摄影师 杨彼得

节目开始前先快速说明一下。记得在Instagram上关注@RobJohnson（拼写为j o h n s t o n），网站是underexposedpodcast.com。请务必评分、评论并订阅。

A quick show note before we start the show. Make sure you follow along on Instagram underscore Rob Johnson. That's j o h n s t o n. And the website is underexposedpodcast.com. Make sure you rate, review, and subscribe.

女士们先生们，欢迎Peter Yang回到《Underexposed Podcast》。今天与我同台的正是独一无二的Peter Yang。Peter，非常感谢你能来，我真的很感激。

Ladies and gentlemen, Peter Yang. Welcome back to Underexposed Podcast. Today I am joined by the one and only Peter Yang. Peter, thank you so much for being here. I really appreciate it, man.

谢谢邀请我。

Thank you for having me.

Peter现居洛杉矶，来自伟大的得克萨斯州，为全球各地的对象拍摄。他曾与GQ、《滚石》、《Esquire》、《纽约时报杂志》合作，并为可口可乐、喜剧中心、美国银行等品牌拍摄广告，不胜枚举。从头说起吧——在你为《滚石》拍摄和做各种工作之前，肯定有过非常谦逊的起步。能说说你第一次拿起相机的经历吗？

Peter lives in Los Angeles, hails from the great state of Texas, and photographs subjects all over the world. He's worked with GQ, Rolling Stone, Esquire, The New York Times Magazine, and has shot campaigns for Coca Cola, Comedy Central, Bank of America, the list goes on. Start from the beginning here. So before you were shooting for Rolling Stone and and doing all that different stuff, I'm sure that there were very humble beginnings. So can you tell me about the first experience picking up a camera?

Peter Yang的起源故事是怎样的？

What's the origin story of, of Peter Yang?

我第一次拿起相机大概是在六七岁，在俄克拉荷马州的塔尔萨动物园。我妈给了我一个相机，那时候还是胶卷时代——在胶卷变得时髦之前，那是唯一的选择。我决定去蝙蝠洞拍照，因为蝙蝠很酷。但照片洗出来时，只有窗户上的一大片反光。我妈就说：‘就这样吧。’

The first time I picked up a camera was probably when I was six or seven and I was at the Tulsa Zoo in Oklahoma and my mom gave me a camera and it was just film back then back before it was cool. It was your only option. I decided that I want to go to the bat cave to take a picture because bats are cool. And when we got the film back, it was just like a big glare on a window. And then my mom said, that's it.

‘你拍完了。’之后我可能直到上大学才再次拍照。

You're done. And, I probably didn't take another picture until I went to college

或者

or

那张照片有点像我的第一张作品。对，我觉得那里面可能有些艺术成分，如果能重新找到那张照片的话，我们拭目以待吧。

something That's like my first photo. Yeah. I mean, I feel like, I feel like there might be something artistic about that, you know, if I can, if I can find that photo again, you know, we'll see.

确实如此。我

Yeah, for sure. I

在亚裔移民家庭长大时，从未想过自己能从事艺术相关的工作。虽然没人明确限制我，但这似乎根本不在考虑范围内。我甚至不知道那能成为职业，所以大学读了商科。当时很沮丧却浑然不觉。

think, I think growing up in kind of an Asian American immigrant family, you know, I never considered that I could do something that was, was art related. You know, I wasn't really told what I could or couldn't do, but it definitely didn't seem like, like a possibility. And I didn't even know that that was a, that was a career. So I went to school for business. You know, I was kind of bummed out about it and I didn't even know.

但从每天挣扎起床去上课就能看出来。直到看见校报招新广告，用圣诞收到的傻瓜相机去试镜。当你真正热爱某事时，那种挥之不去的兴奋感骗不了人。像我这样容易沉迷的性格，找到兴趣点后进步就很快了。

But you could tell by like how hard it is to wake up in the morning and go to classes and and, know, I was just living my life. But when I saw this little advertisement to try out for the school paper, and I did with this like point and shoot camera that I'd gotten for Christmas, you just know when you love something like the excitement, like being unable to like shake it out of your head. And as someone who's like a pretty obsessive personality, like to find something that I was so interested in, it was just kind of a quick climb from there.

这期播客我想探讨如何克服恐惧。你当时感到害怕吗？是如何突破恐惧真正走上职业道路的？

One of the things that I wanna touch on this podcast about is kind of overcoming fear. How did you feel at that time you were scared and how did you overcome that and really, you know, set out on a real career path?

恐惧的有趣之处在于，做热爱的事时恐惧会减少很多。后来我实习过几家报社，但始终痴迷于演员和奥斯卡。总在食堂捧着《娱乐周刊》读到忘我，完全沉浸在那个世界里。

I think the thing about fear that's interesting is how much less fear I had doing something I really loved. And if you, if you cut ahead into a few years, you know, I did some internships. I started out in a newspaper and I did internships at different newspapers and the whole time is like the thing I was obsessed about from the beginning was just actors and the Oscars. So you know, I always loved that world. You know, I would read like an entertainment weekly rest in peace at the school, like commissary and just get lost, like just absolutely lost in the world.

然后几小时后，我通过阅读一本杂志，慢慢找回了状态。尽管我最初从事新闻行业，但我一直对演员世界，也就是好莱坞那个圈子很感兴趣。在奥斯汀美国政治家报的第一份工作期间（当时我在德克萨斯州奥斯汀），我发现会有这些小型的媒体见面会。电影宣传人员会来到镇上。和现在不同，那时没有杂志拍摄，你只能和他们待上几小时，有时甚至大半天。

And then kind of find my way back out of it a couple of hours later, reading a single magazine. And so even though I started out in journalism, I was always really interested in kind of like the actor world, you know, the Hollywood world a little bit. And I kind of found out after my first job at the Austin American Statesman, I was in Austin, Texas at the time, that there'd be these little press junkets. And someone promoting their movie would come into town. And this isn't like now where there's a magazine shoot and you hang out with them for a few hours, sometimes the better part of a day.

这就像当地每家小报纸排着队，幸运的话你能作为摄影师获得两分钟的采访时间。我从小就是个非常害羞的孩子。但出于对这个世界的强烈兴趣，我暂时克服了羞怯——虽然现在回想起来觉得当时情况更复杂，但那时他只是传奇导演伍迪·艾伦。如今我有很多更复杂的故事，都是基于拍摄对象在拍摄后的表现。是的，我明白。

This was like a lineup of every little local newspaper and you would get two minutes with them as the photographer, if you're lucky. And I was always like a really shy, like a really shy kid. I think because I was so interested in this world, I kind of went outside of my shyness and I was dealing with, I feel like this is a much more complicated thing now, but at the time he was just the legendary director of Woody Allen. I have a lot of stories now that are more complicated based on people's performances post my photoshoot of them. Yes, understood.

总之，我当时太渴望见到他并拍照了，记得我和那位强势的公关人员反复协商。原本我只被允许在他接受记者采访时拍摄，但我坚持要布置自己的小背景，并承诺只需让他移动约18英寸。我就这样软磨硬泡，最终争取到一分钟的专属拍摄时间。这类不断突破舒适区的故事在我身上屡见不鲜，只因为我对所追求的事业怀有无比热爱。

But anyway, like I was just so obsessed about meeting him and taking the picture that I remember just negotiating with the publicist, like this high powered, you know, high powered publicist and I was supposed to just photograph when he was talking to the reporter, but I like insisted that I bring my little background. And I said I would only have to scoot him, you know, like 18 inches in the other direction. I just like wore this person down. And, you know, I got, I got a minute long shoot with him, you know, and it was just kind of story after story of me going way outside my comfort zone, just because I really, really love this thing I was trying to do.

在本期播客中，我有幸与几位摄影界的偶像对话，他们提到：如今人才济济，许多刊物却开始缩减或停刊。竞争异常激烈，脱颖而出的关键在于恪守承诺（引用那本书的说法），确保人际交往能力过硬——守时、友善、与公关高效协作并尊重对方时间。能否分享你在片场与人合作的心得？你如何在这些时刻保持专业姿态？

On the podcast thus far, I've had the great privilege of talking to some of my photography heroes and that's one of the things that they say. There's so much talent out there and then a lot of the publications are starting to either downsize or be no more. So there's a lot of competition and the one way to differentiate and to get jobs is by being impeccable with your word to quote that book and to make sure that those interpersonal skills are really there and you're punctual and you're nice and kind and you're working with the publicist in a way that's efficient and you're respectful of their time. So can you give me your insight on that, working with people when you're on set, how are you trying to carry yourself in those moments?

我一直很注重技术细节，掌握多种工作方法，对画面效果有明确构想，这节省了大量试错时间。我的思路总是很有条理，与图片编辑、艺术总监沟通时，我能系统化地阐述拍摄方案，预判潜在问题并提前讨论解决方案。

I've always been very technical. I know a lot of ways to do things, I have a very strong idea of how I want my picture to look and that's a lot of time that can be saved not fumbling around. I've always been really organized to my thoughts. So when I'm talking to photo editors, art directors, I kind of express the shoot in like a very organized way. And I kind of can think of problems before they arise and talk through things.

我觉得合作方和我交谈后，会明白我能妥善处理各种状况。我向来以好脾气著称，擅长团队协作——当然希望摄影技术也够好。这些特质对我来说比较自然。真正的挑战在于我是个深度内向者，通常尽可能避免与人交谈。

And I feel like maybe talking to me they know like, I'll just handle it one way or another. I think I've always been like a nice guy, you know, and someone who seems collaborative and I don't know, hopefully I'm good at photography. So I feel like those things are the things that came a little easier to me. The things that were really, really hard is I'm kind of a major introvert. I generally would prefer not to talk to people if possible.

与拍摄对象交流对我而言极其可怕，这个障碍花了很长时间克服。早期拍摄时，人们常误认我的助理是摄影师——因为我总下意识回避被认出来。承担摄影师的身份责任让我压力很大，我想象中摄影师应该像《王牌大贱谍》里那种夸张形象，需要某种掌控力，而我从未觉得自己具备这种自信。但随时间推移，你会逐渐变得从容。

And speaking to my subjects is really, really, really scary for me. And that took a really long time. I think earlier on my shoots, people would come and not know who the photographer is, they would always come to my assistant and say, Are you the photographer? Because I would consciously try to shrink away from being acknowledged, you know, as the photographer in any way, because that's a lot of responsibility, because I would see, you know, through how I imagine other photographers to be, the caricatures like the yeah, baby, Austin Powers one, but like, there's a certain command that photographer supposed to have, and I never felt like I had it and I never felt confident to express that. But I think over time you just become a lot more, you just become like a lot more comfortable.

所以我认为那些是我天生擅长的事情，但在与被拍摄对象和公关人员沟通方面，过去我常常逃避将照片视为一个整体的责任，而是只专注于把光线调整得更好一点。后来我意识到，这其实是在回避拍摄中更为重要的事情。现在，虽然我仍会做些灯光布局图之类的工作，但大部分时间都花在与拍摄对象、公关人员、化妆发型师和布景师交流上，我确实把照片当作一个整体来对待。

So I think those were the things that came really natural to me, but in terms of kind of communicating with the subjects and communicating with publicists, back in the day I would kind of avoid my responsibility of looking at the picture as a greater whole and I would focus on just getting that lighting a little bit better. And then I realized that that was kind of a crutch towards some much more important things to the shoot themselves. So now instead of, you know, I do my little lighting diagrams and so on, but I spend most of my time speaking with my subject, with the publicist, with hair makeup, with sets, like I definitely treat the photo as a whole.

今天我想尝试探讨的是分析一些案例研究和单张照片。首先我想讨论的是——对于正在关注的观众，可以访问peteryang.com——鉴于现场很多都是人像摄影师，我们就从你常用的白色无缝背景肖像开始吧。为什么你经常选择白色背景？这种背景有种镜面反射的特质。能否谈谈你是如何实现这种效果的？还有在影棚里与艺人合作时，为什么你倾向于选择较明亮的布光方案？

One of the things that I wanna try and test out today is to look at some case studies and some individual pictures. So one of the things that I wanna initially talk about and for those of who are following along, it's peteryang.com. And I guess we'll start off with the white seamless background portraits that you're doing since a lot of people here are portrait photographers and stuff. Why is it that you choose to shoot on white a lot and there's this specular quality to it. Can you maybe talk about how you're achieving that effect and you know when you're working on set in the studio with entertainers why is it that you choose to go along you know the brighter side of things?

我天生就偏爱不太宽泛但略带灰调的背景，从米白到浅灰再到中灰。如果由我决定，所有背景都会是白、黑、灰这些中性色。这样当我与想增添色彩的设计师合作时反而有帮助，因为我总期待别人能打破我的个人美学框架。关于你提到的镜面光效，最简单来说——刚入行时我常用白色光源，比如白色柔光箱（当然我指的是内衬颜色）。

I'm just naturally really drawn to not so much wide but kind of off anywhere from from an off white to a light to mid Gray kind of for backgrounds. If it were up to me, everything would be. White and black and Gray and you know neutral colors and and it helps when I work with stylists and other people who wanna color things up a little bit because I'm always looking for people to push me out of my personal aesthetic. But in terms of lighting, you had noted that it was specular and I think the easiest way to say it is when I started out I was using a lot of white sources, you know, like white soft boxes, you know, I'm talking about the interior of course. Yeah.

白色柔光箱、白色反光伞。但很久以来我改用银色内衬的器材了。现在我偏好使用硬光源，比如Profoto Magnums这类模拟太阳光的大口径反光罩，能产生很硬的阴影。而当我使用八角柔光箱和抛物线反光器时，它们内部都采用珠面银涂层，这会给皮肤带来完全不同的光质。

White soft boxes, white umbrellas. And for quite a while now I use interiors that are silver. You know, I tend to use very hard sources like, know, Profoto Magnums and these big dishes that emulate the sun, you know, very hard shadows and stuff. And then when I use when I use Octabanks and parabolic reflectors, they're they're always kind of beaded silver on the inside. So that really gives like a different quality of light to the skin.

这种光更具镜面反射特性，更有活力，但需要更精准控制，因为稍有不慎就会过度。对某些人可能会显得太强烈。

It's more specular. There's a little bit more life to it. You just have to be a little bit more precise because it can. Also take you to crazy town a little bit. It could be a little intense on people.

所以我觉得任何技巧都需要练习。现在观察大多数人时，我能通过他们的肤质和骨骼结构判断适合使用哪种控光配件。白色内衬的器材我仍在使用，有些人就指定要那种效果。布光时我特别崇尚自然光理念，喜欢将环境光与影室灯混合使用，寻找两者间的平衡点。

So I think with anything with a little bit of practice. I think when I look at most folks, I can kind of look at their skin type and and look at their their bone structure and sort of feel what range of. What range of modifiers I can use and I do still use white ones. Some people are just asking for that white interior, so that's definitely still in the mix. Whenever I'm doing lighting, really like this idea that it exists in the natural world and I really like to mix available light with strobe and finding the balance between the two.

实现方式可以很多样，但核心在于环境光与人造光之间微妙的平衡。拍摄艺人时尤其有挑战——他们总爱选在上午11点到下午1点这个时段。我经常遇到公关盯着日照表说：'太阳高度还不够，我们要等到正午顶光时刻。'

And it can happen a lot of different ways, but it's sort of this like nuanced balance between the light that's there and the light that I'm adding. And one of the challenges I think especially if you're shooting entertainers is they love that block of time right between like 11AM and 01:00. I can't tell you how often I get it where I swear the publicist is like looking at the light chart and they're like, Nope, the sun's not high enough yet. We're gonna wait till it's right up there on the top.

就在那边。

Right over.

对，现在高度还不够。我们要确保灯光是真正的蓝色且顶部充足，因为我可不想让我的客户在任何角度看起来好看。不，我开玩笑的，开玩笑的。

Yeah. It's not quite high enough yet. Let's make sure that lights real blue and real toppy because I don't want my client to look good in any capacity. No, I'm just kidding. Kidding.

不，他们的意思是他们从一个地方过来，要去另一个地方，六点有晚餐，所以你中午可以给他们拍照。

No, what they're saying is they're coming from something and they're going to something and they have a dinner at six so you get to shoot them at noon.

对，太酷了。

Right. So cool.

对我来说，我不太喜欢在他们上方放小柔光罩或直接遮挡光线，我还是喜欢尽可能利用强烈的阳光。所以我找到了一种方法，尽可能利用阳光，再用镜面光源补光，让效果看起来——我不会称之为自然，可能会说有点超现实。基本上，如果你用太阳光，那是非常硬的，我不确定是否该称之为镜面光，可能不是。可能术语不对，但它是某种——我会说它非常像太阳光。

And for me, it's like, I'm not like I'm not so into like putting the little diffuser above them or just cutting the light and you know, I still like to use that hot sun as much as possible. So I kind of figured out a way that as much as possible we can still use that sunlight and I can fill it in with specular sources and have it feel, I wouldn't call it natural, would call it probably a little hyper real. Essentially if you're using the sun which is a very hard, I don't know if I'd call it specular, it probably isn't. It's probably not the right term but it's something, I would say it's very sun like.

对。

Right.

如果你用镜面光源填补那些阴影，我觉得会平衡得多。如果用那种白色柔和光源，感觉就像另一种效果了。

If you fill in those shadows I think using a specular source it balances a lot more. If you use like kind of a white soft source it feels like a separate look.

是的，有一张康纳·麦格雷戈的照片，他正朝镜头走来。我觉得这张照片抓住了你说的那种感觉，因为他在户外，身后是那种工业风格的装卸区。阳光从右侧照射过来，让我猜猜看...可能是一把巨大的银色反光伞，或者我的第二猜测是美颜碟。我说对了吗？

Yeah, there's this picture of Conor McGregor that he's kind of walking towards the camera. I think that kind of captures what you're talking about because he's outside, he's by, he has like this sort of industrial looking like loading dock behind him. And then the sun is coming so if I had to guess the sun is coming from the right hand side and then you have let me see if I can guess. Maybe like a a big giant silver umbrella or my second guess would be a beauty dish. Am I right?

我认为那要么是七英寸银色栅格反光板，要么是马格南反光板。就在相机附近或稍后一点的位置。这是个很好的例子，看起来非常自然，但又增强了效果。普通人看会觉得就是日光，但作为摄影师，你知道如果没有补光，那些阴影会暗得多。如果把灯光调得太亮，就会产生不同的效果，看起来会像派对闪光灯那种感觉。

I think that is either a silver seven inch grid reflector or a magnum reflector. That's kind of right by the camera or a little back. I think, yeah, I think that's a good example of like, having it look really natural, but just punching in, you know, I think most people looking at it, it just kind of feels like daylight. But you know, as a photographer, you know, like those eyes would be way darker if there wasn't some type of fill. And if turn that light way up, it's going to have a different look, It's going to feel very like sort of party flash looking.

所以关键在于找到合适的曝光量。另一个要点是考虑到光线衰减的特性，我通常手持灯光（毕竟我们在走动），但会让助手站得稍远些。这样当拍摄对象移动速度变化时，光线变化不会太明显。如果站得太近，光线变化就会很大。我认为在摄影中学到最重要的就是理解光线衰减，知道何时该靠近打光，何时该远离。很多人教打光时喜欢靠近制造柔和效果。

So it's kind of finding that right amount of exposure. And the other kind of key to that is, you know, with the way light falls off, I usually have the light handheld, of course, because we're walking and we're moving, but I try to have my assistant stand a little further away and that way with light fall off. Then if the subject moves slower faster, the lights not affected as much versus if if they're standing closer than then the light variation really changes a lot. So, I think the last big thing I learned in photography in regards to this and a lot of other stuff is just the idea of light fall off and when to put the light very close and when to put the light very far away. And I think a lot of times the way people teach how to light things is they like, put it closer and make it softer.

存在一个魔法距离。就我而言，大多数时候我都在尝试让光源越来越远，而不是越来越近。

There's a magic distance. And I think for me. More often than not, I'm trying to get the light further and further away, not, not closer,

你这么说很有意思，因为我也有类似经历。我看YouTube教程时，他们总是用巨大的光源，用C型支架直接放在头顶像派拉蒙式打光，确实能产生漂亮的光效。但我崇拜的那些摄影师却用银色反光伞放得很远，或者把美颜碟放在奇怪的位置。比如维多利亚·威尔会用那些小伞状设备，甚至都没对准拍摄对象。我就在想这是什么原理？可能这需要长时间实验才能掌握，线上教程教的多半是容易上手、能立即应用的柔光技巧。

That's interesting you say that because I've kind of having a similar experience. Because I would take these classes on YouTube and stuff and they're they'd like just get a big giant light source and just like get a frigging C stand and just put it right above their head like Paramount style and that would be like big beautiful light but then I see the people that I look up to and they're they have like these silver umbrellas and they're kind of like far away or they'll have a beauty dish and have it like wait you know have an assistant holding it in this like obscure place Or like Victoria Will, she shoots with these like little umbrella things that are kind of like not even pointed in like the general direction of the subject. I'm like, what is happening? And I think that there's probably a level of experimentation that comes at time that you may not be able to get watching you because I think a lot of times that they're just when you're doing online learning, they're probably just trying to do something that's a good, something that somebody could take in a practical application and just apply to their subject and get nice soft light.

但根据你说的，你想要的是与众不同的效果。

But I think that based on what you're telling me that you wanna have something that looks different.

有人说一万小时能成为专家。我觉得光是弄懂你说的这些YouTube上的内容就需要一万小时。我现在几乎不用教程里教的那些方法，但理解那些基础非常重要，那是这类商业人像摄影的根本。随着时间推移，你会找到适合自己的方法。而且现在摄影界的趋势是追求看起来完全没经过打光的效果。

They say you can become an expert in ten thousand hours. I think it takes ten thousand hours to get good at just what you're talking about, you know, on YouTube. I think what you're talking about, I probably do very few of any of those things you would learn on a lesson, but I think it's really important that you understand all of that stuff because that's the fundamental of, I think portrait photography of this kind of biz. But then over time you learn kind of what works for you and what works in different situations. And I also say a trend in photography right now is pictures that look very unlit.

比如不久前，我们拍了一张室内照片，需要调整主光或补光，你会平衡所有光线。那时感觉非常非常棒，完美无缺。而现在他们采用所谓的‘粗暴打光法’，就是用硬反光灯随便往房间角落一打，甚至不在主体正前方，而是侧面，地面反射一道，墙面反射一道。再加上其他20个正确决策，最终呈现的画面非常自然、现代且极具冲击力。但如果没有这些经验积累，也可能拍出史上最糟糕的照片。

For example, some time ago, we had a shot of photo inside, would have your key or fill your kicker, you would balance it all. It would feel very, very lit and very perfect. And now they do what would be called like bash lighting, which is just taking a light with a hard reflector and throwing it off in a corner of a room, not even in front of the subject, of to the side, shoot one off the ground, shoot one off the wall. And that coupled with 20 other correct decisions creates a picture that's very natural, very modern, very impactful. But if you don't have, I think the experience of all the other things, it can also just create like the shittiest picture ever made.

所以我认为，尤其对非技术型人士来说，关键是要掌握几种万能布光方案，能适应各种场景。每次拍摄前我都会尽量充分准备——查看场地照片。如果你看到我的电脑，肯定觉得我是全球最变态的跟踪狂，因为我总在研究卫星视图，观察房屋结构。

You know, so I think, I think for me a really important thing is that, especially if you're not a really technical person, is to have like a few lighting setups that just work for you, that work in any situation. And I think anytime I go into a shoot, think about First of all, try to do as much prep as I can. I try to get pictures of the photo. If you look at, if you look at like my computer, I just look like the world's biggest stalker because I'm on satellite view. I'm seeing like what's in the house.

我会研究太阳方位，根据观察到的信息构思拍摄方案。参考房产照片盘算：那面墙可以利用，那个时段阳光正好。但终极保障是我卡车里的无缝背景布——万一搞砸了，随时能贴墙上完成拍摄。

I'm seeing what direction the sun is. I'll kind of mood board the shoot just based on all the things I think I see. We go to realty photos, just I can use that wall. The sun is there at that time. But ultimately there's almost always a seamless in my truck and it's like if it all goes to hell, we can stick a seamless on a wall and get this shot.

这不仅有助于提升成片率，更重要的是避免焦虑。你不想赶到现场才手忙脚乱地解决问题。带着这种禅定般的从容，知道即使突发状况也能完成任务，才能真正静下心来观察环境，最大化利用现场条件。

Then that kind of, I think not only does that help the photo be more successful but it, you don't want to go to a shoot all stressed out and figuring things out as soon as you get there and then you're all, you know you want to go in there with some type of Zen quality and knowing that that if shit hits the fan, you can still get this photo is very relaxing. And then you can really like look around and decide how to make the best use of that environment.

在你海量作品中挑最爱就像选亲生孩子。不过今天推广你上节目时，我特别中意那张吉米·法伦的肖像。可能部分因为他的西装，但光线质感实在绝妙——灰调背景带着渐变层次。

Of all the pictures that you have, there are so many. It's like picking a favorite child. There really are so many, but one of the ones that I've been using in promotion of you coming on the show, I'm super happy about today is that picture of Jimmy Fallon. I think I might just like his suit but the quality of light in that is really great. Sort of a gray background, there's sort of this gradient thing happening in the background.

我会为听众附上链接。能聊聊那次拍摄吗？你刚提到常与吉米合作，说说如何实现那些视觉效果？

I'm gonna link it up for people that are listening but can you maybe talk about that and I know that you mentioned before this that you work with Jimmy a lot and you know, tell me about that shoot and how do you kind of achieve some of those looks?

那是我最爱的拍摄类型：由顶尖造型师布莱恩打造惊艳造型，我负责受高级时装启发的布光——纯白背景渐变成灰。吉米自带气场，说实话这是早年的作品，具体细节记不清了，但基本就是他自己发挥，我只需布光抓拍。旁边那张他头顶电视机喝威士忌的怪诞照片倒是我的天才创意，当时自认为能打满分。

Well that's my favorite type of shot which is just me, which is a stylist like Brian who's an amazing stylist, killing it with his look. And I'm just doing like a lighting that's inspired by kind of high fashion, you know, on a white psych falling off to a gray. And Jimmy's just doing his thing like I, this was, this was, this was a while ago. So I don't remember how that exact moment happened, but I'm pretty sure he just, he just did it, you know, so all I had to do is light the picture and capture the moment and he did most of the work. The one next to it with the crazy TV on his head and him drinking the whiskey was sort of like, was sort of my brilliant idea, you know, when I came up with it, I thought it'd be a 10 out of 10.

现在仔细想想，我给它的评分大概是6.5分（满分10分）。但归根结底，我来拍摄时总会带着些古怪滑稽的创意，不过我也非常乐意让拍摄对象自由发挥。当我拍摄人物照片时，我的目标不是让他们成为我个人风格或审美的体现——我真正想要捕捉的，是他们的表演状态，希望照片能记录下他们的表演瞬间。有时在某些场景中，我纯粹是在记录他们的表演；有时则是我的构思在引导他们。但我最不希望给人这种感觉：我搭建了场景、设计了情境、选定了人物，然后说'好了，进来按我的要求做这个滑稽动作吧，谢谢合作，再见'。至少，我希望这能像是与被摄者的一次合作。说实话我从未这样思考过，但这确实对我至关重要。

And now that I look at it, it's a solid probably six and a half out of 10. But I think ultimately, I come into shoots with kind of these like weird zany ideas, but I'm very open to someone just performing for me. I'd rather like, when I see my photos of people, my goal isn't for them to be a reflection of me or my aesthetic, like I really do want to capture, I really want them to perform and I really wanted to feel like I'm capturing their performance And sometimes in certain situations, I'm literally just capturing their performance. And sometimes it's, it's my idea helping them along, but I never, I think the thing I never want it to feel like is that I've created this set and I've created this situation and I've decided that this is the person who's gonna be in it and it's like, okay, just come in and do this funny thing I want you to do and thank you I'll see you later you know I kind of wanted to feel like at the very least it's a collaboration with the subject you know and I've actually never thought about it that way but that that is something that's really really important to me.

希望...希望这种理念能通过作品传达出来

And hopefully, hopefully it kind of shows

确实如此。

for sure.

虽然是一分钟前的事，但我很确定吉米·法伦节目里用的那盏是青铜色PAR 133灯具。

It's a minute ago, but I'm pretty sure that the source with Jimmy Fallon is a bronze color para 133.

我

I

不确定133这个型号是否正确，因为我不太擅长厘米英寸换算，但就是那种约五英尺半高的灯具。拍摄时用了中焦段镜头，背景处用大量V型反光板和遮光旗控制光线，左侧还用了吸光板来制造阴影效果。

don't know if I have the 133 right, because I'm not great with centimeters to inches, but it's the one that's like five and a half feet. So what that is, it's that light sort of in a middle zoom and then there's a lot of V flats and flags cutting light off the background and there's some negative fill to the left creating that shadow.

哇，太酷了，我超爱这个效果。

Oh, it's so cool. I love this.

你知道，与其说是我打光的方式特别，不如说人们很少想到的一种布光方法是减少光源而非增加。就像只用单一光源，然后用黑色V型挡板和黑旗进行减光处理，通过负补光来塑造画面。减法能实现的效果其实很多，但人们总习惯做加法。

You know, it's not so much, it's not so much the way I light things, but I think one way of lighting things that people don't think about so much is instead of adding more and more lights is to kind of take away lights. It's like you sort of just use your one source of light and you start subtracting light with black V flats and black flags and negative fill. And you can do a lot, you can do a lot by taking it away. People tend to think about adding more.

这太酷了，因为最终呈现的效果确实充满张力。在外行看来就像好莱坞大片的感觉，懂我意思吗？就像人们幻想中的场景。能不能聊聊那些容易被忽视的微妙细节，以及这个行业的潜规则？

Yeah that's so cool yeah because it is a really dynamic sort of photo. From the outside looking in, it's like Hollywood, you know what I mean? That's how it feels sort of thing. Sort of had this dream of what it would be like. Could you talk about sort of the subtle nuances that maybe people don't see and the politics of it?

我猜这里面肯定有好莱坞式的戏剧冲突。能分享些内幕吗？

Would imagine that there's Hollywood drama with it. Can you maybe give me some insight on that?

好的。我们具体讨论的是广告拍摄还是杂志拍摄？

Yeah. And are we talking more about like an advertising shoot or an editorial shoot?

我个人对名人肖像和杂志拍摄更感兴趣，不过广告拍摄也是我会考虑的方向。所以想了解下这些领域常见的行业现象。

For me personally, I have an interest in like editorial and celebrity portraiture, and that's sort of interesting to me, but just advertising, that's something I could see myself doing as well. So I guess a little bit of everything, but just what are some of the common things you see in those?

杂志拍摄其实更简单些。从摄影师角度来说，通常流程是杂志图片编辑联系确认档期，你答应后就开拍。不过某些大牌演员需要亲自批准摄影师人选。

Well, editorial shoot is simpler in many ways. I can just start at the beginning with that. As far as my understanding is from the photographer standpoint, for the most part, there's a photo editor at a magazine. And usually, usually they just ask you if if you're available, if you want to do it, you say yes, and you're you're shooting. For certain higher profile actors, it the photographer has to be approved by them.

有时杂志会提供几位摄影师备选，有时艺人会指定摄影师。作为摄影师最理想的状态就是成为艺人主动点名合作的对象。我有幸在几个时期获得过这样的机会，但多数时候还是通过杂志方邀约。

Sometimes the magazine will present a few different photographers. Sometimes the talent themselves will request a photographer. And that's where you want to be as a photographer, the one that talent says they want to work with. I've been fortunate to have to have that with a couple of folks at certain periods of time. But for the most part, think I'm coming in from the magazine side.

当一切准备就绪后，我们会决定是棚拍还是外景拍摄，选定一个场地。然后构思拍摄主题。如今我参与的多数是封面拍摄，这类项目资源相对充裕。我常和人说想多接些小规模拍摄，因为操作更灵活。而封面拍摄通常需要更多前期规划，不过资源也更丰富，这点很好。

And when that's all set up, we kind of decide if it's a studio shoot or a location shoot, kind of figure out a space. We figure out a concept for the shoot. Most of the shoots I do these days are cover shoots where there's a little bit some more resources. I'm always talking to people and saying I'd like to do more smaller shoots because you can just kind of go and do it. Whereas the cover shoots usually have a lot more planning, but there's more resources too, which is nice.

现在情况有些不同，我们更多是在创造那种很酷——不知该怎么形容——讨喜的照片。早年我们常拍幽默喜剧风格，虽然希望这种风格能回归，但当时需要反复磨合。比如以前为GQ拍摄喜剧专题时，我们会和艺人反复沟通四五天，不断记录创意点子，简直像《周六夜现场》的提案会。总在寻找最荒诞又能获得他们认可，同时保持美感的平衡点。

And it's a little different now because I feel like we're more in this world of just kind of making like cool. I don't know how you want to call it cool, flattering sort of pictures. Back in the day, we did a lot more humor and comedy, which I do hope comes back a little bit, but that took a lot of back and forth. I've had shoots when I used to do like humor comedy for GQ, where we'd go back and forth with talent for four or five days, be writing down ideas. It's like almost like an SNL pitch meeting, you know, and we're always trying to find the balance of the zaniest thing that would still be approved by them that would be that would be flattering and all that.

总之概念方案通过后，如今我们通常会制作情绪板来展示拍摄构想。至此，所有前期规划阶段就完成了。

So anyway, once the concept and the idea is approved, usually these days we'll create like a little mood board that shows how we see the shoot going. Then that's it. That's all kind of the planning stages of it.

你会不会经常需要周旋于公关和杂志社之间？这种场合你是选择避开吗？毕竟我猜这个层级的人都有很强的主见。

Do you ever have times where you're sort of navigating the publicist and then the magazine and do you just try and stay out of the way in those situations? Because I was, I would imagine there's a lot of strong opinions at this level.

以我现在的资历，几乎没什么事能让我压力山大了。经历过暴雨中拍摄，遇到过依赖化妆师来指导灯光的明星要求我改布光。我早把 ego 放下了，各种离谱状况都经历过，现在都见怪不怪。

In my job now, there's almost nothing that stresses me out anymore. I've had, I've had it rain on me. I've had celebrities who rely on their makeup artists to be the lighting director to make me change the lighting. Like I don't really have much of an ego. I've had all sorts of crazy shit that happened and none of it stresses me out.

唯一让我焦虑的是创作理念出现分歧，特别是客户和拍摄对象想法不一致时。对我来说至关重要的是确保拍摄对象——不管是谁——能全情投入并理解拍摄意图，因为我想成为他们的创作伙伴。只要达成共识，一切都会很顺利。

The only thing that stresses me out is when there's a disconnect in the creative, especially between what my client wants and what the subject wants. I think it's really important for me that, that the subjects, know, whoever I'm shooting is super into the shoot and they understand what it is because I, I want to be a collaborator with them. So once we're all on the same page, it's all, it's all great.

说来有趣，我在这条路上天真得可爱。一方面我的认知非常基础——这不是在讨夸奖，是事实。我有灯光设备，有相机，能拍出好照片，但真要接个助理工作的话，在专业片场肯定会手足无措。进行这些对话既让我深受启发，又时常让我意识到：我可能根本不清楚对话对象的咖位有多大。懂我意思吗？比如我和Arch Dreiber聊过天，别人听了都说'老兄你居然认识Arch Dreiber？'

It's kind of funny because I'm like blissfully naive in this journey. On the one hand I have this very like elementary understanding and that's not baiting for compliments, it's true. Like I have lights, I have cameras, I can take a good picture but I really have no idea what I was doing even if I got a job like assisting I feel like I would be probably over my head on a professional set but I'm having these conversations it's both really inspiring but it's also sometimes I don't think that I know how big the people I'm talking to are. Know what I mean? Like I talked to Arch Dreiber and people like dude you had Arch Dreiber?

就像是啊老兄，挺酷的，他是个好人。但互联网在这方面很奇怪，因为我只是远远地看着。感觉我们之间有着无法逾越的鸿沟，这其实是好事，因为像今天这样的谈话后，我会感到充满干劲，准备去擦亮我的银色雨伞，和朋友们试试看。但能和你们交流既是礼物也是诅咒，懂我意思吗？

Was like yeah man, was cool, he's a nice guy. But it's weird like the internet it's very strange in that regard because I just see it from afar. It just seems like this impossible gap between us and it's good because it like today after this conversation I'll feel really fired up and I'm gonna go dust off my silver umbrellas and try that out with my friends and stuff but it's a gift and a curse to be able to talk to you guys, you know what I mean?

太有意思了，你知道，这很有趣。关于这些我有很多延伸的想法。更多是

That's hilarious, you know, it's fun. I have so many thoughts to offshoot all of that. More of

我会说，是礼物。

a gift, I would say.

是啊。我各种想法是，我认为一个人对此的看法会随时间改变。在我二十多岁时，只想做那些我看到我最喜欢的人在做的工作。二十多岁到三十多岁，很幸运能很早开始这一切。我开始拍摄一些相当重要的东西，感觉自己正在加入那个圈子，带着年轻人的自负，自我感觉相当良好。

Yeah. Various thoughts I have is I think your perspective on this, one's perspective on this changes over time, you know, for myself in my 20s, I just wanted to do the type of work that I was seeing my favorite folks doing, you know, in my twenties into my thirties, was lucky to have a pretty, pretty early start on all this. I was starting to shoot some pretty big things and I was feeling like I was joining the club. I was feeling like the ego of the youth. I was feeling pretty good about myself.

我坦白说，但朋友们会说，我觉得你现在是前十的编辑摄影师之一。而在我心里，觉得这评价可能有点高，但大致没错。回头看，你怎么能确定谁是什么水平？现在到了这个年纪，我知道的比以往都多，探索的也比以往都多。因为积累了这么多经验，我感到前所未有的自信，但也因为方法太多而感到最不自信。

This is me being very candid, but my friends would say like, you know, I think you're one of like the top 10 editorial photographers right now. And in my mind, was like thinking that that sounded, maybe it's a little high, but it sounded about right. Whereas looking back, like, how do you even say who's what? And now as I get to this, this, this age, I'm, I know more than I ever have, and I'm searching more than I ever have. And I feel as confident because I know so much over just time, but I also feel the least confident because there's so many ways to do it.

我曾以为存在最佳或很好的方法，但现在认为只要能创作出打动人心的作品就够了。我看到很多年轻人的作品令人惊叹，在情感层面打动你。我不会那样布光，但也拍不出那么好的照片。我不断尝试扩展和成长，同时忠于自己的风格，在这些之间寻找平衡。

And I used to think that there was a best way to do it, or there is a great way to do it. But now I just think if you make a picture that impacts people, you make a picture that impacts people. I see so much work of like younger people, which I think are so amazing. Like they hit you on an emotional level, you know, I wouldn't have lit it that way, but I couldn't have made a picture that good. I've kind of had to like, I'm constantly trying to expand and grow myself while kind of staying true to whatever it is I do, you know, finding the balance of all that.

我现在感到前所未有的谦卑和感恩。告诉你，这不是回答你的问题，而是给正在收听的老听众们的——这是个很好的状态。

And I definitely feel the most humble I've ever felt. I felt the most, I feel the most grateful I've ever felt. And I'm telling you, that's a, that's just a way, it's not your question. But this is for the, these are for the old heads of the people listening. It's like a great place to be.

我大概处于人生中最快乐的阶段。另外我想说的是，我不认为那些拍过些好作品的摄影师有什么特别了不起的。真正伟大的是那些合作愉快、为人友善的同行。维多利亚就很棒——虽然我不太懂艺术，但上次交谈时他超级酷，而且关于他的评价都是赞誉之词，我觉得他对摄影界的回馈不输任何人。

I'm like the happiest that I've been probably. I think also to another point is like, I don't know that there's anything great about any photographer who's done some nice work and all that. Think you're great if you're good to work with and you're like a kind person. Victoria's awesome. I don't know art very well, but he was super cool when I talked to him last time and I only hear the greatest things about him and I think he kind of gives back to the photo community as much as anyone.

有这样高水平又乐于奉献的同仁存在真的很棒。虽然我总在探索前行，但唯一能肯定自己的是——我从事这行足够久，每次拍摄后都会反思。我的工作室经理特蕾西（我们在纽约共事十二年多了）会和我复盘每次拍摄：哪些做得好，哪些可以改进。

So it's awesome that there's folks like that out there, you know, working at his level. I feel like I'm searching and all that. But the only thing I'll like give to myself is I've thought about, I've done this long enough and I've thought about it long enough and after every shoot, you know, have a studio manager Tricia who works with me and we work very closely. She's still based in New York because I used to be there. We've worked together for twelve or thirteen years and after every shoot we kind of debrief and said what went right about the shoot, what could be better.

有时拍摄结束时会觉得'天啊简直一团糟'，我们就分析哪些是可预见的状况。我始终在优化整个工作流程。没有长期积累和反复思考的人，根本不可能轻松应对这些状况——毕竟经验来自亲历。如果说有什么优势，大概就是丰富经验带来的判断力。有趣的是，我总觉得自己在追逐下一个目标，直到偶尔更新作品网站时才会惊觉：'天！我居然拍过这么多名人？'

Sometimes at the end of a shoot when it's like, oh dear god that was kind of a shit show, we sort of talk about how, what could have been predicted, what couldn't be, like I'm constantly searching to sort of improve this whole process. And there's just no way for someone who hasn't done this so long, thought about it so much, had this many conversations to be able to handle all these situations so easily because you've just seen it before, you know, so if there's anything great or whatever, I just think there 's a great amount of experience and I try to take what I can out of that. It's funny, like the way I perceive myself is I'm always onto the next thing and I'm always trying to do something different or better. And once in a while when when I looked at my website, it's usually when I need to change it because it feels like out of date. It's kinda like, holy shit, I met all those people?

这种感觉非常超现实，因为与我自我认知完全不符。我始终认为自己只是个竭力避免搞砸的普通人，从不会用工作成就来定义自己。

It's like super, super surreal because it's not kinda how I identify. I just identify myself as someone trying to not fuck it up basically every So I definitely don't identify myself as whatever my work is.

这个观点很棒。

That's a great point.

所以...这个问题或许没有标准答案，但

So yeah, I don't know if there's any answer to it, but

你刚才说的全是金句。我逐渐明白这是压力与时间共同作用的结果（虽然我每期播客都提这事）。我试图厘清自己感受的过程，或许对他人也有价值——绝非自我标榜，只是当我不这么做时，反而更想表达真实想法。

There's so much great stuff of what you just said. And I've learned that it's a pressure and time thing. You wouldn't know that because I bring this up on every podcast, but I am hoping that through my trying to articulate how I'm feeling that's valuable for other people. This is not like an effort to be like self serving or whatever. I really just am I'm trying to articulate how I feel when I'm not doing that.

就像你说的，外界对Peter Yang的认知是那个为康纳·麦格雷戈拍照的传奇人物，而真实的你却鲜为人知。我正试图表达这一点：虽然我在与这些人交谈，但内心其实充满忐忑。当然我也很兴奋——这确实令人激动，毕竟我不是在学挖煤，而是在学些有趣的东西。

Like just like you said, know, there's this perception of Peter Yang larger than life taking Conor McGregor's photo and then there's who you really are as a person. And I'm trying on my end to sort of articulate that yes, I'm talking to all these people but I'm also in a place where I'm sort of apprehensive about it. I am I am excited. It is exciting and it's not like I'm, you know, I'm not learning how to coal mine. I'm learning how to do something that's like, you know, fun.

真正让我焦虑的是这件事能否持续盈利。不过或许正如你所言，这只是时间问题。但说实话，当有人要求我写方案时，我就抓狂——只能打开Canva胡乱设计些奇怪的东西。商业运作这部分确实棘手，我能想象自己当个摄影助理的样子。

One of the things that I really kind of get nervous about though is is the this being a financially viable endeavor. But I think I would probably just revert back to what you said, just it's sort of a time thing. But just, I don't know. I'm not somebody who does, you know whenever someone's like we need a proposal I'm like oh fuck like I just open up Canva and just start trying to make like weird I don't the business side of thing that's where it's tricky. I could see how I can get a job like as an assistant.

我也清楚如何用自己设备拍出好照片，进而引发连锁反应。但要把这做成专业事业似乎遥不可及，或许真的只是时间问题吧。

I could see how I can take beautiful photos on my own with my own stuff and then that snowballs into something else. But me doing this in that professional sense seems almost unattainable but I guess it's just a time situation.

我认为不只是时间问题。你所说的学习阶段意味着没有收入或定价不合理。很乐意和你探讨这行的商业门道。但现状是——或许历来如此——像我这样有资历的人已形成固定模式，而新人既要教育客户，又要应对那些提供免费或低价服务的同行。首先你必须理解商业本质。

I don't think it's just a time situation because I think what you're talking about without practically learning stuff that's just more time you're not making money or charging the right fees or you know any of that stuff so I think what you're talking about takes, like, you're certainly welcome. I'm certainly welcome to talk to you about some of the business aspects of this job. But I also think right now there's maybe it's always been like this, but just because I some folks who are, you know, my little circle, we've been around a while, they're sort of like, you know, we have reps, there's like a certain, there's just a certain way this, this whole thing works, but there's, there's a stage where you don't have a rep and there's a stage where you're starting out and there's a stage where you're dealing with clients who need to be educated or you're dealing with clients who are working with a lot of photographers who don't have really business backgrounds, so they're offering a lot of things for free or underpriced. The first thing to do, I mean, I think you need to understand the business aspect of it.

事先声明我对此毫无研究，只是随口说说。但核心在于产品本身：要么你有资源人脉，这类摄影师只要水平尚可就很容易出头。

And I'm going to preface this by saying like, I have no idea how any of this works. So I'm just kind of speaking out of my ass. But my feeling is like, it's about the product first, right? So you need to have either, either connections. There are people who just know the right people and they're good enough as photographers.

若已有这种人脉自然顺利，但多数人没有。所以起步关键在于作品——如果是商业摄影，就要有市场吸引力与辨识度。初期形成独特风格至关重要，当年我明确知道自己喜欢特定布光方式，追求画面中的静默与反讽，所有作品都贯彻这种视角，即便完全不适合。

And they just get out there like that. And if you have those connections already then you're probably fine, but most of us don't. So I think the way to start, it is about your work, know, it is about shooting something that speaks to people that's you know, if we're talking about being a commercial photographer is to be marketable to people and to kind of stand out from other folks you know. I think it's important when you're starting out to have a very distinct style that is your own and I think having however you did, however you develop that as sort of your own journey, but you know, one of the best things for me starting out is I knew exactly what it is I liked, you know, I liked the pictures that were lit a certain way. I liked a certain amount of stillness and irony in pictures and everything I shot I would put in that lens even if it was completely not the type of picture you would shoot that way.

我痴迷于那种僵硬呆板的环形光效照片——当时深受Dan Winner作品影响，偏执地认为唯有那种风格值得关注。这种固执虽错得离谱却对我帮助极大。如今信息爆炸反而容易迷失方向，但你会发现优秀创作者都有鲜明风格。新人更难的是要兼顾多种类型：静物美食、人像建筑...至今还有人问我能否同时拍摄静物，更别说刚入行时要展示多少技能了。

I love like still stiff, awkward ring light key plus ring light lit looking pictures. Clearly, was looking at a lot of like, you know, Dan Winner's work at the time. And I was just sure that that was the only thing worth looking at and everything else was not as good and I was totally wrong but also it was totally helpful for me to be so single-minded and now I think with the access to so much information it's really easy to kind of be all over the place but if you look at most of the people's work you like there's a very like solid style to what it is that they do. And you know it's harder when you're younger because you do want to be able to take any job, do want to be able to shoot the little still life food thing in the portrait and this like you like even now to this day people ask me for still life samples and for architecture samples, they're like, well we're shooting a person but we're also shooting still life, can you do that? So I can't imagine starting out like how many types of things you need to show.

但我真的很难想象，如果没有自己非常独特的风格，你如何在这个行业立足。甚至不需要是最好的风格，只需要保持一致，你懂的。所以建立...是的，我认为这对某些人来说可能更容易，对另一些人则更难，但我认为拥有自己的声音和风格非常重要。

But it is really hard for me to imagine how you can make it in this business without having like a very distinctive style that is to your own. Doesn't even have to be the best one out there, it just has to be consistent, you know. So building Yeah, people kind I think that's probably easier for some and harder than some but think that's, I think having your own voice and your own style is very important.

确实如此。我想这就是我需要看待这件事的方式——有点像'建好了他们自然会来'。只要创作出优秀的作品，当然也要了解商业层面的东西，但产品本身必须过硬。我做这个播客也有同样的体会，我认为这次尝试与我第一次做播客的不同之处在于，之前的内容杂乱无章。

Yeah for sure. Yeah. That's I think how I need to look at this thing it's sort of like build it and they will come. Like just create great work and you know yes learn about the business side of things but the product needs to be there. And I've had that with this podcast too and that's I think what's different about this you know venture than my first podcast was it was all over the place.

试图满足所有人的需求。有时音频质量很好，有时又很差。而现在这个播客，我是与我最喜欢的摄影师们进行非常存在主义治疗式的对话。每次听起来都会保持同样的风格，但就产品本身而言，以我谦虚的看法，到目前为止它就像磐石般稳固——这不是因为我，而是因为我每次都能创造出同样的产品，虽然有不同的声音和观点，但整体是连贯的。我怀疑人们来听我的播客时会觉得'这到底在讲什么'。尽管目前只有12集左右，但我觉得这个节目已经有了明确的观点。

Was trying to be everything to everybody. Sometimes the audio was good, sometimes the audio wasn't good whereas this one it's you know I'm having very existential therapeutic conversations with my favorite photographers. It's going to sound the same way every time but the product itself I think thus far in my humble opinion has been like rock solid not because of me but because I've been able to create that same product every time and it's different voices and it's different points of view but it's something that's cohesive. I doubt that people come and listen to my podcast and think that where is this going sort of thing. I think at this point even though it's only been like 12 episodes so far, feel like there's a point of view on this show.

我们才刚刚开始看到成果，当我着手做这件事时，完全不知道会是什么样子，只有通过实践才逐渐清晰。事情就是这样...

We're just sort of coming to fruition, when I set out on that, had no idea what that was gonna look like and it's only through doing it. That's sort of just how

确实如此。而且你做的是摄影类播客，邀请的嘉宾像Art和Victoria这样知名度高、作品扎实的人。我认为摄影也是如此。早期我曾以为只要钻研如何打光等技术问题，就能拍出更好的照片。但现在我明白了，其实更重要的是——虽然我也占一小部分——但真正关键的是镜头前的拍摄对象。如果我拍摄的对象本身很出色，哪怕只是拍得足够好，也比那些光线完美但人物平淡无奇的照片要有吸引力得多。

it is. I also think also think you're doing a photo podcast and you have people like Art and Victoria who who are pretty well known and who have like a really strong body of work and I think it's the same in photography. Think early on I thought it was sort of if I really worked on like how to light a photo and all this stuff, I would create these better photos. And as I look around now and as I realized a long time ago, it's really about, yeah, it's about me a little bit, but it's about my subject in front of my lens. If I have an amazing subject that I shot well enough, it would be a way more compelling photo than this shot that I just lit impeccably, but it was like a person that just wasn't compelling or no one cared about.

没错。

Right.

所以某种程度上确实与摄影有关。但说实话，一张好照片更多取决于你的拍摄对象、造型设计等非摄影因素，关键在于能否捕捉到情感瞬间或联系。情感可以用很多方式表达，不一定是大笑或哭泣，但照片必须具有某种打动人心的力量。这些都是其中的一部分，但还有更多因素需要考虑。

So it is about the photography to a certain degree. I think honestly a great photo, it's more about your subject, it's more about your styling and your, you know, all the things that aren't the photography and it's really about getting an emotional moment or connection out of it. An emotion can be described in a lot of different ways. It doesn't mean that they're laughing or crying, but the picture needs to be compelling in some way. You know, is all part of that, but there's just so much more to it.

我觉得有些人掌握了所有技巧，但老兄，你真的需要改进你的打光，因为效果并不理想。还有些人打光无可挑剔，但他们的照片却完全缺乏灵感。是的，毫无感染力。如果要我二选一，我绝对会选择那些有观点、能以某种方式打动你但视觉上并不完美的照片。特别是在我们当下这个时代，我认为这才是吸引人们的东西。但我觉得人们一直以来都会被这样的作品所吸引。

I think there's some people who get all of it and it's like, dude, you just need to work on your lighting because it's not great. There's some people who light impeccably but their pictures are completely like uninspired. Yeah uninspiring and if I could pick one versus the other I would definitely pick a photo that has a point of, that grabs you some way that isn't visually perfect. And especially in this time that we're in, think that's what people are drawn to. But I think people have always been drawn to that.

老兄，这太棒了。我想我们就到此为止吧。觉得这简直完美极了。真是太精彩了。非常感谢你参与这次访谈。

Dude this is so good. I think we're gonna leave it right here. Think this is freaking perfect man. It's been so awesome. Thank you so much for doing this.

我们正在铺红毯迎接，就像在《热辣访谈》节目上一样。大家在哪里可以在线找到你？最佳联系方式是什么？我知道显然是peteryang.com网站、Instagram账号这些常规渠道。

We're rolling out the red carpet like we're on Hot Ones. Where can people find you online? What's the best place to get in touch? I know it's obviously peteryang.com, the Instagram, all that jazz.

非常感谢邀请我参加。和你聊天真的非常非常愉快，尝试梳理我脑子里那些混乱想法也很有趣。你说对了我的网站，Instagram账号是Yo Peter Yang，其他平台我应该没有入驻。

Thank you so much for having me on. It's really, really great chatting with you and it's kind of fun trying to articulate all the mess that's in my head. You said my website it's Yo Peter Yang for Instagram, and then I don't think I'm on anything else.

让我们想想对抗 你得

Let's think up against You gotta

行动起来。听起来不错。我随时恭候。

do it. Sounds good. I'm around.

好的。酷。太棒了。好的。谢了，老兄。

Alright. Cool. Awesome. Alright. Thanks, man.

好的。谢了，兄弟。感激不尽。再见。

Alright. Thanks, man. Appreciate it. Bye.