Lenny的通讯：关于建立4.5万订阅列表、2500人Slack群组、盈利策略及Substack未来

于是，我就正式推出了，头几天就获得了大约200名付费订阅者。

And so, yeah, I launched it, and I got about 200 paid subscribers in the first couple of days.

然后第一个月就增长到了400多人，而且持续在增加。

And then I got up to about 400 something in the first month and and just kept growing.

您正在收听《与内森·拉特克的对话》节目。

You are listening to Conversations with Nathan Latke.

如果您听到这段内容，说明您目前尚未订阅我们的会员专享频道。

Now if you're hearing this, it means you're not currently on our subscriber feed.

订阅请前往getlatke.com。

To subscribe, go to getlatke.com.

订阅后您就不会再听到这类广告了。

When you subscribe, you won't hear ads like this one.

您将获得完整访谈内容。

You'll get the full interviews.

现在您听到的只是访谈片段。

Right now, you're only hearing partial interviews.

你将提前三周获得与创始人、思想家和有趣人物的访谈，比如在袁征带领Zoom上市前18个月的专访。

And you'll get interviews three weeks earlier from founders, thinkers, and people I find interesting, like Eric Wan eighteen months before he took Zoom public.

我们让它增长得更快了。

We got it to grow faster.

过去几年最低也有100%的增长率。

Minimum is 100% over the past several years.

还有像QuestionPro的Vivek这样白手起家的创始人。

Or bootstrap founders like Vivek of QuestionPro.

我创办公司时，融资并不流行。

When I started the company, it was not cool to raise.

或是Looker CEO弗兰克·比恩在被谷歌以26亿美元收购公司前的访谈。

Or Looker CEO Frank Bean before Google acquired his company for $2,600,000,000.

我们希望看到真正普及的数据文化，其他一切都会随之而来。

We wanna see a real pervasive data culture, and then the rest flows behind that.

如需订阅，请访问gitlatke.com。

If you'd like to subscribe, go to gitlatke.com.

在那里，你会发现一个私密RSS订阅源，可以添加到您常用的播客收听工具中，以及其他仅限订阅者享用的内容。

There, you'll find a private RSS feed that you can add to your favorite podcast listening tool along with other subscriber only content.

听着，我绝不希望金钱成为你无法收听节目的障碍。

Now look, I never want money to be the reason you can't listen to episodes.

在结算页面，你会看到一个申请免费访问的选项。

On the checkout page, you'll see an option to request free access.

我会无条件批准所有这类请求，无需任何解释。

I grant 100% of those requests, no questions asked.

嘿，大家好。

Hey, guys.

今天的嘉宾是莱尼·里奇茨基。

My guest today is Lenny Richitsky.

如果你没听说过他，说明你还没用Substack。

If you haven't heard of him, you are not on Substack.

他撰写的产品与增长通讯是最受欢迎的时事通讯之一，此前他曾在Airbnb工作并创办过自己的初创公司。

He writes one of the most popular newsletters on product and growth coming from Airbnb and his own startup before that.

他言行一致。

He walks the walk and talks the talk.

莱尼，准备好带我们登顶了吗？

Lenny, you ready to take us to the top?

谢了，老兄。

Thanks, man.

我准备好了。

I am.

当然。

You bet.

你不太擅长接受赞美。

You're not good with compliments.

我注意到当我谈论你的成就时，你会不自觉地前后摇晃。

I see you're like you rock back and forth when I talk about your success.

你很擅长解读肢体语言。

You're good at reading body language.

我不是个谦虚的人。

I'm not I'm a humble person.

好吧，我会尽量少说恭维话，但我确实希望人们能向你学习并收听完整期节目。

Well, I'll try and stay away from too many compliments but I do want people to learn from you and listen to the whole episode.

所以我不想埋没重点。

So I don't wanna bury the lead.

你已经在Substack上推出了付费通讯。

You've launched a paid newsletter on Substack.

目前你总共有多少免费读者，其中有多少已转为付费？

How many total free readers do you have today and how many have converted to paid?

我现在大约有45,000名免费读者，付费用户大概在三千三百左右。

I'm at about 45,000 free and about thirty thirty three hundred paid at this point.

嗯。

Mhmm.

按我的计算——如果我的研究和数学没错的话——这相当于年收入大约36万美元？

And that equates, I believe if my math is correct, my research is right, somewhere around $360,000 in terms of annual run rate?

我不公开我的收入，但大概就是那个数字。

I don't share my revenue but it's something like that.

莱尼停止了分享。

Lenny stopped.

2020年5月，你发了一条推文，显示有13,000名免费用户，4.86美元付费用户，以及56,000美元的总年度经常性收入。

May 2020, you put a tweet out, 13,000 free, $4.86 paid, and 56 k in gross AR.

你为什么停止分享收入情况了？

Why'd you stop sharing the revenue side?

说实话，我觉得自己不再是那种人们会为之加油的初出茅庐者了。

Honestly, I feel like there's a point at which I stopped becoming kinda like the guy you're rooting for in the younger dog.

我就想，这家伙怎么赚这么多钱？

And I just like, man, why is this guy making so much?

所以老实说，我现在尽量避免提具体金额。

So I honestly, I try to avoid the the dollar figure at this point.

你觉得保持'弱势者'形象是个很大的优势吗？

Do you think that's a big advantage, the underdog?

我觉得有人支持你是件好事。

I think one people rooting for you.

这算不上什么优势。

It's not so much advantage.

只是感觉还不错。

It just kinda feels nice.

哦，哇。

Oh, wow.

看看这家伙的表现。

Look at this guy go.

作为一个大新闻编辑，还能制造出支持你的群众吗？

Can you be a big news editor and still manufacture folks rooting for you?

当然可以。

Absolutely.

我不知道。

I don't know.

本·汤普森。

Ben Thompson.

我相信人们会支持那个家伙。

I'm sure people root for that guy.

就像现在Substack平台顶部的希瑟·考克斯·理查森女士，我就很支持她。

Like the the lady that's at the top of Substack right now, Heather Cox Richardson, I'm rooting for her.

她正在

She's making

超过百万次。

over Part a million time.

太疯狂了。

It's crazy.

是啊。

Yeah.

兼职。

Part time.

是啊。

Yeah.

太疯狂了。

Wild.

没错。

Yeah.

在我继续了解你的经历之前，让我先问你一个关于Substack的问题。

Let me get one let me get one question to you on Substack before I go back and get more of your history.

因为你的业务在Substack上名列前茅。

If you were because your I mean, your business is on top of Substack.

如果你现在是Substack的首席产品经理，一年后的Substack产品会是什么样子？

If you were leading, if you were the lead PM at Substack, what does the Substack product look like a year from now?

老实说，我最近和Substack团队讨论过这个问题，这确实是个重大挑战。

I I've been talking with the Substack guys a little bit about this honestly, and it's it's a big challenge.

某种程度上，平台抽成会变得很高，说实话我也不知道解决方案是什么。

At some point, the fees end up being a lot, and I don't know what the answer is to be honest.

我认为他们基本上有两个选择。

I think they basically have two options.

一个是深入挖掘，让这笔费用物有所值，因为他们能直接帮你赚更多钱。

One is drive in and make it such that it's well worth paying this fee because they're making you more money directly.

另一个是大幅降低我的工作难度。

The other is make it a lot easier for me to do this job.

所以提供大量工具、支持和其他资源，让我在其他地方无法获得这些，从而抵消成本。

So provide tons of tooling and support and other things where I just can't get that anywhere else and it makes up for the costs.

老实说，我也不知道我会怎么做。

And I honestly don't know what I would do.

这是个艰难的处境，但我持乐观态度。

It's a it's a tough place to be, but but I'm bullish.

我是铁杆粉丝。

I'm the big I'm the big fan.

你觉得Substack是否拥有真正可防御的竞争壁垒？

Do you feel like Substack has a real sort of defensible moat?

我是说，像ConvertKit和Nathan Berry这样的竞争对手能否推出类似服务真正与Substack竞争，还是说Substack的网络效应护城河太深了？

I mean, can someone else like ConvertKit and Nathan Berry launch something and really compete with Substack or do they have too much of a moat network effects?

不知道是否真的有人拥有护城河。

Don't know if anyone really has a moat.

有趣的是他们的卖点是你可以随时加入随时离开，这对我这样的人特别有吸引力——因为尝试一下没有任何损失。

What's interesting is their pitch is you can come and you can leave anytime you want, which works really well for people like me that join because there's no reason not to try it.

但反过来说，人们也确实可以随时离开。

But then the downside is people can leave anytime they want.

所以理论上没人真正拥有护城河，但他们确实抓住了人们的想象力，能在Substack上发文本身就是件很酷的事。

And so so nobody really has a moat in theory, but they've definitely captured people's imagination, and it's kind of a cool thing to be on Substack.

不知道这种状态能持续多久。

I don't know how long that lasts.

就目前而言，我在那里很开心。

And for now, I'm really happy there.

所以各位，

So guys,

接下来的十分钟你会很享受的。

you're gonna enjoy the next ten minutes.

你大概了解了Lenny现在的状况，但这一切其实要追溯到2010、2011年，他创办的第一家公司LocalMind。

You sort of got a sense of where Lenny is today, but it all started really back in 2010, 2011 with one of his first companies called LocalMind.

Lenny，LocalMind背后的创意是什么？

Lenny, what was the idea behind LocalMind?

LocalMind诞生于签到功能还很酷的年代。

LocalMind was built back in the day when check ins were really cool.

Foursquare、Goala和Facebook。

Foursquare and Goala and Facebook.

我们的做法是基于它们的数据平台，让你可以和全球任何地方的签到用户交流，了解他们所在地的实时动态。

So what we did is we sat on top of their data and allowed you to talk to people that are checked in anywhere in the world to find out what's happening, where they're at.

比如你正考虑去某家酒吧，可以问'这家酒吧现在热闹吗？'

So if you're thinking about going out to a bar, hey, is this bar fun right now?

如果你打算去演唱会现场，也能实时了解那里的情况。

If you're thinking about going to a concert, what's happening there right now?

或者今天的特色菜是什么？

Or what's the special of the day?

所以它叫Local Mind，理念是让你无论想去哪里都能获得当地的实时信息。我们运营了大约一年半，筹集了一些资金，搬到旧金山，后来公司被Airbnb收购，这也是我加入Airbnb的契机。

So it's called Local Mind and the idea is to give you this local mind anywhere you're thinking about going to and ran it for about a year and a half, raised some money, moved to San Francisco, and then sold the company to Airbnb, which is how I joined Airbnb.

你们为这家公司筹集了多少资金？

How much did you raise for the company?

总共只筹了大约60万美元。

Only about 600 k total.

嗯。

Mhmm.

你们本可以自筹资金运营吗？

Could you have bootstrapped it?

可以。

Yes.

但回头来看，这本来就不是那种能靠自筹资金做成的公司。

But looking back, it's not the kind of company that would have worked really.

所以实际上并没有真正的商业模式，签到功能也逐渐消失了。

So there's no real business model and check ins kind of died away.

因此我认为，无论我们采取什么路径，这个项目都不会成功。

And so it wouldn't have worked no matter what path we took, I think.

是的。

Yep.

现在这个问题会让你更兴奋——如果你对我之前的称赞感到兴奋的话——但那次被Airbnb收购更像是人才收购，还是对你来说真正实现了财务自由，让你可以专注于Airbnb的工作，余生都无需为金钱担忧？

Now you're really gonna rock with this question if you rocked on my first compliment I gave you, but was that acquisition with Airbnb sort of more of an acquihire or was it really a freeing financial moment for you where you could really focus on Airbnb, have no financial worries the rest of your life?

当时我们的主要投资者认为这是个非常糟糕的交易，因为全是股票支付，在他们眼中这笔交易价值不高。

So at the time, our investors, our lead investor thought it was a terrible, terrible deal because it was all stock and the value equated to not that much in their eyes.

我们向他们推销的观点是：这股票未来价值会远超现在，尤其是远超过4.09美元估值所显示的价值。

And our pitch to them was this is gonna be worth a lot more than it is now and especially a lot more than the $4.00 9 a valuation is telling you it's worth.

回过头看，我们当时的判断非常正确，结果也很圆满。

And looking back, we were very right and worked out well.

我很高兴我们做了那个决定，因为就像我说的，我不认为那个初创公司能独立发展成功。

And I'm very happy we made that decision because like I said, I don't think the startup would have worked out.

投资者们还持有Airbnb的股票吗？

Did the investors hold on to the Airbnb?

听起来你现在还持有Airbnb的股票。

It sounds like you held on to Airbnb I think today.

是的。

Yeah.

从某种意义上说，他们不得不持有。

They're in a sense, were they had to.

当时二级市场并不活跃。

There's not much of a secondary market Oh.

这是被允许的。

That was allowed.

没错。

Yeah.

快进到今天，股市收盘时Airbnb的市值达到了850亿美元。

Fast forward, the market closed today and Airbnb is at a $85,000,000,000 market cap.

所以你看到了他们没看到的东西。

So you saw something they didn't.

你在Airbnb待了多久？

How long did you stay at Airbnb?

七年。

Seven years.

七年。

Seven years.

好的。

Okay.

所以我现在想说的是，这非常罕见。

And so what I wanna get to now is it's very rare.

如果你在那里待了七年，你离开时多大年纪？

If you were there for seven years, how old were you when you left?

我那时多大？

How old was I?

嗯，大概三十六岁左右。

Well, thirty thirty six ish.

好的。

Okay.

那你现在差不多37、38岁？

So you're like 37, 38 today?

39岁。

39.

三十九岁。

Thirty nine.

三十七岁。

Thirty seven.

是的。

Yeah.

所以

So

发生什么事了？

what happened?

既然你能看到内部数据指标，我猜你现在是坐在一艘火箭飞船上。

Because you're sitting on a I assume you see internal metrics, you know you're sitting on a rocket ship.

你要放弃一份高薪工作。

You're giving up a big salary.

是什么促使你决定说‘你知道吗’？

What was the catalyst that got you to say, you know what?

留下来的机会成本太高了。

The opportunity cost is too high to stay.

我需要离开，腾出空间去创造新事物。

I need to leave and create space to invent something new.

说实话，那是一种非常本能的、非理性的感觉。

Honestly, was a very visceral kind of a non rational feeling.

我休了个长假，在那里工作了七年，休息了一段时间后回来，突然觉得像醒酒了一样，就是准备好迎接新事物了。

I went on a sabbatical, I was there seven years, took some time off, came back and I just felt like the Kool Aid had worn off and I was just ready for something new.

我回来后，发现这里已经不再有我之前那种能量和动力了。

I just came back and it just didn't have the same energy and drive that I had before that.

然后我又花了一个月时间，通过与其他团队和领导交谈，理性地探索是否有不同的角色或其他机会，但最终感觉现在就是离开的时候。

And then I spent another month rationally kind of getting there by talking to other teams and leaders to see if there was a different role or another opportunity, but it just kind of felt like naturally this is the time to go.

实际上我离职时并没有具体计划。

And I didn't actually have a plan when I left.

我只是想，顺其自然看看会发生什么。

I was just, I'm just going to see what happens.

我打算给自己六个月的时间去探索。

I'm going give myself six months to explore.

结果我花了一年时间才确定这就是我想走的道路。

And it ended up taking me a year to figure out this is the path I want to go down.

莱尼，我们该如何鼓励更多人这样做？

Lenny, how do we encourage more people to do that?

很多人不知道如何让自己的心态达到这种状态——虽然不清楚具体要做什么，但知道生活中有六个月的缓冲期来维持开销。

There's a lot of people that don't know how to get their mind in a place to just say, I don't know what I'm gonna do, but I have six months of runway in my life, cover my expenses.

我打算先放空自己一段时间。

I'm just gonna go be in an empty space for a while.

我们该如何鼓励这种行为？

How do we encourage that?

关键在于要有这段缓冲期。

The key is having that runway.

很多人没这么幸运能拥有这种条件。

A lot of people aren't fortunate to have that.

我当时有积蓄，我的做法是做好预算——六个月，这是我零收入状态下的生活成本。

So I had savings where I could, the way I did it is I just budgeted, okay, six months, here's how much it's going to cost me to live with no income.

我会把这笔钱单独留出来，作为这段自我探索期的专项资金。

I'm just going to set that aside and that's going to be my cost for this time that I'm going give myself.

光是做到这点就让我安心不少。

And that alone made me feel a lot more comfortable.

放弃薪水去投资完全是另一回事，但总有一天要停止这种状态，毕竟钱是赚不完的。

Giving up the salary and investing, that's a whole different story, but at some point that has to end, like it never ends.

在科技公司工作的话，总会有更多的薪资可以用于投资。

There's always going to be more salary investing if you're at a tech company.

所以很大程度上，我当时就是准备好要放手一搏了。

So a lot of it was just, I was just like ready to take a leap.

我有积蓄给自己一个机会，但从没想过会在那里待上七年。

I had savings to give myself a chance and I never thought I'd be there seven years.

所以后来就有点像是，好吧，七年过去了我怎么还在这儿？

So was kind of this like, okay, what the hell am I still doing here seven years later?

我可能想再创办一家公司或做点别的什么。

I probably want to start another company or do something else.

直接干就完了。

Let's just do it.

莱尼，创造缓冲期有两种方式。

And Lenny, there's two ways to create runway.

一种是量入为出，减少开支。

One is to live below your means, decrease your expenses.

另一种方式是增加储蓄，建立更大的现金储备。

The other is to save more and just build a bigger cash cushion.

你选择了哪一种？

Which one did you choose?

是其中一种还是另一种？

Was there one or the other?

主要是储蓄，存够钱然后告诉自己，好吧，这个金额，如果我按现在的开销速度，不做任何改变，我也能接受。

It was mostly saving, saving enough and just kind of saying, okay, this dollar amount, if I spend at the current rate, if I do nothing different, I'm comfortable with that.

嗯。

Mhmm.

能不能了解一下你离开爱彼迎时大约37岁左右的生活状况？

And can we get a sense like getting your life a little bit when you were, I guess, 37 ish leaving Airbnb?

你当时住在旧金山。

You were living in San Francisco.

对吗？

Correct?

是的。

Yeah.

那么，你方便分享一下那时候你每月生活开支的大概范围吗？

So, I mean, are you comfortable sharing a range of what your like life expense expenses were like per month back in those days?

我的做法是直接预留了10万美元。

So so the way I did it is I just set aside a 100 k.

这10万美元可以用于生活开支和业务支出。

Here's a 100 k that I can burn through both life expenses and also business expenses.

这就是我对自己的投资。

And that was my investment in myself.

好的。

Okay.

所以休假回来后，精力下降，存了六个月的钱就离职了。

So sabbatical, you come back, lower energy, savings of six months, you leave.

然后呢？

Then what?

是什么促使你在2019年5月开始撰写这第一篇内容？

What prompted you to start writing this first piece of content back in, I guess it was May 2019?

是的。

Yeah.

我最初的计划是创办一家公司。

So I was my initial plan was start a company.

那是A计划。

That was plan a.

B计划可能是加入一家公司。

Plan b was like maybe join a company.

C计划是加入一家大公司。

Plan c was join a big company.

在我探索创业公司的同时，我也开始思考我从Airbnb的经历中学到了什么，以便能将这些经验带入我正在考虑创办的新公司。

And so as I was exploring startups, I also started thinking about what did I learn from my time at Airbnb so that I can take that into this new company that I'm thinking about starting.

于是我开始把这些想法写下来，最终形成了我觉得有趣的这七点内容。

And so I started writing them down and it ended up being these kind of seven things that I thought were interesting.

正如老话说的那样，我最终把它写成了一篇Medium文章，就是为了分享出去，让人们从中获得价值。

And as the cliche goes, I ended up turning it into a Medium post just to kind of put it out there to make it valuable for people.

结果这篇文章取得了超乎我想象的巨大成功。

That ended up being incredibly successful, much more so than I thought.

它被Medium推荐了，实际上还通过Medium赚了大约1700美元，我之前都不知道还有这种机制。

It was like featured on Medium and got maybe $1,700 actually through Medium, which I didn't even know was a thing.

呃，我也不知道还有这种机制。

Well, I didn't know that's a thing either.

确实有这种机制。

It's a thing.

你把文章设为付费阅读，他们会根据阅读量和转化为付费Medium账户的人数给你一小笔报酬。

You put it behind a paywall and they pay you some small amount based on views and based on how many people convert to a paid Medium account.

好的。

Okay.

不过我后来转到了Substack，如果你想了解的话我们也可以聊聊这个。

But I moved off to Substack later, which we can also talk about if you want.

那我们开始吧。

Let let's dive into yeah.

我们一定要好好聊聊这个。

Let's definitely talk about that for sure.

好的。

Okay.

总之，那个效果不错。

So so anyway, that did well.

我继续写作，但内心一直想回归创业相关的内容。

I kept going, kept writing, but I kept wanting to come back to the startup stuff.

我内心很矛盾：是该花时间写作（因为这似乎进展顺利），还是该继续探索创业项目？

And I had this tension internally of should I spend time writing because this seems to be going well, or should I work on the startup explorations?

我当时有大约50个创业点子正在探索和尝试，计划是一个个去实践。

And I had, like, 50 ideas of startup ideas I was exploring and tinkering with, and my plan was to work through them one by one.

嗯。

Mhmm.

其实我和一个朋友有过一次对话，他让我意识到，好吧，写作这件事看起来进展得非常顺利。

And there was a basically a conversation I had with a friend where he just helped me realize, okay, this writing seems to be going really well.

你似乎很享受这个过程。

You seem to be enjoying it.

人们似乎很看重它。

People seem to value it.

也许不该把这视为理所当然，或许应该加倍投入写作，暂时搁置创业的事。

Maybe don't take that for granted and maybe double down on that and pause the startup stuff.

我这么做了，结果似乎还不错。

And I did that and seemed to work out.

那篇Medium的首发文章，我刚把它调出来看了。

That first Medium post, so I just pulled it up.

是啊。

Yeah.

我是说，它的表现确实非常出色。

I mean, it did extremely well.

你是在问这里有没有提到吗？

You're talking like does it say here?

有多少个点赞？

How many claps?

对。

Yeah.

28,000个。

28,000.

28,000个点赞。

28,000 claps.

没错。

Yeah.

据我所见是这样。

From what I can see.

是的。

Yes.

这简直太棒了，太棒了。

This is extremely, extremely well.

所以你已经从中获得了一些资本，然后某种程度上是从那里继续发展的。

And so you've made some capital off of this and then sort of pick up from there.

之后发生了什么？

What happened after this?

所以我就继续写作。

So I just kept writing.

我又写了五篇关于如何进入产品管理领域的文章。

I wrote five more pieces around how to get into product management.

实际上，佛教教给我的关于产品管理的道理，因为在那三个月的休假期间，我参加了一次冥想静修，这确实影响了我当时对生活的思考方式。

Actually, what Buddhism taught me about product management because in that three months I took off, I actually went on a meditation retreat and that actually informed a little bit of how I was thinking about life at that point.

所以我继续写作，保持不错的状态，虽然没有第一篇那么成功。

And so I kept writing, kept doing well, not as well as that first one.

嗯。

Mhmm.

后来有人说服我转投Substack，他们的说辞大致是：你为什么要把所有内容都拱手让给Medium？

And and then eventually someone convinced me to switch to Substack because the take was the pitch was just like, why are you giving Medium all of your content?

他们获得了全部优势——所有的SEO流量和订阅用户。

They're gaining all of the upside, all of the SEO, all the subscribers.

你却连读者的邮箱地址都拿不到。

You don't get any email addresses of your audience.

一旦离开平台，你就什么都没了。

You have no access if you leave.

这就是Substack的核心优势。

And so that was the benefit of Substack in it.

这话确实一点不假。

It was totally true.

你最后一次在Medium发帖是2020年2月。

Your last post on Medium was February 2020.

这是Substack的人主动联系你的吗？他们的用户增长策略是不是专门从Medium挖人？

Now here's my Was this someone from Substack and part of Substack acquisition strategy was go pick people off of Medium?

这个人确实与Substack有关联，但这不是他们的策略。

It it was someone connected to Substack, but it was not a strategy.

这实际上是个非常中肯的建议。

It was just actually genuinely good advice.

我喜欢这个说法。

I love that.

好的。

Okay.

所以你转过去了，这具体意味着什么？

So you move over and so what does it actually mean?

你是转到Substack了吗？

Do you you move to Substack?

这是什么

What does

意思？

that mean?

我只是复制粘贴了我的帖子。

I just copy and pasted my post.

所以首先，我只是创建了一个Substack账户，并把它命名为'Lenny的通讯'，因为我当时对这个东西并没有真正的计划。

So so first, I just create a Substack account and I called it Lenny's newsletter because I had no real plan for this thing.

我当时想的是，我能从什么最简单的事情开始呢？

I was like, what's the simplest thing I just start with?

而现在我被这个名称困住了，所以我只是复制粘贴了它们，这就是我最开始的几篇帖子，都是那些复制粘贴的内容。

And now that I'm stuck with that, and so I just copy and pasted them and that's my first few posts as those copy and pastes.

这太棒了。

This is great.

然后为了推进故事发展，你在Substack上的第一篇帖子，还记得是几月份吗，Lenny？

And then to pull forward the story, that first post on Substack, you remember what month that was, Lenny?

我记得是六月。

It was June, I believe.

2019年6月。

June 2019.

是的。

Yep.

到2020年5月时，你在推特上宣布已拥有13,000名免费订阅用户，其中486人转为付费用户，那是在你推出付费订阅服务六周后。

By by May 2020, you tweeted out you crossed 13,000 free subscribers and 486 had converted to paid, and that was six weeks after you launched the paid subscription.

所以我的问题是，坚持十个月免费写作需要极强的自律性，而且这已经超过了你原本设定的六个月盈利期限——那时你应该已经花完了那10万美元。

So my question to you is, writing free for ten months requires incredible discipline and it also was past your six month window for you making money because you were through your 100 k I think at that point.

那么两个问题：为什么你没有在六个月期限时就急于寻找盈利模式，而是等到十个月后才行动？

So two questions, why don't you start scrambling faster on how to make money at the six month mark instead of the ten month mark?

是什么让你有纪律性再坚持四个月才推出付费墙？

And what gave you the discipline to go the extra four months before introducing a paywall?

第一个问题，基本上我只是意识到自己还没完全想清楚，我和妻子商量后都同意再坚持六个月，反正预算也还够用。

So the first question, basically I just realized that I hadn't figured things out yet and I just talked to my wife and we both agreed, let's just do another six months, which I still had budget for.

她开始觉得，嘿，也许我该去找份工作了。

She was starting to feel like, Hey, maybe I should get a job.

你整天写这些东西到底在干什么？

What are you doing with this writing?

你在写作上有什么打算？

What are you doing with writing?

你把自己的时间都用来做什么了？

What are you doing with your time?

因为我从未设想过自己会走这条路。

Because there's not a path I ever imagined myself going down.

所以我们当时就决定，先看看情况再说，因为写作还没真正起色，我也没找到让我兴奋的创业点子。

And so we just agreed, let's just see what happens because the writing wasn't really clicking yet and I hadn't found a startup idea I was excited about.

这就像一个小小的约定，我们就继续坚持吧。

So it was just like a little kind of agreement, let's just keep going.

所以日期上有点...实际上跨越了2019和2020年。

So so the date's a little bit you're you're there's actually a 2019 and 2020 jump.

实际上，那十个月是免费期。

So actually, the ten months of free.

然后到了第二年，就在疫情爆发时，我才真正决定开始收费。

And then into the next year, right as COVID hit, is when I actually decided to start charging.

因为到那时，已经过去一年多了。

Because at that point, it'd been over a year.

我一年没有收入，没有工作，也没在找工作，然后所有市场都崩盘了，爱彼迎的股票也暴跌。

I had no income for a year, had no job, wasn't looking for a job, and then all the markets tank, Airbnb stock tanks.

我真的不知道现在存款还剩多少了。

I don't really know how much I have in savings anymore.

所以，我决定尝试收费模式。

And so so I decided to try the the paid route.

你大概存了10万美元作为六个月的预算，这样算下来你在旧金山每月的开销大约是1万到1.5万美元左右。

And at a 100,000 that you sort of saved a budget over six months that puts your sort of monthly San Francisco expenses at like 10 to $15 a month, something like that.

对，差不多是这样。

Yeah, something like that.

嗯。

Yeah.

那么当你推出付费墙时，你当时预期会怎样？

And so what were you expecting when you launched the Paywall?

你上线后就去睡觉了，或者你的开发人员可能在凌晨2点上线，然后你睡到上午11点才醒。

You launch it, you then go to bed or your developers, maybe you launch it like 2AM and then you like wake up at 11AM.

发生了什么？

What happened?

我知道我们是在一个合理的时间上线的。

I know we launched at a reasonable hour.

好的。

Okay.

所以我上线了。

So I launched it.

在准备上线过程中，我得到了很多帮助来设计发布方案、定价等事宜，这些建议来自几位精明的朋友。

I got a bunch of help on the way to frame the launch and had to price it and things like that from just like various smart friends.

我基本上构思了一整套说辞，解释为什么这个产品有意义、为什么有价值。

I kind of crafted a whole pitch of why this makes sense and why this is valuable.

确实，在那之前已经免费运营了九个月，每周如此。

And yeah, it was like nine months of free every week up to that point.

部分让我有信心这么做的是，我已经坚持了九到十个月每周都这样做，这对我来说并不明显能坚持这么久。

Partly what gave me confidence to do it is I had kept it up for nine to ten months every week, which was not obvious to me that I could keep this up for that long.

那时候我就想，哇哦。

And at that point, was like, oh, wow.

我大概可以继续这样做上好几年。

I could keep going for years probably doing the same thing.

所以不妨试试看吧。

So let's just give it a shot.

于是我就发布了，头几天就获得了大约200名付费订阅者。

And so, yeah, I launched it and I got about 200 paid subscribers in the first couple of days.

第一个月就增长到400左右，之后持续增长。

And then I got up to about 400 something in the first month and and just kept growing.

在你尝试的过程中，第一次尝试将免费用户转化为付费用户的行动号召时，你最初是怎么做的？

As you experimented, your your first shot at, like, the call to action to convert people from free to paid, what was your first stab at that?

我当时做的一件事是，如果他们在48小时内订阅，就给他们折扣。

So so one thing I did is I gave them a discount if they subscribed in the first forty eight hours.

所以我定价为每月15美元或每年150美元。

So I priced it at $15 a month or 150 a year.

如果你在我推出后的前48小时内订阅，每月只需10美元或每年100美元。

And if you subscribed in the first forty eight hours after I launched, it was $10 a month or 100 a year.

行动号召很简单：现在就订阅。

And the call to action is just subscribed now.

我给了他们一周时间。

I gave them a week.

实际上，我记得从宣布到正式收费之间有两周时间。

I think it was two weeks actually before when I announced to when I was going paid.

所以我让大家多享受了两周免费期。

So I gave people two weeks of more free.

嗯。

Mhmm.

这个行动号召非常简单。

And the call to action is really simple.

立即订阅。

Subscribe now.

你知道的，如果你觉得这个内容有价值，就支持一下这类工作。

You know, support this kind of work if you found value in this thing.

我当时的宣传点基本上是：如果你能通过这个每年做出一个更好的决策，那一年150美元就值了，尤其是如果你能向公司报销的话——确实有人这么做。

The way I pitched it essentially was if you can make one better decision a year through this, that's worth a $150 a year, especially if you can expense it to your company, which some folks do.

当你看到Quibi最近的遭遇，再结合阅读卡洛塔·佩雷斯关于技术进步与生产资本与普通资本的著作时，就会开始思考。

When you look at what recently happened with Quibi, you start to wonder and you read Carlotta Perez's book on technological advancement and production capital versus just regular capital.

你会开始感叹，哇，也许如今稀缺的资源不是资本，而是注意力。

You start to go, wow, maybe capital is not the scarce resource today but attention is.

如果你认同这点，或许你也会认为如今社会资本是金融资本的前置条件。

And if you believe that, then maybe you also believe that social capital is a precursor to financial capital today.

换句话说，你无法购买注意力，必须靠赢得它。

In other words, you can't buy attention, you have to earn it.

只有做到这点后，你才能实现规模化。

And only after you do that can you scale.

你在这里已经赢得了大量关注，于是在某个时间点决定推出一个Slack群组来深入交流。

You've essentially earned a ton of attention here and at some point you decide to launch a Slack group to go even deeper.

详细说说这个决策过程吧。

Walk me through that decision.

这一切其实都关联到一个核心观点——我认为归根结底是要提供价值。

So this all connects to kind of a core, don't know, thesis I have that it all all it all comes down to providing value.

如果你能持续为人们提供价值，他们就会追随你，订阅你的内容。

If you can provide value to people consistently, they're gonna follow you, They're gonna subscribe.

如果价值足够大，他们甚至愿意付费。

They're gonna pay you if it's valuable enough.

所以Slack群组本质上是我为读者提供更多价值的方式。

And so the Slack is essentially how do I provide more value to my readers.

最初推出时我还想：每月15美元啊。

When I first launched it, I was like, man, $15 a month.

这可是一大笔钱。

That's a lot of money.