyone that works there.

而这一切能如此美好地结束，我认为这为珍娜的说法提供了充分的合理性。

And, yeah, I mean, just for it to end that wonderfully, I think, gives all the validity to what Jenna is saying.

如果你没有像一个专业人士、一个善良的人、一个像你这样有才华的人那样去做，事情就不会是这样了。

It would not have been that way had you not done it like a pro, like a kind person, and like a talent like the talent that you are.

这真暖心。

So That's sweet.

我脱帽向你致敬。

I take my hat and all my clothes off to you.

哦。

Oh.

我光着身子。

I'm naked.

如果你没看到，我完全赤身裸体。

If you can't see, I'm completely nude.

在这次采访、这次告别采访——就叫这个吧——和鲍文的访谈中，我一直赤身裸体。

I've been completely nude doing this interview, this exit interview, title of that, with Bowen.

在我们聊热衷的竞争或者别的什么之前，你还有什么想说的吗？

Is there anything else you wanna say about it before we talk about heated rivalry or whatever the fuck?

有。

Yes.

我需要指出的是，我们直到周六才确定她会不会参与。

I need to just point out the share element of it, which was we weren't sure if she was gonna do it, down to, like, Saturday.

是的。

Yeah.

因为我们写了好几个不同的版本。

Because it was like we wrote a bunch of different versions of it.

她只是想要一些备用的台词，因为她会告诉你。

And she, you know, she just wanted spare dialogue because it's like a she will tell you.

她是一位读写障碍的偶像。

She's a dyslexic icon.

是的。

Yes.

天哪。

Oh my god.

等等。

Wait.

我们也没谈过她的回忆录，不过无所谓。

We haven't also haven't talked about her memoir, which whatever.

我们会的，斯蒂芬妮·J。

Well, we will Stephanie J.

她们轮流朗读，由切丽和斯蒂芬妮·J·布洛克一起完成，因为她会说：‘你会注意到，除了我之外，还有别人参与了有声书，那就是出色的斯蒂芬妮·J·布洛克，她在《切丽秀》里扮演了我。’

Block doing the it trades trades off off between between Cher and Stephanie J Block doing the reading together because she's like, you're gonna notice that someone besides me is on the is on the audiobook and it's the wonderful Stephanie J Block who played me in the Cher show or whatever.

顺便说一下，好吧，我们本来是

By the way, okay, we were That's

斯蒂芬妮·J·布洛克能拿到这个角色真是太棒了。

so what a gig to score for Stephanie J Block.

是啊。

Yeah.

这真是个绝佳的机会。

That's such a gig.

我们本来要分享家庭聚会。

We were to share family reunion.

它没成功，但我和塞莱斯特在周三跑遍了所有演员的办公室，因为他们说：‘别分享。’

It did not get it it did not go, but I but Celeste and I had the perfect experience of running around on Wednesday to all the cast's offices because they're like, don't have a share.

我说：‘直人根本不需要分享。’

I'm like, straight people don't have a share.

同性恋者才需要。

Gay guys do.

是的。

Yeah.

每个同性恋者都有同样的份额。

Every gay guy has the same.

每个同性恋者都有同样的份额。

Every gay guy has the same share.

呵呵呵。

Ho ho ho.

呵。

Ho.

你知道吗，他们某种程度上理解了那是什么。

You know what Like, they kind of understood what that was.

醒醒吧。

Snap out of it.

我得告诉他们关于‘醒醒吧’的事，我得跟他们讲清楚，我得教阿什莉·帕迪拉。

Had to tell them I had tell about snap I had to tell them about snap out of it, but it's like, I I had to teach Ashley Padilla

你得跟别人讲‘醒醒吧’这件事？

You had to tell people about Snap Out of It?

那太棒了。

It was beautiful.

哦，不。

Oh, no.

不。

No.

根本不用跟他们讲‘醒醒吧’这件事。

Didn't have to tell them about Snap Out of It.

人们再也不了解这种文化了。

People just don't know the culture anymore.

人们真的不再了解这种文化了。

People just don't know the culture.

这并不是为了评价谢丽尔的遗产或文化影响。

And this is not a not this is not just to to to, like, evaluate anything about Cher's legacy or cultural impact.

这纯粹就是一种同性恋者骨子里喜欢谢丽尔的现象。

It's just that, like, it's a gay guy thing to, like, have Cher in their bones.

嗯。

Mhmm.

无论如何，我们不确定谢丽尔会不会参与。

Anyway, we weren't sure if Cher was gonna do it.

然后周六她确认了。

Then Saturday she confirms.

我们太兴奋了。

We're so excited.

然后呢，你知道的，她一直都是那个说了算的人。

And then she, you know, she was always gonna be the boss.

但后来我们给她写了一些很犀利、带点挖苦的台词。

But then like, we wrote we wrote her like, it's like some zingy, like roasty lines.

原话大概是这样的：我那时候说，你对我有什么反馈吗？

Like, the original line was something along the lines of like, I was like, do have any feedback for me?

她会说，像你这样的人，对我来说都太gay了，之类的话。

And she would say something like, you know, even for me, you were a little bit too gay or something like that.

但她又说，我想，我不，她说，我想表现得友善一点。

But then she was like, I wanna I don't she was like, I wanna be kind.

她说，我能直接说你太完美了吗？

She was like, can I just say like you were perfect?

她还说，我就想亲他一下，嗯。

And she was like, just want I just wanna kiss him Yeah.

或者类似的话。

Or something.

然后我们还得去向她推销，说如果她能在结尾和我们一起唱歌就好了。

And then like and then we had to we had to go and like pitch to her that she would maybe sing if we would love for if she sang with us at the end.

是的。

Yeah.

因为那也是一个未知数。

And because that was a question mark too.

然后我去了她的化妆间。

And then we go down I I go to her dressing room.

天啊。

Oh, man.

我说，是《请来过圣诞节》这首歌，由老鹰乐队和查尔斯·布朗演唱过，你翻唱过。

And I was like, so it's Please Come Up For Christmas by the Eagles and Charles Brown, you've covered it.

我很喜欢你在专辑里翻唱的这个版本。

And I loved your cover of it on the album.

她问：‘好的，但你希望我唱哪一部分？’

And she was like, okay, but what part do you want me to sing?

我当时说，就只是结尾部分。

And I was like, it's just gonna be the end.

所以你要不要先跑一遍？

So do wanna run it?

我当时说

And I was like

天哪。

Oh my god.

我说，不会再有悲伤，没有你的悲痛和痛苦。

I was like, there'll be no more sorrow, not your grief and pain.

然后，就像这个麦克风离我有多远，她就离我有多近。

And then as far away from me as this microphone is, she's like she's like this close to me.

然后以全部的力量唱出来。

And then with the full force of share.

我的天。

My god.

她说了，

She goes,

不，要开心。

no, be happy.

求你了，女士。

Please, ma'am.

那是我，它并不是

That's a I that it wasn't

那样。

like that.

她根本没有拉屎。

She did not crap.

但她只是给了我满满的惊叹。

But she just gave me full full Wow.

强制释放。

Force Directed out.

我当时就觉得，好像一张卡片撞到了我身上。

And I was like, it felt like a card crashed into me.

我当时说：‘是啊。’

I was Yeah.

我真的不敢相信。

I'm I can't believe.

我简直不敢相信。

I can't believe

每一秒都。

Every second of

那件事。

that.

她做到了。

She did that.

是啊。

Yeah.

总之，

Anyway,

这就是我所有的了

that's all I have

要说了。

to say.

我们来谈谈激烈的竞争吧。

Let's talk heated rivalry.

他已经结束了对话，各位，尽管这是我的采访。

He has ended the conversation, everybody, even though this was my interview.

哦，好吧，你还想问别的吗？

Oh, well, anything anything else you want to ask?

你一直渴求不已。

You've been so thirsty.

不太想。

Not really.

我都知道。

I do know all of it.

正如我所说，你无法用任何事让我震惊。

Like I said, you can't shock me with anything.

嗯。

Yeah.

我不确定。

I I don't know.

还有别的吗？

Is there anything else?

我的意思是，没什么了。

I mean, not really.

我想，接下来是什么？

I guess, what's next

对你来说？

for you?

哦。

Oh.

你接下来做什么？

What is next for you?

等等。

Wait.

接下来呢？

What's next?

我们该说点什么吗？

You should we say anything?

精彩的事情。

Wonderful things.

嗯，我喜欢这个，比如鲍文在《周六夜现场》之后的首个重要项目是两个家伙的五场赛车。

Well, I love this, like, press run of, like, Bowen's first major project post SNL is two guys' five races.

哦，我喜欢这个。

Oh, I love it.

并不是我不

It's not that I'm

不觉得荣幸能成为SNL之后的第一个项目，是的。

not honored to have that technically be the first project Yeah.

SNL之后，但我觉得，咱们还是别了。

Post SNL, but it's like, well, let's not.

是的。

Yeah.

我们正在做的奥运会播客。

The Olympics podcast we're doing.

我的意思是，我们要去米兰。

I mean, we are going to Milan.

我们接下来几个月其实会非常有趣。

We actually we have a very fun next few months.

是的。

Yes.

这很有趣，因为我们确实得把这部电影拍出来。

So it's funny because, like, we do have to we have to execute this movie.

是的。

Yes.

我们得写我们的书。

We have to write our book.

是的。

Yes.

我们还得把新文化奖筹备起来。

We got to get the New Culture Awards together.

那一定会非常有趣。

That's gonna be very fun.

我们还有一些没在行业媒体上公布的事情，但有一长串待办事项。

We have to we have some other things that are have not hit the trades, but there's there's a long list of things.

所以另一件事是，说实话，你继续参与这个节目真的不现实，因为我们即将

And so that's another thing is I was like, to be honest with you, it, like, really wasn't tenable for you to keep working on the show because we're gonna

很快就会欠这些人钱。

be in debt soon to these people.

是的。

Yes.

我觉得这太令人兴奋了。

Like which is so exciting, I think.

根本就不是在想下一步该做什么。

It's like there is it's it's not even like, what's the next act?

下一步是存在的。

It's like, there is a next act.

等等看吧。

Just wait.

就像你不需要

Like, it's like you don't have

决定任何事情。

to decide on anything.

如果你在自己的盘子里加点东西，那很好，但你其实根本不需要，比什。

If if you added things to our and your plate, that would be great, but you don't even need to, Bish.

我只是想让你知道，你一直以来的节奏和所承担的工作量都是不正常的。

And and I just wanna make sure that you know that the pace at which you've been going and the workload that you've had has been abnormal.

所以接下来你会感觉轻松一点。

And so it's gonna feel a little bit like less.

我觉得特别有意思的是，我拥有过完全不同的另一段职业生涯，不同于你所经历的。

And I just I feel like as someone who it's really interesting because, like, I have had this whole other, like, career outside of, like, what you've had.

我觉得你在这部剧里整整发展了七年半，方方面面都经历了。

Like, I feel like you got to develop for such a for seven and a half years at this show and, like, everything.

而我的简历则有点不一样。

And my resume is, like, a little bit different.

对我来说，那是一大堆其他的事情。

Like, for me, it's like a ton of other things.

我有很多不同的经历。

And I've a lot of different experiences.

而你

And you're

你在这所有方面都完美极了。

you're so perfect at all of them.

但我想，有时候这是因为当你和别人紧挨着的时候，你就会不自觉地拿自己和他们比较。

But, well, I do think that sometimes it was a little bit like because it's like when you are right next to someone else, like, all you have to do is, like, compare yourself to them.

你明白我的意思吗？

It's like you know what I mean?

就像姐妹之间，或者双胞胎之间。

It's like with, like, sisters or, like, twins.

如果其中一个人发生了什么事，另一个人几乎会想：为什么这件事没发生在我身上？

It's like if something happens to one, the other one almost feels like, why isn't it happening to me?

所以我确实觉得，有时候我会过度纠正，拼命地逼自己，确保我能和你同步发展。

So I do feel like sometimes I would, like, overcorrect and, like, really, really, really push myself to make sure that, like, I would develop in an equal way alongside of you.

而且在很多方面，我觉得——但其实我的感受并不重要，因为只要你存在、工作、关心，你自然就会成长。

And, like, in so many ways, I feel like and it doesn't really matter what I feel like because as a result of existing and working and and and caring, you do develop.