压力、进食、循环往复？

本BBC播客由英国境外的广告支持。

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside The UK.

交易全球金融市场并不容易。

Trading the world's financial markets isn't easy.

但交易可能具有挑战性，并不意味着你的经纪商也必须如此。

But just because trading can be tricky doesn't mean that your broker has to be.

在capital.com，我们希望让您的交易体验尽可能顺畅。

At capital.com, we want to make your trading experience as painless as possible.

无论您是在我们的清晰易用平台上开立账户还是开仓，请立即访问capital.com，了解我们如何帮助您更聪明地交易。

Whether you're opening an account or opening a position on our clear user friendly platform, head to capital.com today and find out how we can help you trade smarter.

差价合约具有高风险。

CFDs involve a high level of risk.

83%的零售投资者亏损。

Eighty three percent of retail investors lose money.

你是不是特别讨厌公司喋喋不休地吹嘘自己赢得的奖项？

Don't you just hate when a company goes on about all the awards it's won?

我们也是。

Us too.

太假了。

So fake.

对吧？

Right?

所以，我们在 capital.com 会让你安心听你最爱的播客，而不提我们曾荣获 2004 年在线金钱奖‘最佳综合交易平台’。

So we at capital.com will let you get back to your favorite podcast without mentioning that we were named best overall trading platform at the two thousand and four online money awards.

哦，糟了。

Oh, whoops.

capital.com。

Capital.com.

我们在交易方面比广告强多了。

Much better at trading than adverts.

差价合约具有高风险。

CFDs involve a high level of risk.

83%的零售投资者亏钱。

Eighty three percent of retail investors lose money.

压力会影响你的饮食吗？

Does stress affect how you eat?

会。

Yes.

一直都会。

All the time.

它让我吃得更多。

It makes me eat more.

是的。

Yeah.

我也会情绪化进食。

I comfort eat either.

主要是咸味食物。

Savoury mainly.

所以是薯片、花生之类的。

So crisps, peanuts, things like that.

这成了我的依靠。

It's my crutch.

我觉得你的饮食习惯会改变，因为你没有时间在正常时间吃饭。

I think your eating habits change because you don't have time to eat at the normal times.

所以你会在错误的时间吃东西，吃错误的食物。

So you eat at the wrong times and you eat the wrong foods.

你往往会吃更多垃圾食品，我觉得。

You tend to eat more junk food, think.

我觉得你会吃任何快速简便的东西，而不是你本来应该吃的食物。

I think you eat whatever's quick and easy rather than what you probably should eat.

应该是更多水果蔬菜之类的，但我想这更多是关于速度和获取的便利性。

It's more fruit and veg and things, but it's I suppose it's a speed and ease of access thing.

吃完之后你感觉怎么样？

And how do you feel after you've eaten it?

可能有点内疚。

Probably a bit guilty.

是啊。

Yeah.

我觉得我在压力大的时候吃得更多。

I think I eat more when I'm stressed.

我觉得我会压力进食。

I think I stress eat.

会让人稍微平静一点，对吧？

Calms you down a little bit, don't it?

你压力大的时候会吃些什么？

What kind of things do you go for when you're stressed?

不是什么健康的东西。

Not the good stuff.

薯片、巧克力，主要是巧克力，再来点冰淇淋。

The crisp, the chocolate, mainly chocolate, bit of ice cream.

这管用吗？

Does it do the job?

管用。

It does.

百分之百管用。

A 100%.

这是来自BBC世界服务的《食物链》节目。

This is the food chain from the BBC World Service.

我是露丝·亚历山大，本周我们将探讨压力如何影响食欲、为什么会这样、它对身体有何影响，以及你可以怎么做。

I'm Ruth Alexander, and this week, we're exploring how stress affects your appetite, why it happens, what it does to your body, and what you can do about it.

那么，让我们来认识一下我们的嘉宾。

So let's meet our guests.

我叫拉吉塔·辛哈。

My name is Rajita Sinha.

我是耶鲁大学医学院精神病学、神经科学和儿童研究系的教授，学院位于美国康涅狄格州的纽黑文。

I'm a professor of psychiatry and neuroscience and child study at the Yale University School of Medicine, which is in New Haven, Connecticut in The USA.

我同时也是耶鲁大学跨学科压力中心的主任，该中心是我们十五年前创立的，旨在深入研究压力的生物学机制及其对我们行为、健康以及压力相关疾病和结果的影响。

I'm also director of the Yale Interdisciplinary Stress Center, which is one that we started now over a decade and a half ago to really look at the stress biology and its impact on our behaviors and our health and on stress related illnesses and outcomes.

你最初是什么原因对压力产生兴趣的？

What got you interested in stress in the first place?

自从我读研究生以来，我的研究一直围绕情绪以及情绪与大脑认知之间的相互作用。

My work, ever since I was in graduate school, was on emotions and the interaction of emotions with cognition in the brain.

在我求学时，情绪被认为纯粹是大脑的产物，但事实上，它是身心共同作用的结果。

And emotions, when I was in school, was very much thought of as a mind thing, And really, it's a whole body and mind thing.

因此，我对这样一个观点产生了浓厚兴趣：我们需要以一种真正关注大脑与身体之间相互作用的方式，来全面研究整个人。

And so I got very interested in the idea that we needed to study this in a way that would really target the interactions between the brain and the body and back for the whole person.

这正是我研究生涯的起点。

And that's what got me started.

米图，你能向我们简单介绍一下你自己吗？

And Mitu, would you tell us a little bit about yourself, please?

我叫米图·斯蒂罗尼。

My name is Mitu Stironi.

我拥有神经眼科学和神经科学研究的背景。

I have a background in neuro ophthalmology and neuroscience research.

我也是《压力免疫》和《超高效》这两本书的作者。

And I'm also the author of Stress Proof and Hyperefficient.

写这两本书是我对压力产生兴趣的源头。

And writing these books were the source of my interest in stress.

你最初为什么想写这两本书呢？

What made you want to write them in the first place?

在我担任神经眼科医生期间，实际上是在伦敦，我接触了大量自身免疫性疾病病例，比如多发性硬化症等影响神经系统的自身免疫疾病。

So during my time as a neuro ophthalmologist, actually here in London, I was exposed to lots of cases of autoimmune conditions such as multiple sclerosis autoimmune conditions that affect the nervous system.

在与患者交谈时，当然会记录并识别出影响疾病的所有因素。

And when talking to patients, of course you record and recognise all the factors that play a part in disease.

但几乎每个患者都会提到：‘我那年夏天压力特别大’或‘经历了一件压力很大的事，之后病情就复发了’。

But invariably, most patients would mention something like, oh, I had a very stressful summer or stressful event and that led to a relapse'.

于是我意识到，压力这种无形的东西显然在所有这些疾病中都起着作用，但我们却未能真正理解它究竟是什么。

And then I realised that actually stress is this formless thing that's clearly playing a role in all of these conditions, but we're not really grasping what it's all about.

那我们从最基础的开始吧。

And let's start with the very basics then.

压力是什么，布里吉特？

What is stress, Brigitte?

压力实际上是你的身心对具有挑战性和压倒性情境的反应，在那一刻，你可能觉得无能为力。

Well, stress is really your body and mind's response to challenging and overwhelming situations that in the moment, you may feel like you can't do anything about it.

简单来说，情境和环境触发因素，比如事件，会引发压力。

Very simply, situations and environmental triggers like events can get it going.

然而，内部因素也会引发压力，比如我们的想法和焦虑、我们摄入体内的物质，以及任何可能提示身体处于痛苦状态的变化，例如睡眠不足、口渴或极度饥饿。

However, there are internal things that can get it going as well, like our thoughts and anxieties, what we consume in our body, any changes in our body that may signal a distress state, like sleep deprivation, for example, or thirst, or extreme hunger.

它会挑战我们原本非常强大的压力生理机制。

It can challenge our very robust stress biology, which we do have.

这其实就是我们的警报系统，我们早已了解它。

That is really our alarm system, which we've known for a long time.

它向身体的每一个细胞，从细胞到大脑，发出信号：出问题了。

It's what tells the body right from the cells, every cell in our body, to our mind that something's not okay.

那么，当我们感到压力时，身体内部会发生什么？

What happens inside our bodies then when we're stressed?

它的目的其实是帮助我们适应。

The purpose is really to help us adapt.

对吧？

Right?

你可能会感觉到心跳加快。

You might feel your heartbeat faster.

因此，会触发许多我们称之为压力信号的反应。

So there are lots of what we call stress signals, that get triggered.

随后会引发一系列连锁反应，这些反应也让我们能够思考如何应对压力。

And then there is a cascade of events that occur as a function of that, which also allow us to think about doing something in response to that stress.

这就是你的急性压力反应。

That's your acute stress response.

这并不是慢性压力。

That's not chronic stress.

这就是急性压力反应，其目标当然是适应，对吧？

That's the acute stress response, and the goal there is, of course, to adapt, right?

急性意味着这是我们对一次性情况的反应方式。

Acute meaning that's how we respond to a kind of one off situation.

但慢性压力则是你长期日常所感受到的压力，人们有时因为自己的处境，或者像你所说的，因为健康问题而感到这种压力。

Chronic stress though is your kind of long term everyday stress that people sometimes feel because of their situation or because, as you said, of a it could be their ill health.

是的。

Yes.

是的。

Yes.

说得完全正确。

That's exactly right.

所以急性压力是指刚刚发生的一次性情况，比如今天老板让你烦心，这类情况确实有其影响。

So acute would be something that's happening, a sort of a one off situation that's just occurred, like a boss is irritating you today at work, and those have their power.

但如果这个老板每天都这样对你，那就是由于同一个刺激或触发因素而反复出现的压力源。

But then if it's a boss that is actually doing this to you every day, There's sort of repeated stressors that are occurring as a function of that one stimulus or that one trigger.

这就是慢性压力的情况。

That's when you've got chronic stress.

这时就可能发展成慢性压力。

That's when that can build into chronic stress.

所以我想表达的是，我们喜欢把压力分为急性和慢性，但它们也可能相互融合，对吧？

So I guess the point I'm making is that we like to break it up into acute and chronic, but these can merge as well, right?

这些压力的关键特征是，你缺乏控制权，也就是它的不可控性，以及它的不可预测性。

The key features of those are that you have less control, so the uncontrollability of it, and then the unpredictability of it.

因为你不知道接下来会发生什么，也不知道它什么时候会来，而且在那一刻你几乎无法改变它。

So the fact that you don't know what's gonna come at you or when it's gonna come at you, and that you're not gonna be able to do a whole lot to change it in that moment.

米图，当你处于慢性压力下时，你的身体会发生什么变化？

And, Mitu, what happens inside your body when you are under chronic stress?

压力实际上始于大脑。

Stress really begins in the brain.

当你的大脑感知到一个它觉得无法应对的环境或情境时，就会触发一个默认反应。

When your brain perceives an environment or a situation that it feels it's not prepared for, it pushes a default button.

这个默认按钮会启动一系列通路，让你为任何类型的攻击做好准备，至少有七条通路受到影响，正如雷吉塔所说，包括你的情绪反应、免疫系统，以及此时立即发生的炎症反应。

And that default button sets into play a whole range of pathways that prepare yourself for any kind of attack, and there are seven pathways, at least seven pathways that are affected, including, as Regita said, your emotional reaction, your immune system, you have an immediate inflammatory reaction at that moment.

如果你检测血液，会发现炎症标志物水平升高。

If you test your blood, you'll find a rise in inflammatory markers.

你突然感到动力激增，奖励通路变得更加活跃。

You suddenly feel a surge in motivation, your reward pathways become more active.

你体内还存在多种激素的相互作用，比如皮质醇等，这些反应会稍晚一些发生，但属于这一轴线的一部分。

You have this interplay of hormones, of cortisol, so on, which actually happens a little bit later, but that's part of that axis.

此外，还有其他变量参与其中，包括你的昼夜节律系统所发生的变化。

And you also have other variables in there, including things that are happening to your circadian system.

所有这些都属于短期、即时的反应。

So these are all short term, instant reactions.

其中有一个也与我们今天的讨论相关。

One of them also is relevant to our conversation today.

你会暂时出现胰岛素抵抗。

You become momentarily insulin resistant.

因此，你的血液中血糖水平会急剧上升。

So there's a surge of blood sugar in your blood.

所有这些反应都会在你突然遭遇心理压力的瞬间发生。

All of these happen at the moment you have a sudden, instant bout of psychological stress.

这些通路在短期内非常有益，但少量有益并不意味着越多越好。

Now all of these pathways are great in the short term, but just because a little is good doesn't mean more is better.

它们并非呈直线线性效应，这意味着如果你一直按住这个按钮，原本有益的东西在长时间持续按下后往往会适得其反。

They don't have straight line linear effects, which means that if you keep the button down, what's beneficial often flips if the button is kept pressed down for too long.

例如，当你经历一次急性压力时，你会产生强烈的动力，可以想象我们的祖先在逃离狮子或猛犸象时，他们必须有强烈的逃跑意愿。

So for instance, if you have an acute bout of stress, you have a surge in motivation, and you can think of it as when our ancestors were running away from a lion or a woolly mammoth, You needed to want to run away.

你不想成为那种说‘算了，我现在就放弃吧’的人。

You didn't want to be the kind of person that said, oh, well, I'm just going to give up now.

你只想坐在树下，静观其变。

I'm gonna just sit under a tree and watch what happens.

你必须逃跑。

You want to run away.

因此，你会感受到这种动机的激增。

So you have that surge in motivation.

但如果你一直按住这个按钮，实际上会发展出相反的效果。

But if you keep the button pressed down, you actually develop the opposite.

你的动机会下降。

Your motivation goes down.

因此，长期压力的人会经历动机下降，而这又会进一步导致抑郁等问题。

So people with chronic stress suffer from a decline in motivation, which then continue to contribute to things like depression and and other things.

这是其中一点。

That's one thing.

慢性压力下的另一点是，例如，你的血液中血糖水平会升高，因为你暂时出现了胰岛素抵抗。

Another thing that happens in chronic stress is, for instance, you have a surge of blood sugar in your bloodstream because you become temporarily insulin resistant.

但我们知道，长期压力的人实际上会发展出胰岛素抵抗，从而导致代谢功能紊乱。

But we know that people with chronic stress actually develop insulin resistance, so they develop metabolic dysfunction.

同样地，我们可以看到，如果按钮只短时间按下，这是有益的，但如果按得太久，就会出现故障。

Again, we can see that if the button is pressed down for a short period of time, it's great, but if it's pressed down for too long, there's a malfunction.

与慢性压力相关的其他问题包括胰岛素抵抗和慢性炎症。

So other things associated with chronic stress are insulin resistance, chronic inflammation.

我们知道，轻微的炎症实际上是有保护作用的，比如你有开放性伤口时，轻微的炎症能保护你。

So we know that a little bout of inflammation is actually protective if you had an open wound, a little bit of inflammation would have protected you.

但如果炎症不消退，或者压力按钮按得太频繁，比如两次压力之间没有恢复期，按钮始终无法关闭，这时你就会开始出现慢性炎症。

But if that doesn't go away, or if the button stays pressed down too often, so if you don't have any recovery for instance between two bouts of stress, and the button just never gets itself turned off, at that point you start developing chronic inflammation.

实际上，慢性压力会改变你对急性压力的反应方式，使其变得异常。

And really, you develop chronic stress, what that actually does is your reaction to acute stress becomes abnormal.

那么，为什么压力会影响我们的食欲呢？

So why does stress seem to affect our appetite?

让我们听听我在英国南曼彻斯特街头采访的一些人怎么说。

Let's hear a bit more from people I've been speaking to while out and about in South Manchester, England.

当我有压力时，我总是吃得更多。

Oh, I always eat more when I'm stressed.

我不这样。

I don't.

我是相反的情况。

I'm the other way.

我几乎会恶心到吃不下东西，所以我不吃，因为我会处于一种近乎过度兴奋的状态。

I'm a I'm I feel almost too sick to eat, so I I won't eat because I'll be kind of in, like, overdrive almost.

如果我压力很大，我会觉得连咀嚼都困难，也无法集中注意力。

I feel like I can't chew or focus on anything like that if I am really stressed.

这就形成了一个恶性循环，因为我压力大就睡不着，睡不着就会更饿，但又吃不下东西。

So it's like a vicious cycle because then I won't sleep because I'm stressed, so I will be more hungry, but then I can't eat food.

这种情况会一直持续，直到我所压力的事情得到解决，或者我饿到实在忍不住要吃东西为止。

So it will go on really until either whatever I'm stressed about is resolved or until I'm so hungry that I can't actually eat something.

所以，这确实有点棘手。

So, yeah, it's a bit of a bit of a difficult one.

是啊。

Yeah.

是啊。

Yeah.

你压力大的时候，会吃得更多，是吗？

And when you're stressed, you tend to eat more, you say?

是的。

Yeah.

我觉得这 definitely 是一种...

I would say it's like it's it's definitely like a

应对机制。

coping mechanism.

短期的逃避、愉悦，类似的东西。

Short term distraction, pleasure, that sort of thing.

这其实是逃避解决压力根源问题的一种方式，我想。

It's a distraction from fixing the the problem of the stress, I guess.

这不能缓解压力吗？

It doesn't ease the stress?

这要看压力来自哪里，

Depends what the stress is,

但我不会这么说。

but I wouldn't say.

不。

No.

是的。

Yeah.

不。

No.

不一定。

Not not necessarily.

我明白你的意思。

I do get that.

我觉得你正处于一种奖励自己的状态。

I feel like you're in a bit of a treat yourself mode.

我发现，尤其是在工作压力大的时候，我会走进厨房，那里堆满了零食，然后想：好吧。

I have found that when there's been a stressful day in particular at work, I will go into the kitchen that is, like, filled with treats and be like, right.

好吧。

Okay.

我需要吃点东西，因为我觉得我值得吃点糖之类的，这在我脑子里说得通。

I need to have something because, like, I deserve, like, sugar or whatever because that's that's kind of how it makes sense in my brain.

我觉得这样。

I'm like, okay.

我要奖励自己，因为我配得上。

I'm gonna treat myself because I deserve it.

所有的意志力都烟消云散了。

All the willpower goes out the window.

你说得对。

You're right.

没错。

Right.

奖励时间。

Treat time.

当然。

Definitely.

我个人觉得我两者兼有。

Personally, I think I'm a mix of the two.

如果压力大的时候，我会吃得多一些，有时也取决于压力的类型。

I can eat more if I'm stressed, or sometimes it's kind of depending on the type of stress.

如果是情绪上的压力，我会没胃口。

If it's an emotional stress, I lose my appetite.

我想知道，你们俩能理解刚才人们说的那些吗？

I wonder, can you two relate to what people were saying there?

绝对可以。

Absolutely.

我的意思是，我记得我备考的时候。

I mean, I remember when I was studying for my exams.

我感到恶心。

I felt sick.

考试前我会感到恶心。

I felt sick before an exam.

当然，我们现在知道，这可能是因为你的消化系统——也就是胃和肠道——与大脑之间存在一条直接通路。

And we, of course, now know that one of the reasons that this might happen is because there is a direct pathway between your gastrointestinal system, so between your stomach and intestines, and your brain.

在急性压力下，会发生一种叫做迷走神经抑制的现象。

And one of the things that happens during acute stress is something called vagal withdrawal.

这实际上会影响你肠道的蠕动。

And that actually influences the motility in your gut.

不同的人会受到不同的影响。

Different people will be affected in a different way.

因此，对一些人来说，这种问题性的功能紊乱会抑制食欲。

So for some people, this sort of problematic, this sort of dysfunction suppresses your appetite.

但另一方面，我们也知道，当你突然感到压力时，你的大脑需要糖分。

But then on the other hand, we also know that the moment you get acutely stressed, your brain needs sugar.

你的大脑需要确保身体周围有足够的糖分，主要是为了它自己。

Your brain needs to make sure there is ample sugar around your body, really just for itself.

因此，因为你的大脑希望确保这一点，其中一个反应就是我们会下意识地寻求糖分。

So because your brain wants to make make sure of that, one of the things that does happen is we sort of reach for sugar.

所以，那些没有那么强烈胃部紧缩感的人，会感到需要吃点东西来补充能量，以应对当时生活中突然出现、让他们觉得自己尚未准备好的压力。

So those of us who don't have that knotted feeling to quite that extent, feel the need to reach for something, to increase their fuel, to cope with whatever life is throwing at them at that moment that they think they're not prepared for.

所以，如果你在压力大时倾向于吃甜的、高热量的碳水化合物，不要为此责备自己。

So if your go to foods when you're stressed are sweet, high calorie carbs, don't beat yourself up about it.

这不是你的错，我们的身体就是如此进化的。

It's not your fault, we're just wired that way.

完全正确。

Absolutely.

我们这样做的原因，并不是因为我们软弱，也不是因为我们缺乏意志力，更不是因为我们不够自律。

The reason why we do it is not because we are weak, it's not because we don't have willpower, it's not because we're not disciplined.

这真的是因为我们在进化上被设定为在危险时刻寻求能量和资源。

It really is because we are evolutionary wired to reach for fuel, energy resources, at times of danger.

关于糖分，其实很有趣，因为当你经历强烈、急性的压力时，摄入一些甜食实际上能缓解你的压力反应。

With sugar, actually, it's very interesting because if you are going through intense, acute stress, so stress in the moment, then taking something sweet actually calms your stress response.

甚至有一些研究表明，将受试者置于实验室环境中，给予他们含糖饮料与人工甜味剂饮料，那些饮用含糖饮料的人在经历人为诱发的心理压力时，其压力反应会略微减弱、略低一些。

And there are even studies that show that taking people and putting them into a laboratory, giving them sugar sweetened drinks versus artificial sweetened drinks, those with sugar sweetened drinks actually end up having a slightly muted, slightly lower stress response to a bout of psychological stress that's been artificially induced.

然而，如果你的压力体验变得长期化，并且频繁这样做，你实际上会面临患上代谢性疾病的高度风险。

That said, should your experience of stress become chronic, and should you do this frequently, you actually end up at high risk of developing a metabolic disorder.

因此，在这种情况下，你的大脑与糖摄入之间的关系就会变得异常。

So at that point, this relationship between your brain and sugar consumption becomes abnormal.

所以，最好避免这样做。

So it's best not to do that.

我只是想补充一点，我认为我们身体所携带的体重实际上也会影响我们对压力的适应能力。

I just want to add to that, I think how much weight we carry around in our bodies actually changes our adaptation to stress as well.

这与我们如何处理葡萄糖和能量密切相关。

And that really has to do with how we are processing glucose and fuel.

如果你体内葡萄糖水平过高，而胰岛素未能有效分解葡萄糖，就会出现胰岛素敏感性降低的情况。

If you have high levels of glucose around and insulin is not doing its job to sort of break down glucose, then we have the condition of insulin insensitivity.

即使在你完全出现胰岛素抵抗之前，就已经存在敏感性降低的问题。

Even before you're fully insulin resistant, you have insensitivity.

所以你体内可能有大量葡萄糖在循环，但你的大脑却不容易获取到，对吧？

So you might have a lot more glucose floating around, but your brain isn't getting it as easily, right?

因此，身体会自然产生一种驱动力，促使你做些能提高葡萄糖水平的事情。

And so there is a natural drive to do things that would increase the level of glucose.

所以，如果你长期处于压力之下，可能会倾向于吃得更多，这可能导致体重增加，进而影响你体内的一系列生理过程，使你更难应对当前的压力。

So if you're under stress over a prolonged period of time, you may be driven to eat more, that may lead to weight gain, which will have a knock on effect on things going on inside your body, which may make you less able to cope with that stress that you're under.

所以这是一个恶性循环。

So it's a vicious circle.

这确实是一个恶性循环，我们称之为正反馈循环，即一件事引发另一件事，而后者又促进下一件事，让你陷入这个循环中无法脱身。

It is exactly a vicious cycle, and we call it the feed forward cycle, which is one thing leads to the other, and that then promotes the next thing that gets you stuck in that cycle.

所以这确实是一个恶性循环，而且更难打破，因为我们很容易被困在里面。

So it is a vicious cycle, and it's harder to break because we do get stuck in it.

你是否可能在不知不觉中遭受慢性压力？

Can you be suffering from chronic stress without knowing it?

当然可能。

Absolutely.

当然。

Absolutely.

正如雷吉塔所说，当你处于急性压力时，我们都能立刻感受到那些情绪。

So as Regita said, when you're acutely stressed, we all recognize those instant sort of feelings.

我们能感觉到心跳加速，手在发抖，胃部发紧。

We we recognize our hearts racing, we recognize, you know, maybe our hands shaking, the feeling of tightness in the stomach.

但如果你长期处于压力之下，这些信号或症状可能非常微妙。

But if you're chronically stressed, the signs or the symptoms to you can actually be very subtle.

例如，长期来看，你可能会逐渐适应这种持续紧张的状态，但当你去看医生时，他们可能会发现你的血压在逐渐升高，或者发现你的胆固醇指标异常，又或者你自己注意到腰部开始出现一点脂肪。

So for instance, you could, in the long term, become quite acclimatised to the fact that you are under constant tension, but when you pop to see your doctor, they might notice your blood pressure is gradually rising, or they might notice you're developing cholesterol abnormalities, or you might notice you're developing a little bit of fat around your middle.

这些迹象都表明慢性压力可能正在发挥作用。

So these are signs that suggest that chronic stress may be at play.

您正在收听BBC世界服务的《食物链》。

You're listening to the Food Chain from the BBC World Service.

作为一名交易员，你可能是派对的狂热爱好者，总是告诉朋友那七只明星股票超买，黄金并非人人都以为的安全港，或者狗狗币可能是下一个比特币。

As a trader, you're probably great fan of parties, always telling your friends that the magnificent seven stocks are overbought, that gold isn't the safe haven everyone thinks it is, or that Doge could be the next Bitcoin.

嗯，也许不是那样。

Well, maybe not that.

但如果这听起来像你，相信我们。

But if this sounds like you, trust us.

我们Capital.com认为你非常出色。

We at capital.com think you sound brilliant.

今天就来探索这些市场及其他更多领域。

Explore all these markets and more with today.

Capital.com。

Capital.com.

聪明交易。

Trade smart.

差价合约具有高风险。

CFDs involve a high level of risk.

百分之八十三的零售投资者亏损。

Eighty three percent of retail investors lose money.

对食物着迷吗？

Obsessed with food?

喜欢寻找最佳食谱吗？

Love finding the best recipes?

我是塞缪尔·戈德史密斯，美食作家、厨师，也是《好食物播客》的主持人。

I'm Samuel Goldsmith, food writer, cook, and host of the Good Food Podcast.

每周，我都会与顶尖厨师、美食作家以及引领饮食变革的人士坐下来交谈，他们才是真正让美食变得精彩的人。

Every week, I sit down with top chefs, food writers, and people at the forefront of changing the way we eat, all the people who really make food great.

如果你热爱一顿美味的餐食和一场精彩的对话，请在Spotify上搜索《好食物播客》，每周二更新新鲜内容。

If you love a good meal and a great conversation, search for the Good Food Podcast on Spotify, serving up fresh episodes every Tuesday.

到时候见。

See you there.

我是露丝·亚历山大，本周我们将探讨压力如何影响我们的食欲，以及你可以采取哪些应对措施。

I'm Ruth Alexander, and this week we're looking at how stress affects our appetites and what you might be able to do about it.

本期嘉宾是耶鲁压力中心的拉吉塔·辛哈教授，以及作家兼神经科学研究者米蒂·斯特罗尼博士。

With Professor Rajita Sinha of the Yale Stress Centre and author and neuroscience researcher Doctor Miti Steroni.

我们一直在讨论压力如何驱使我们选择不健康的食物。

We've been talking about how stress can drive us to reach for unhealthy foods.

但如果你知道即将迎来一段紧张的工作期，能否提前做好准备，采用一种减压饮食呢？

But if you know you've got a stressful period coming up at work, say, could you prepare for that and eat a stress busting diet?

我问了雷吉塔。

I asked Regita.

在压力下，有时候很难控制对糖的渴望。

It's hard sometimes to control the sugar when you're under stress.

这确实如此。

That's so true.

无论是健康还是不健康的食物，对我们很多人来说都是如此。

For healthy or unhealthy, for a range of us.

我们都会被压力所困扰，以至于可能不太留意自己吃了什么。

We all can get so caught up in the stressor that you might not pay as much attention to what you're eating.

因此，我认为为压力期做准备时，有一些我们常建议的行为方式。

So I do think that preparing for a stressful period, there are a few behavioral things we like to suggest.

例如，你知道的，把垃圾食品或不健康的食物都放在家里外面。

For example, you know, keep things that are junk foods or unhealthy foods out of the house.

干脆就别买它们。

Just just not buying them.

这只是一个非常实际的做法。

Just it's a very practical thing.

把它们放在不容易拿到的地方。

Keep them out of easy reach.

放得远一点，因为你往往会伸手去拿，或者感到诱惑。

Out of easy reach because you are going to tend to reach out for them or feel tempted.

这可能会很难。

And that can be hard.

另外，我认为要考虑全天规律地吃一些健康的小餐。

The other, piece, I think, is to think about regular, healthy small meals throughout the day.

这可以缓解你听众可能正在想的饥饿感和渴望。

That can edge off this hunger and craving that your listeners may be thinking about.

所以我认为只是一些非常基本的事情。

And so I think just some very basic things.

另一方面，要确保你的社交圈良好，和那些也关注健康饮食、有相同心态的人一起吃饭，努力打破压力与我们内心之间的联系。

The other piece of that is to make sure your social network is well set up and that you're eating with those who are sort of thinking about healthy foods as well and sort of in the same spirit, sort of working to what we like to think is break that connection between stress and our minds.

人们常说有‘食物大脑’，这种食物大脑在压力条件下会被强化。

There's, you know, people talk about having a food brain and that food brain can be promoted under conditions of stress.

所以‘食物大脑’就是你的大脑总是想着食物，忍不住想：冷冻柜里是不是还有冰淇淋？

So food brain, your mind is always on food and wandering off to think of, could there be some ice cream in the freezer?

对。

Right.

我需要什么？

And what do I need?

我需要一些慰藉。

I need some comfort.

我们给自己编故事。

We tell ourselves stories.

对吧？

Right?

所以我需要一些慰藉。

And so I need some comfort.

这段艰难时期就要来了。

This bad period is coming.

我想确保这些准备都到位了。

I wanna make sure I have these things in in place.

事实上，这些正是可能让你在饮食上失控的诱因，哪怕只是多吃了一点点。

And in fact, those are, going to exactly be the triggers that might get you in trouble in terms of eating a little extra.

我的意思是，进食可能非常隐蔽，我们甚至没意识到自己吃得比原本计划的要多，即使量很小。

I mean, eating can be very sneaky without even realizing we can eat more than we had wanted, even if it's small quantities of it.

然后它又会再次累积，一件事引发下一件事。

And then it just sort of again builds, one thing leads to the next.

所以我认为有一些基本且实用的方法可以帮助我们。

And so there are some basic practical things I think that could be of help.

米图？

Mitu?

我建议为应对慢性压力期或任何压力期做准备时，最重要的是高度重视睡眠，因为睡眠能重启参与压力反应的三大器官。

Well, one of the things I suggest for preparing for a period of chronic stress is or preparing for a period of stress, even if it's not chronic, is really, really focusing on sleep as major factor, simply because sleep resets your, the trio of organs are involved in the stress reaction.

此外，如果你睡眠不足，对食物的渴望、对更多食物的需求、对甜食的渴望都会被放大，因为睡眠不足会导致大脑认为需要更多能量和燃料——尽管它实际上并未像正常情况下那样健康运作。

Also, if you are sleep deprived, all the cravings, the need for more food, the need for sugary food is actually amplified because sleep deprivation results in your brain requiring more energy, more fuel, or thinking it requires more energy, more fuel because it's not functioning, it's not working as healthily as it should be.

这正是我们在压力下会选择错误食物的原因之一，因为那时我们的决策能力会受损。

It's one of the reasons we reach for the wrong foods when we're stressed, that we actually have impaired decision making when we're feeling like this.

关于决策和压力，有趣的是，压力本质上是大脑在按下某个按钮，认为自己尚未准备好应对即将到来的情况，因此它会进入默认的极度准备模式。

With decision making and stress, what's so interesting is, because stress very, very generally is your brain pushing on a button, thinking it's not prepared for what is to come, so we're going to just be on default, ultra ultra preparation mode.

当大脑按下这个按钮时，大脑会经历一种状态变化。

Now, when it pushes on that button, there is a sort of a state change that takes place in the brain.

前额叶皮层是大脑中负责思考、分析和前瞻性规划的关键区域。

So, the prefrontal cortex, which is the part of the brain that is really key for thinking, analysis, really planning ahead, and so on.

在压力下，激素和化学物质的释放会与前额叶皮层产生一种相互作用：一旦你开始感到紧张或焦躁，这些激素的浓度就会升高到足以通过一系列复杂的受体机制，使这一脑区暂时关闭。

And there is an interplay between the hormones and the chemicals are released during stress, in that as soon as you start becoming a little bit wired, or little bit jittery, the concentration of these hormones becomes high enough to actually take this part of the brain offline through a very interesting interplay of receptors.

所以，如果你想为压力时期做准备，尽量保持你的基础状态绝对正常，并让前额叶皮层保持活跃，这是另一种准备方式。

So really, if you want to prepare for a period of stress, trying to do all the things that keep your baseline absolutely normal and keeps the prefrontal cortex engaged is one of the other ways in which you can prepare.

睡眠是非常好的方法。

So sleep is a great thing.

第二件事当然是锻炼。

The second thing is, of course, exercise.

因为锻炼能确保或提升自主神经的灵活性。

Because exercise ensures or it improves autonomic flexibility.

你还会释放肌细胞因子，这有助于大脑功能，所有这些都有助于保持负责决策的大脑区域活跃、参与并发挥作用。

You also have myo kine release, which helps your brain function, and all of these go to helping the part of the brain that's responsible for decision making stay active, stay engaged, and play a role.

问题是，当你感到压力时，通常时间很紧张，而这些事情说起来容易做起来难，对吧？

Problem is, of course, when you're stressed you're often short on time and some of these things are easier said than done, aren't they?

但你能给我们一些建议，哪些食物可以缓解压力吗？

But could you give us an idea of which foods might be considered stress busters?

如果你想让食物成为对抗压力的武器，你应该在冰箱和冰柜里储备哪些食物？

Which foods should you get in your fridge and your freezer if you want food to be part of your arsenal against stress?

这是个很好的问题。

That's a great question.

我认为不会引起血糖飙升的食物非常重要。

I think foods that don't do glucose spikes are very important.

例如，含糖食物会导致血糖飙升。

So for example, sugary foods will give you a glucose spike.

高碳水化合物食物也会导致血糖飙升。

High carb foods will give you a glucose spike.

比如披萨，就会造成这种情况。

So pizza, for example, you know, will do that.

富含蛋白质的食物或健康的碳水化合物，如扁豆、全谷物食品，以及人们常说的地中海饮食，已被证明有助于健康饮食。

Protein rich or carbs that are healthy carbs, lentils, whole grain foods, the Mediterranean diet, for example, as people talk about and as has been shown to be helpful and and and part of a healthy diet.

我在这里要提到两点。

I bring in two things here.

首先，当你为压力情境做准备时，我也要强调昼夜节律的作用。

I bring in, first of all, when you're preparing for the stressful experience, I would also bring in the role of circadian rhythmicity.

我们知道皮质醇，知道在压力下我们会释放皮质醇，但皮质醇实际上具有24小时的节律。

So, we know about cortisol, we know that we release cortisol when we are stressed, but cortisol actually has a twenty four hour rhythm.

早晨会有一个小高峰，然后逐渐下降。

And there's a small spike in the morning, and then that gradually goes down.

如果你在晚上进食，无论吃的是什么，每餐后都会释放皮质醇。

If you eat in the evening, you release cortisol after every meal, regardless of what you eat.

但如果你在晚上进食，就会出现异常的皮质醇峰值，这会干扰你的昼夜节律。

But if you eat in the evening, you're getting this abnormal cortisol spike, and that is feeding into your circadian rhythm and distorting it.

因此，展望未来当你即将面临压力时，我建议你严格遵守与昼夜节律一致的用餐时间，也就是在一天中合适的时间进食。

So looking ahead to when you are going to be stressed, I would suggest really, really trying to observe meal times which are in line with your circadian rhythm, so eating at the right times of the day.

既然你们都了解压力、我们的身体以及我们该吃和不该吃的食物，

And knowing everything you both know about stress, our bodies, and the foods we go for, and the foods we should go for.

在那些压力时刻，你真的能抵抗原始的冲动，吃得健康吗？

Do you actually manage in those stressful moments to resist the primeval urges and to eat well?

你做到了吗？

Do you do it?

嗯，我确实努力了。

Well, we certainly I certainly try.

但我也得承认，我常常还没反应过来，手就已经伸进冰箱，拿出了冰淇淋盒子。

And but I'm also I'll be the first to admit that I found my hand in the freezer before I've known it, and with the carton of ice cream.

对吧？

Right?

所以我认为，你可以做一些事情来约束自己，保持觉察和投入非常重要。

And so I think there are things you can do to keep yourself in check and being aware and engaged is really important.

我每天都这么做。

And I do that every day.

我每天都试着这么做。

I try to do that every day.

但我说的很多内容，比如食物的隐蔽性，我自己也经历过这种感觉。

But a lot of what I'm talking about, like food being sneaky, I've caught myself feeling that.

哦，瞧瞧这个。

Oh, look at that.

我只是多吃了那一口。

I just had that extra bite.

但我并没有吃掉它。

I didn't eat it.

我觉得在压力大的时候，我曾经吃过东西，但事后才意识到自己已经吃了。

I think I've eaten food before and only realized I've kind of done it afterwards in these stress moments.

我觉得我可以采取这样的方法：没关系，但要提前准备，提前准备，提前准备。

I think I I take the I take the approach that it's okay, but prepare, prepare, prepare.

所以要利用那句老话：趁太阳还在，赶紧晒草。

So use the, you know, the old adage of make hay while the sun shines.

所以每当我没有处于压力期时，我会尽一切可能确保我的新陈代谢正常，做所有正确的事，不做任何错误的事，比如锻炼、睡觉、注意饮食。

So whenever I'm not in a period of stress, I do absolutely everything possible to make sure my metabolism is okay and I need to do all the right things, not do any of the wrong things, exercise, sleep, looking at what I'm eating.

然后我知道，如果在压力期不小心犯了错，也没关系。

And then I know that if I do slip up during periods of stress, it's okay.

我已经建立了韧性，并会尽快重新回到正轨。

I've built resilience, and I try to reenter that as soon as possible.

所以，这更像是一种我学会培养的宽容，充分利用非压力时期，确保我的基础状态尽可能理想。

So it's more a sort of a forgiveness that I've I've learned to develop and really making absolute use of the times when I'm not stressed to make sure my baseline is as optimal as possible.

这听起来真是个好消息。

Well, that feels like really good news.

拉吉塔，你也在点头。

And Rajita, you're nodding too.

没错。

That's right.

是的，我觉得这是一种非常好的思考方式。

Yeah, I think that's a great way of thinking about it.

我喜欢这样，米图。

I love that, Mitu.

每天都要重视这一点，非常重要。

It's so important to take it every day.

你可能会跌倒，但这没关系。

You might trip up and that's okay.

而重要的是，宽恕这个概念真的很美好。

And the important thing, would just The forgiveness is such a nice concept.

另一件事是，当你的思绪陷入关于搞砸的焦虑想法时，别对自己太苛刻。

The other thing is when your mind goes to those anxiety thoughts about screwing up, don't give yourself a hard time about it.

即使事实如此，事情已经发生，那就向前看。

Even if it is what it is, it's already happened, you look ahead.

谢谢。

Thank you.

享受冰淇淋，然后继续前进。

Enjoy the ice cream and move on.

没错。

That's right.

拉吉塔·辛哈教授和。

Professor Rajita Sinha and Doctor.

米图·多罗尼，你们有什么自己的建议来控制压力及其影响吗？

Mittus Doroni, Do you have your own tips for keeping stress and its effects under control?