内向者与外向者如何成为更好的朋友

这里是NPR的《生活指南》节目。大家好，我是玛丽埃尔。记者Yowei Shah是个内向者，但她深爱着她的外向朋友们。她想明确表达这一点。

You're listening to Life Kit from NPR. Hey. It's Marielle. Reporter Yowei Shah is an introvert who loves her extroverted friends. She wants to make that clear.

只是有个问题：有时双方的能量场不合拍。

There's just one problem. Sometimes the energy is off.

前阵子，我和一位非常要好的外向朋友相处时，感到必须匹配对方的能量，显然我没能做到。聚会结束后，我就在想：刚才发生了什么？为什么和这个我爱的人相处会感觉这么糟糕？

The other week, I was hanging out with an extroverted friend who I love dearly, and I felt pressure to match their energy, which I obviously didn't succeed at. And after the hang, I was like, what just happened? Why does hanging out with this person I love feel so bad?

我打赌他们也不开心。

I bet it wasn't fun for them.

虽然没有统一的定义，但通常外向者往往更健谈、外向、精力充沛，热衷于社交；而内向者则更内省、安静、谨慎，非常需要独处时间。但这是个光谱而非二元对立，我们大多处于两者之间。问题是，这个连续体上有许多人就是无法真正理解彼此。

While there isn't one agreed upon definition, generally, extroverts tend to be more talkative, outgoing, energetic, and really into socializing. And introverts tend to be more introspective, quiet, deliberate, and really into alone time. But this is a spectrum, not a binary, and many of us fall somewhere in between the two. The thing is there are a lot of people along this continuum who just don't quite get each other.

而且这话题聊起来真的很尴尬，因为感觉就像在说：'我爱你，但你的个性让我很困扰'。对朋友说这种话太伤人了。

And it's, like, really awkward to talk about because it feels like you're saying, essentially, I love you, but I'm having a hard time with your personality. Like, that's that's a harsh thing to say to a friend.

Yohei是播客《代理人》的主持人，她用报道技巧专门调查这类情感难题。节目中，她会为求助者匹配一位代理人——与其问题有相关经验却无个人纠葛的陌生人。在本期《生活指南》里，Yowei与一位自称'内向者盟友'的极端外向型代理人探讨了她的困扰。这位代理人将帮助内外向者在职场建立牢固伙伴关系视为毕生事业。你将听到双方对彼此的常见抱怨，并获得实用建议，教你如何与光谱另一端的人相处得更愉快，成为更好的朋友。

Yohei is the host of the podcast Proxy where she uses her reporting skills to investigate exactly these kinds of emotional conundrums. On Proxy, she connects people with a proxy, a stranger with relevant experience with their issue and none of the personal baggage. On this episode of Life Kit, Yowei talks out her issues with a proxy, an extreme extrovert who calls herself an introvert ally and has made it part of her life's work to help introverts and extroverts create strong partnerships at work. You'll hear about the common complaints each camp has about the other and get practical advice on how to have a better time and be better friends with people on the other side of the spectrum.

詹妮弗·康韦勒拥有咨询与组织行为学博士学位，但她最初出于个人原因选择专攻内向者与外向者的研究。回溯到七十年代，当她嫁给丈夫比尔时，她从未听说过这些术语。她只知道当初吸引她的那些丈夫特质，如今却成了婚姻中的挑战。

Jennifer Conweiler has her doctorate in counseling and organizational behavior, but she decided to specialize in helping introverts and extroverts for a personal reason at first. Back in the seventies, when she married her husband Bill, she never heard of these terms. All she knew was that the qualities that had attracted her to her husband were now becoming a challenge.

有次我们从派对回家，我说'这些人可以当朋友'，还提到他们说的徒步活动。结果他毫无反应，场面冷得像蟋蟀都不叫了。我盯着他问'你怎么了？'

One time we were coming home from a party and I said, oh, we could be friends with these people. And what about that hike they were talking about? And like, I got nothing. It was like crickets. And I'm looking over at him and I'm saying, what's going on?

于是我更起劲地追问，抛出更多问题。

So I just revved it up more, asked more questions.

他当时感到困扰的是什么？后来告诉你了吗？

What was frustrating for him? Did he tell you?

我觉得他根本跟不上我跳跃的思维。在他认知里，他以为我在讨论同时处理所有事，结果就封闭自我了——因为他在反思我的提议时，我又抛出新话题。这就是外向者的思维模式：我们靠说话来思考，而内向者会内化吸收。所以我想他当时压力非常大。

I don't think he knew what to make of the spinning plates. Know, in his mind, he thought I was talking about doing everything and he would just shut down because he would reflect on my suggestions and then I was also throwing something else out there. And that's what extroverts do. We think through our talking, whereas introverts will internalize. And so he was getting, I think, very stressed out.

一周后，詹妮弗偶然做了性格测试，才第一次了解到内向与外向的概念。

A week later, Jennifer happened to take a personality assessment where she learned about introverts and extroverts.

测试显示我是外向者——毫不意外。我在纽约一个非常外向的家庭长大，事实上在遇见比尔之前都不认识几个内向者。这个认知带来了转变：我开始学习理解彼此，而不是收拾行李离开。

I learned that I was an extrovert. No surprise. I grew up in a very extroverted family in New York and, I didn't know many introverts actually until I met Bill. So I and it was just this this shift of like, oh, to not pack up and go, but to try to understand each other.

詹妮弗后来写了四本书，并进行了研究。她花了25年时间指导和培训了数千名领导者、团队和组织，帮助内向者在外向的世界中茁壮成长，并促进双方的和谐相处。

Jennifer went on to write four books, conduct research. And she spent twenty five years coaching and training thousands of leaders, teams, and organizations to help introverts thrive in an extroverted world and help the two sides get along better.

现在说到我丈夫比尔，你知道，他仍然会举起我的四本书中的一本说'读这本书'，因为我得不断提醒自己。

Now my husband, Bill, you know, he'll still hold up one of my four books and say read the book because I have to keep reminding myself.

没有举起来

Not holding up

你自己的书。如果你对性格分类过敏，我理解，这就引出了第一个要点。了解内向和外向的含义，这样你就能更好地理解自己和他人，但不要过于简化。

your own book. Now if you're allergic to personality categories, I get it, which brings me to the first takeaway. Understand what introvert and extrovert means so you can better understand yourself and others, but, like, don't be reductive about it.

还有很多其他因素。我常说就像有多副眼镜可以透过它们看世界，但不是为了给人贴标签。我依据的是与数千人共事时的亲身经历，当他们眼睛一亮时——我只能说当人们说这解释了我的某些特质时，我会说确实有些道理。

There's so many other factors. I always say pairs of glasses that you could look through, but it's not to pigeonhole. I go by the anecdotal experience I've had with, you know, working with thousands of people who their eyes light up. I mean, that's what I can just say when people say there's some some kind of an explanation for some of my characteristics. And I would say some.

快速历史课。

A quick history lesson.

在

In the

上世纪二十年代，著名瑞士心理学家卡尔·荣格创造了'内向'与'外向'这两个术语，用以描述能量的基本取向。内向意味着能量指向自我，而外向则意味着能量指向他人。但直到迈尔斯-布里格斯性格分类指标出现后，这些概念才在七十年代流行起来。迈尔斯-布里格斯后来因结果不一致及其非此即彼的二分观点（即人要么内向要么外向）而受到质疑。但他们对于内向和外向的定义至今仍占主导地位。

nineteen twenties, the famous Swiss psychologist Carl Jung coined the terms introversion and extroversion to mean basic orientations of energy. So introversion meant energy directed towards the self, and extroversion meant energy directed towards other people. But it wasn't till the Myers Briggs personality assessment that these concepts came into popular use in the seventies. Myers Briggs has since been discredited for inconsistent results and its binary view that either you're an introvert or you're an extrovert. But their definition of introversion and extroversion still dominates.

比如'内向者通过独处恢复能量，外向者通过社交恢复能量'这种观点。如今，人格科学家们坚持研究可测量的行为特征，如社交性、自信度、活跃程度、积极情绪等，并将内向与外向视为一个连续谱的两端。内向意味着偏好小群体和独处，更为内敛、冷静、谨慎、严肃；而外向则意味着寻求社交接触，享受大群体，更健谈、强势、热情。且每个人在谱系上的位置并非固定不变。

You know, the idea that introverts recharge alone, extroverts recharge with other people. Today, personality scientists stick to measurable behaviors, like sociability, assertiveness, activity level, positive emotions, and they see introversion and extroversion as opposite ends of a spectrum. So introversion means preferring small groups and solitude, being more reserved, calm, deliberate, serious. While extroversion means seeking social contact, enjoying large groups, being more talkative, dominant, enthusiastic. And where you fall on the spectrum isn't static.

情境很重要。随着年龄增长，你也可能发生变化。总之，确实存在有意义的差异，因此才会产生紧张关系。这就引出了第二个要点。

Context matters. And you can change as you get older. All's to say, yes, there are meaningful differences. Hence the tension. Which brings us to the second takeaway.

请克制评判的冲动。说实话，你可能曾对内向或外向的朋友有过微词，至少曾因他们感到沮丧。我请詹妮弗说说她最常听到外向者对内向者的抱怨。

Resist the urge to judge. Because let's be honest, you've probably talked some smack about your introverted and extroverted friends, or at the very least, been frustrated by them. I asked Jennifer to hit me with the most common complaints she hears from extroverts about us introverts.

他们动作慢吞吞的，总是停顿，说话也慢条斯理的。

They're slow. Just slow in their movements. They, like, pause, and they talk slowly.

这是

This is

听着真有意思。

so funny to hear.

还有一点是他们不怎么显露面部表情。你什么都没给我。一点都没有。给我些提示吧。

Another thing is that they don't show a lot of facial expressions. You're not giving me anything. Anything. Give me some cues.

我惊讶地发现有些研究支持所有这些观点，我稍后会思考这个问题。现在，是时候批评外向者了。以下是内向者对外向者的评价。

I was surprised to learn that there is some research that backs all of this up, which I will be thinking about at a later date. For now, time to criticize the extroverts. Here's what introverts will say about extroverts.

话太多。无法独处。讨厌沉默。不善于倾听。外向者会打断他们。

Too many words. Can't be alone. Hate silence. Poor listeners. Extroverts will interrupt them.

而外向者会这样为自己辩解：我以为你说完了。好吧。如果一直是我在说话，那全是关于我的。

And the extroverts will say, in my defense, I thought you were done with your thought. Right. If I'm talking the whole time, it's all about me.

虽然听到其他内向者分享与我相似的抱怨很解气，但詹妮弗说，对行为意义的假设是不公平的，因为这可能只是性格差异。例如，在写《对立天才》这本书时，詹妮弗采访了40对内向与外向的工作伙伴。其中一个反复出现的挑战与提问这样简单的事情有关。

As cathartic as it was to hear other introverts share some of my complaints, Jennifer says assumptions about the meaning of a behavior are unfair because it might just be personality differences. For instance, for her book, The Genius of Opposites, Jennifer interviewed 40 introvert and extrovert work partners. And one of the challenges that kept coming up had to do with something as simple as asking questions.

作为外向者，我们通过询问关于你自身的问题来建立信任，寻找共同兴趣点，比如你有没有孩子或在国内住过哪里。这让我有途径了解你。但内向者有时会觉得这很冒犯。

As extroverts, we develop trust by asking you questions about yourself, by finding some common areas of interest, if you have kids or where you've lived in the country. You know, it just, it gives me a way in to get to know you. But introverts will see that as intrusive at times.

詹妮弗采访了一位面临同样困境的女性。

Jennifer interviewed a woman who dealt with this exact dilemma.

她原以为和一位同事关系相当亲密，甚至觉得她们是朋友。但当这位同事的女儿结婚时，那个外向的同事却从未提及此事，也拒绝谈论。我问过她几次，她总是避而不谈。

She thought she was pretty close to a coworker. In fact, she thought they were friends. And her friend's daughter was getting married and this woman who's the extrovert said she never talked about it. And she wouldn't talk about it. I asked her a couple of times and she would just shut down.

后来她才明白，那位同事觉得'我们还没熟到可以畅谈所有事情的程度'——无论是作为新娘母亲面临的挑战还是喜悦。但你知道吗？她们依然保持着友谊，因为这位外向者意识到自己有些越界了。

And she learned later that that woman felt like, I don't know you well enough to really open up about all the things, challenges I'm having and excitement I'm having as the mother of the bride. But you know what? They still remained friends because this person who was the extrovert realized that she was going too far.

我得承认，我也曾觉得某些外向者问太多私人问题很失礼。或许我错怪他们了。珍妮弗建议不要急于下结论——比如当你因为内向朋友几周没回信息而恼火时，别立刻想着'他们不喜欢我'或者'这朋友真差劲'。

I gotta say, I've definitely thought an extrovert or two was being rude for asking too many personal questions. Maybe I was being unfair. Jennifer says, try not to jump to conclusions. Like, if you're annoyed at your introverted friend who hasn't texted you back for weeks, maybe don't immediately go to, oh, no. They don't like me or, ugh.

珍妮弗说自己有时也需要克制这种想法。

They're such a bad friend. Jennifer still has to catch herself sometimes.

有时我会因为某人失联而非常焦虑，特别是在当今世界，我完全不知道对方发生了什么。我那些内向的朋友可能不太习惯主动发信息说明情况，比如'最近很忙，下周再联系'——我特别喜欢他们这样做。或者问'我们一两周后通话好吗？'

Sometimes I get really upset because I haven't heard from somebody and it's, you know, I don't, I have no idea what's going on with them, especially in this world right now. And I think sometimes my introverted friends might not be as open or as clear about just even sending me a text and say, well, now it's like, I'm really busy. Let me get back to you next week. I love when they do. Or, you know, can we set up a call in a week or two?

这时我就会回答：'好的，我会再联系你。'

Or or and I'll say, fine. I'll check back with you.

二十多岁时我和朋友有过矛盾：她总想参加派对见其他朋友，而我只想单独相处。这几乎演变成了道德批判——好像不陪她做喜欢的事就不够朋友似的。

I had an issue with a friend in my twenties where she always wanted to go out to a party, to meet up with other friends. And I just wanted to hang out with her one on one. And it became almost a moral issue. Like, you're not being a good enough friend if you don't go out with me and do things that I care about.

这种情况我们很多人都经历过。我完全能理解他的感受。但你从未提起过这件事。

And that has happened with a lot of us. I I I can totally relate to him. But you never talked about it.

好吧，现在终于到了该谈谈的时候了。但该如何开口呢？该说些什么呢？《生活指南》即将为您解答。我们正在内向者与外向者关系史上迈出重要一步，试图弥合双方之间的鸿沟。

Well, it's finally time to talk about it. But how do you bring it up? What do you say? That's coming up on LifeKit. So we are taking a historic step in introvert and extrovert relations by trying to bridge the gap between the two sides.

现在是关键时刻，这就引出了第三条建议：说出你的需求，因为你的朋友不会读心术。

Now is the crucial moment, which brings us to takeaway three. Say what you need because your friends aren't mind readers.

如果我们不把这些隔阂说出来，情况就不会改善。

If we don't talk about these these disconnects, they don't get better.

例如，詹妮弗说她有时仍会对内向的朋友感到不满。

For example, Jennifer says that sometimes she still gets resentful with her introverted friends.

你知道，我有一些朋友在制定计划时非常被动，所以总是我来安排。但后来我开始对此感到不满，因为我不想总是那个主动的人。我认为这应该是共同的责任。这一点我会说出来，我会和他们沟通。

You know, I have some friends who are, like, very passive with making plans, so I'm the one that, does it. But then I start to resent that because I don't wanna always be the one. I think it should be a shared responsibility. And that that I will share, that I will talk about.

詹妮弗建议或许不要一次性提出所有问题。要关注具体行为，不要指责。她给了我一些模板用语，用来解决我和一位非常外向的挚友之间长期存在的问题。每次我们相聚时，她总是兴奋地分享个不停。

Jennifer suggests maybe don't bring up all the issues at once. Focus on behaviors. Don't blame. She gave me some template language to address an issue I've been having with a dear friend who's very extroverted. And every time we hang out, she's excited to share.

所以她分享了很多。结果我反而什么都没说。

And so she shares a lot. And then I end up not sharing anything.

有件事我想和你分享。有时候，你知道，我想说话，但总觉得没有空间让我表达想法。你觉得我们能做些什么让我感觉有表达的空间？

There's something I just wanna share with you. There are times when, you know, I I wanna talk, but I don't always feel like there's a space for me to, get my ideas out there. What do you think we could do so I could feel like I'm I got a space?

是啊。是啊。

Yeah. Yeah.

要不你多停顿一下？也许这样能给我一点插话的间隙。而我这边，我也会更主动地和你分享。因为我希望能有更平等的交流，这样你也能了解我的情况。我非常珍惜你，深爱着你。

How about if you pause more? Maybe that's something that is you know, would give me a little breath to insert. And on my part, I will be more forthcoming with sharing stuff with you. Because I just feel like I wanna have a more of a an even interchange so you can know what's going on with me too. I because I so value I love you dearly.

你是这么说的吧？对。你觉得这样会

That's what you said. Right? Yeah. Do you think that would

有用吗？

work?

说实话，我觉得和我说的这位朋友解决起来很简单，因为她非常体贴，完全愿意配合。问题在于我不习惯开口，拖了这么多年才说出来。这才是让人觉得有点遗憾的地方。

To be honest, I think the solution is very simple with this friend that I'm talking about because she is so considerate, and she would totally be down to do all these things. The issue is me not feeling comfortable speaking up and waiting for so many years to do so. That is the thing that feels kind of tragic.

这个词很重。这个词很重。我觉得如果现实地看，你很久没锻炼那块肌肉了。闲置越久，就越难重新启用。所以你不该把它搞得像件大事。

That's a strong word. That's a strong word. I think if you look at it realistically, you haven't been using that muscle. The longer you haven't used it, the harder it is to then step out. So that's why you don't wanna make a huge deal.

也许可以提一个建议。

Maybe make one suggestion.

对。对。对。

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

而且我们仍生活在一个外向主导的世界。所以外向者需要停下来多理解内向者，因为你总得适应他们。

And we still live in an extroverted world. And so the extroverts need to stop and understand more about introversion because you have to adapt all the time.

当然，也许这是个新朋友。可能现在谈这个为时过早。假设你是个外向者，刚在派对上遇到个特别投缘的人。第二天你发信息给他，他也回复了。

Of course, maybe this is a new friend. Maybe it's too early for the talk. Say you're an extrovert who's really excited about this person you just clicked with at a party. You text them the next day. They text you back.

你又发了消息。然后杳无音信。他是内向型人格正在闭关，还是对你没兴趣？珍妮弗说，原因可能有一百万种。很难猜测，但你可以试试这样做。

You text them again. Then crickets. Are they just introverted and having a hermit moment, or are they not that into you? Jennifer says, truly, it could be a million reasons. It's hard to guess, but here's what you could try.

如果没收到回复，一周后再联系一次。如果依然没回应，你得到的数据就在暗示该保持距离，或者可以过一两个月再联系。但我们也得注意别强求别人。对吧？

If you don't hear back from them, then a week later, maybe check-in again. Again, if you don't hear anything, you're getting data that's saying maybe back off or you could decide in a month or two to check-in with that person. But I think we also have to be careful to not push ourselves on people. Yeah. You know?

我总觉得如果他们对你感兴趣，自然会的。

And I always feel if they're gonna be interested in you, will be.

好的。假设你谈论了自己的需求并且进展顺利。太棒了。现在是发挥创造力的时候了，这就引出了第四个要点：当所有人的需求都摆在桌面上后，想办法找出些窍门。

Okay. But say you talk about what you need and it does go well. Amazing. Now it's time to get creative, which leads us to takeaway four. Once everyone's needs are on the table, invent some hacks.

我有个性格非常内向的朋友。我们每隔几个月会一起喝咖啡。通常都是由我先开口问'你最近怎么样？'然后就开始谈论自己，对吧？因为人们都这样。

So I have a friend who's very introverted. We meet for coffee every couple months. And I'm usually the one that starts with, how are you doing? And then I'll start talking about myself, right? Because that's what we do.

因为她总是很安静，就坐在那里默默喝咖啡。如果我突然问她'某某事你处理得怎么样了？'她会说'哦还行吧'。我不想当时就追问，所以就会开始自己说。但我已经学会了给她留出空间。

Because she's just calm and she's sitting there quietly having her coffee. Or if I throw her a question and say, How are you doing so and so? She'll be like, Oh yeah, things have been okay. And I don't wanna probe her right then, so I'll start talking. But I have learned to give space.

我会先说点自己的事，然后问'你刚才说最近很忙，发生什么了？'如果她接话，我就让她继续说下去。我会把手按住。

I'll talk a little bit about myself and then I'll say, Oh, you said you had a lot going on right now, so what's happening? If she bites, I'll let her just keep talking. I will hold my hands.

你会把双手按在桌子底下。

You'll hold your hands underneath the table.

对，我会把手放下来。这就像在提醒自己闭嘴。现在我还会戴这个小手链作为提醒物，就像是我的小锚点——'哦对，我需要倾听'。

Yeah, I'll hold my hands down. That's like shut your mouth. And then I also have this little bracelet I wear now. So it's my little anchor. Like, Oh yeah, I need to listen.

上次我这样做时，我们在那里待了一个小时。她大概讲了五十分钟。这是前所未有的情况。如果这种情况持续下去，我会有意见的。

And the last time I did this, we were there for an hour. She spoke for, I would say fifty minutes. And that's the first time that ever happened. Now I would have a problem if that continues.

对，我正想说，

Right. I was gonna say,

友谊不应该是双向交流吗？这听起来像独角戏。

isn't friendship supposed to be a back and forth? That that sounds like monologuing.

确实是独角戏，但对她来说很反常。

It was monologuing, but it was different for her.

詹妮弗说你们甚至可以共同设计一个暗号。比如当你外向的朋友约你喝奶茶，但你因连续社交和Zoom会议感到疲惫时，与其放朋友鸽子又内疚，不如说你正处于静修模式。但改成两周后约如何？这些年来我也总结了些小技巧。

Jennifer says you can even come up with a code phrase together. Say your extroverted friend asks you to get bubble tea, but you're feeling overstimulated by too much socializing and back to back Zoom meetings. Instead of leaving your friend hanging and feeling guilty, maybe you can say that you're in silent retreat mode. But what about going in two weeks? Over the years, I've developed some hacks of my own.

我给自己定下每周只社交一次的规矩，避免情绪暴躁。现在我会约朋友去按摩店，这样不用一直对视或交谈。如果不喜欢这种方式，也可以一起散步或做手工。最后记住：珍视朋友为这段关系带来的独特价值，并告诉他们。

I have a one hang per week rule so I don't get cranky. And I now invite friends to Yo Wei Shba and give massages so we don't have to look at each other or talk the whole time. But if that's not your thing, maybe you can go on a walk or craft together. And now for the final takeaway. Appreciate the unique gifts your friend brings to the relationship and tell them.

天啊，我都不知从何说起。你们让我平静下来，促使我思考。昨天我刚见过一个朋友。

Oh my god. I don't even know where to where to start. You guys calm me down. You you get me to think. I met with a friend yesterday.

我们要用所有这些想法来杯咖啡。然后他说，好吧，让我们从头开始。就在那一刻，我仿佛能呼吸了，你知道吗？你示范了如何独处、与自己相处、爱自己。

We're gonna coffee with all these ideas. And he's like, okay. Let's start from the beginning. And right then, I could just kinda breathe, you know? And you just model how you can be alone and be with yourself, love yourself.

然后我开始对此感到更加自在。我可以一直说下去。但是

And then I started becoming more comfortable with that. I could go on and on. But

我发现自己有些情绪激动。

I'm finding myself getting emotional.

听到这些真的很美好。我也对另一面感到羡慕。快速的交谈、敏捷的思维、充沛的精力和耐力。我的生活中有很多精彩的八卦，常被邀请参加有趣的派对，对生活充满热情。

That was really nice to hear. I also feel envious for the other side. Fast talking, the fast thinking, the energy, the stamina. I get so much good gossip in my life. I get invited to fun parties, and there's just, like, a zest for life.

你列举的那些太美好了。我也被感动了。我在想，如果我们能更常这样互相倾诉，那会是怎样的感觉。那种感觉会有多好。

That's so beautiful what you listed there. I got emotional too. I wonder what it would be like if we told each other that more. How good that would feel.

好了，现在来回顾一下。要点一：理解彼此的差异，但不要刻板印象。要点二：当你觉得朋友谈论自己太多或冷落你时，先停下来。不要对他们的行为妄下结论。

Alright. Time for a recap. Takeaway one, understand each other's differences, but don't stereotype. Takeaway two, before you think your friend is talking too much about themselves or ghosting you, pause. Don't jump to conclusions about their behavior.

要点三：说出你的需求。要点四：想些办法满足每个人的需求。要点五：告诉朋友你喜欢他们哪些地方。

Takeaway three, say what you need. Takeaway four, invent some hacks to meet everyone's needs. And takeaway five, tell your friend what you love about them.

那是播客《代理》的主持人Yowe Sha。在最近一期节目中，Yowe策划了一场现实中外向者与内向者的对决，让他们倾诉不满，提出那些无法对朋友启齿的问题。

That was Yowe Sha, host of the podcast proxy. For a recent episode, Yowe set up the podcast equivalent of a cage match between a real life extrovert and introvert to air their grievances and ask the questions they can't ask their own friends.

我确实觉得有时我会让人悬着心。

I do think sometimes I can just kind of leave people hanging.

这就是我作为外向者感到沮丧的时候，我会想：你为什么不现在就分享呢？

This is when I feel frustrated as an extrovert when I'm like, why don't you share that at

那一刻？太刺激了。

the moment? That was thrilling.

想收听这类对话及从家庭矛盾到乐队纠纷等难题的节目，请在任意播客平台订阅《代理》。以上就是本期节目。您订阅《生活指南》电子报了吗？每周五，您将获得由《生活指南》团队精选的健康、理财等领域的专家建议，把这当作每周一次来自《生活指南》朋友的贴心提醒吧。

To hear that conversation and episodes on conundrums from family estrangement to band drama, subscribe to Proxy wherever you get your podcasts. And that's our show. Have you subscribed to the Life Kit newsletter yet? Every Friday, you'll get even more expert advice on health, money, and more, all curated by the Life Kit team. Think of this as a weekly check-in from your friends at Life Kit.

您可在npr.org/lifekit newsletter订阅。本期《生活指南》由Sylvie Douglas制作，视觉编辑Beck Harlan，数字编辑Malika Garib，高级监制Megan Cain，执行制片Beth Donovan。制作团队还包括Andy Tegel、Claire Marie Schneider和Margaret Cerino。

You can subscribe at npr.org/lifekit newsletter. This episode of Life Kit was produced by Sylvie Douglas. Our visuals editor is Beck Harlan, and our digital editor is Malika Garib. Megan Cain is our senior supervising editor, and Beth Donovan is our executive producer. Our production team also includes Andy Tegel, Claire Marie Schneider, and Margaret Cerino.

事实核查由Tyler Jones完成，工程支持来自Stacy Abbott，特别感谢Katie Doggert。我是Mariel Segarra，感谢收听。

Fact checking from Tyler Jones. Engineering support comes from Stacy Abbott. Special thanks to Katie Doggert. I'm Mariel Segarra. Thanks for listening.