#2420 - 克里斯·马斯特约翰

那么，保持身体机能的主要因素有哪些？

So what are the primary factors in regards to being able to maintain your function?

嗯，我认为每个人都有自己的独特之处，线粒体检测非常重要。

Well, I think that everyone has idiosyncratic things, and I think mitochondrial testing is is very important.

但如果要我选出五件每个人都应该为线粒体做的事，其中很多听起来可能像你在其他地方也能得到的健康建议，但这些确实是最有效的方法。

But if I were to pick five things that just everyone should be doing for their mitochondria, A lot of it does look like health advice you might get somewhere else, but it it actually is the best stuff.

对吧？

Right?

我们提到了肌酸，我认为肌酸非常重要，因为它主要不是存在于线粒体中，而是将线粒体的能量传递到细胞其他部分，同时这也反馈到线粒体的修复功能上。

So we mentioned creatine, and I think creatine is really important because it's not in the mitochondria so much as it carries forth the mitochondrial energy of the rest of the cell, but that also feeds back in the repair functions for the mitochondria.

所以我认为优化肌酸水平极其重要。

So I think creatine optimizing your creatine status is super important.

我认为所有每天不吃一到两磅肉的人都应该补充肌酸。

And I think that everyone who's not eating one or two pounds of meat per day should probably be taking creatine.

你可以这样想：如果你吃红肉并且是三分熟的，可以按一磅的量来计算。

And you can think of it as if you're eating red meat and you're eating it rare, you can on the side of one pound.

如果你吃的是红肉，我会把鲑鱼也算作红肉，这种带红色的鱼类其实含有很高的肌酸。

And if you're eating and I I would include as red meat salmon, which is like a reddish fish and is actually quite high in creatine.

如果你吃的是白肉或白鱼，并且烹饪得很熟，你需要接近两磅的量，因为它们本身肌酸含量较少，烹饪过程中还会流失，最终摄入量会低很多。

If you're eating white meat, white fish, and you're eating eating it well done, you wanna on the side of two pounds because you you're lose they don't have as much creatine, then you cook the creatine out of them, and you wind up with much lower dose.

我们或许该明确说是鲑鱼。

We should probably say salmon.

你指的是野生鲑鱼与养殖鲑鱼的区别，后者是人工染色的粉红色鱼皮。

You're talking about wild salmon versus farm salmon, which has a dyed pink skin.

嗯，并不是因为红色。

Well, it's not the red color.

我认为红色只是巧合，那只是巧合。

I think it's coincidence that it's that it's I think the red color is coincidence.

这只是个有助于理解的思考方式。

It's just a helpful way to think about it.

但至少就我所见，每条大西洋养殖鲑鱼都能看出——如果你查数据库的话，它的脂肪含量确实高得多。

But it probably is the case at least like, every Atlantic farm salmon that I've seen is can tell that it's it's well, if you look up in the database, it's way higher in fat.

但你可以通过观察发现，它没有野生鲑鱼那种精瘦的外观。

But you can tell by looking at it that it just doesn't have that lean look that wild salmon has.

所以我认为肌酸含量与瘦肉组织质量有关。

So I think creatine is a function of the lean tissue mass.

而且可能野生鲑鱼进行了更多的游动。

And and it might be the case that wild salmon are doing a lot more swimming.

也许野生环境促使它们以某种方式使用肌肉，从而增加了肌酸合成，这并不令人惊讶。

Like maybe a wild environment is encouraging them to use their muscles in a way that increases their creatine synthesis, that wouldn't be surprising wouldn't surprise me.

我曾试图为‘是否存在一种纯素食饮食能让你无需额外补充肌酸’这一观点进行辩护论证。

I have tried to steel man the case of could there be a vegan diet that would make you not need to supplement with creatine?

而我得出的辩护结论是：你每天需要食用半公斤豆腐和半公斤藜麦。

And the steel man that I've got for you is you'd have to be eating a half a kilogram of tofu and a half a kilogram of quinoa per day.

这显然不是常规饮食方式——而且可能会对你的消化系统造成损伤，但这只是理论假设。

And that's not typically what and that might rip a hole in your digestive system, but that's Boy.

但事实并非如此。

But that's not true.

我的胃。

My stomach.

只是说说而已。

Just saying.

所以我认为大多数素食者可能应该直接补充肌酸。

So I I think that most vegans should probably just supplement with creatine.

可以就此打住。

Could call it a day there.

这就是肌酸。

So that's creatine.

我们提到过阳光。

I we mentioned sunlight.

阳光是当你早上醒来时，我之前说过你的线粒体并没有真正入睡，但它们确实放慢了速度。

So sunlight is when you wake up in the morning, I said before that your mitochondria have not gone to sleep literally, but they've really slowed down.

就像它们在打盹一样。

It's like they're on a nap.

当你醒来时，线粒体会经历一个转变过程，它们需要意识到：'哦，你醒了，现在我也该醒过来，开始生产更多能量了。'

And there's a transition when you wake up where the mitochondria have to say, oh, you've woken up, now I need to wake up, and I need to start producing more energy.

而阳光进入你的眼睛，转化为大脑信号，正是这个信号告诉你的大脑去协调这一过程。

And sunlight going into your eyes, being translated into your brain, is the signal that actually tells your brain to organize that.

因此，这种信号传导会帮助你的线粒体适应并开始全面运作，实际上有助于它们进行调整。

And so what happens as a result of that is that signaling helps your mitochondria adapt and start producing everything, and it actually helps them adjust.

如果你没有晨间阳光的照射，你的早晨将充满次优的能量代谢，这会启动衰老的恶性循环。

And if you don't have the morning sunlight, you are going to have your mornings full of suboptimal energy metabolism that is initiating that vicious cycle of aging.

这是我的看法。

That's what I believe.

此外，阳光中的红光和红外线对线粒体也非常有益。

And then it's also the case that the red and infrared light from the sun is very beneficial to the mitochondria.

获取这种光线的最佳时间是早晨。

The best time to get that would be in the morning.

如果你下午出门，就得考虑如何在不被晒伤的情况下获得两小时的照射。

When you go out in the afternoon, you've got to deal with like, can I get two hours of this without getting burned?

但如果你早晨出门，可以在户外待上一两个小时，吸收大量红光和红外线，而不用担心灼伤波长的光线。

But if you go out in the morning, you can stay out there for one or two hours and you can get a lot of red and infrared light without worrying about burning wavelengths.

然后我认为床铺和其他家用设备也很棒。

And then the I think the beds and other devices at home are great.

你需要开始思考的是：我正在从红光和近红外线中获益，但我知道如果能获得比阳光照射更多的量，就能得到更大益处。

And where you wanna start thinking about that is I'm getting benefit from red and near infrared light, but I'm getting more I know that I could get more benefit if I got more of it than I'm able to get through sunlight.

所以让我以阳光为基础开始获取这些波长，然后在此基础上根据对你有效的方案自由调整。

So start me start getting those wavelengths with sunlight as your base, and then do whatever you want on top of that with whatever seems to be working well for you.

营养摄入将排在第三位，虽然身体各项机能都需要所有营养素，但线粒体尤其需要消耗各类营养物质。

Then nutrition would be number three, and every nutrient is needed for everything in your body, but your mitochondria are using all kinds of nutrients.

社会上流传着一种观点，认为营养缺乏已是过去式。

There's And this idea that floats around in society that nutritional deficiencies are a thing of the past.

但只需看看调查数据：93%的美国人至少有一种营养素摄入不足。

But if you just look at surveys, ninety three percent of Americans are getting less than they need of at least one nutrient.

30%的人血液检测明确显示至少存在一种营养缺乏症状，6%的人血液指标证实存在多种营养素缺乏。

Thirty percent have verifiable blood markers of at least one nutritional deficiency, and six percent have blood markers verifying more than one nutrient deficiency.

而且我认为这些数据都被低估了，因为当你只看官方统计数据，比如每种营养素应该摄入多少时，实际上有很多人的需求量远高于此。

And I think those are all underestimates because when you're just looking at the official stats on like how much of each nutrient should you eat, there are way there are a lot of people that have needs for way more.

对吧？

Right?

所以我认为这些数据严重低估了需要改善营养状况的人数。

So I think those stats are grossly underestimating how many people need to get better nutrition.

因此我认为每个人都应该改善自己的营养摄入。

So I think everybody should be getting better nutrition.

从宏观层面来看，我认为虽然饮食方式因人而异，但一些实用的经验法则是：不同人可能更适合以植物为主或以动物为主，但食用动物时应当遵循'从头吃到尾'的原则。

And to kind of high level what that looks like, I think some good rules of, there's lots of ways to skin a cap, but some good rules of thumb are different people will do better with more plants or more animals, but when you do eat animals, you should be eating them nose to tail.

所以至少尝试摄入肝脏，或者尝试饮用骨汤之类的食物。

So at least try to work in liver, at least try to work in bone broth or you know, something like that.

动物性食物吃得越完整（从头到尾），对健康越有益。

The closer to nose to tail you can eat your animals, the better.

尽量多样化蛋白质来源，因为不同类型的蛋白质含有不同的维生素和矿物质成分。

Do try to diversify across proteins because there's just different vitamin and mineral profiles in different types of protein.

比如，如果你能吃贝类，就吃些贝类。

Like, if you can eat shellfish, eat some shellfish.

如果你能吃鱼，就吃些鱼。

If you can eat fish, eat some fish.

如果你能吃乳制品，就吃些乳制品。

You can eat dairy, eat some dairy.

你摄入的蛋白质种类越多样化越好。

And the more you diversify across those proteins, better.

大多数人摄入的蛋白质都不够。

Most people don't eat enough protein.

一个好的经验法则是：你餐盘中至少三分之一应该是蛋白质。

Good rule of thumb would be at least a third of your plate should be protein.

但如果是鸡蛋和乳制品这类食物，你需要加倍摄入量，因为它们单位体积提供的蛋白质含量较低——一盘鸡蛋根本提供不了足够的蛋白质。

But if it's if you're talking like eggs and dairy products, you've got to double that because they just the amount of space they occupy per per unit of protein that they're giving you is is a thirty year plate of eggs is not gonna give you enough protein.

另外我认为要尽可能广泛地摄入不同类型的碳水化合物。

And then I think try to eat as broadly as you can from different types of carbohydrates.

如果必须舍弃某些食物，那就舍弃谷物，尽量吃完整的未加工食品，并尽量确保80%的食物是在家烹饪或准备的，而不是外出就餐，同时要保证消化系统正常运作。

If you have to leave out something, leave out grains, try to eat whole unprocessed foods, and try to eat most of your try to eat 80% of your foods cooked at home, or prepped at home, whatever instead of eating out, and make sure your digestion is in good order.

这些可以说是营养学的基础原则。

And those are kind of the, you know, the broad bases of nutrition.

是的。

Yeah.

而运动则是一个非常有趣的话题。

And exercise is is a very interesting one.

因此，如果你运动，这对产生线粒体的信号传导极其重要。

So if you exercise is incredibly important to the signaling that produce mitochondria.

但这是为什么呢？

But why is that?

这是因为你需要线粒体来为你所做的运动产生能量。

It's because you need mitochondria to produce energy for the exercise that you're doing.

所以我认为很多人在考虑应该为你的线粒体做哪种运动时过于简化了。

So I think a lot of people are too reductionist when they look at what type of exercise should you do for your mitochondria.

如果你试图进行一项研究，比如我想在骨骼肌中获得更多线粒体，哪种运动能实现这一目标？

If you try to do a study that says like, I'm trying to get more mitochondria in my skeletal muscle, what exercise gonna do it?

你会发现耐力运动的表现优于其他运动，这是因为耐力活动需要肌肉中更多的线粒体功能。

You're gonna see endurance exercise outperforming other things, and that's because endurance activity requires more mitochondrial function in the muscle.

如果你在进行增肌或力量训练，做短组动作，你的肌肉会消耗大量糖原，对线粒体的依赖较少，因此你不会在那里看到线粒体功能的提升。

If you're doing like hypertrophy or strength training and you're doing short sets, your muscle's burning a lot of glycogen, it's less dependent on its mitochondria, so you're not gonna see the mitochondrial function there.

但这并不意味着你没有改善线粒体功能，因为实际上这意味着肝脏正在介入协助肌肉。

But that doesn't mean you're not improving mitochondrial function because now all that really means is the liver is stepping up to assist the muscle.

比如你进行短跑时，你的肌肉会消耗大量碳水化合物，产生大量乳酸。

Like if you're doing sprinting, your muscle's burning through tons of carbohydrates, making a lot of lactate.

如果这些乳酸没有在骨骼肌中代谢，它们会进入肝脏被重新转化为葡萄糖。

If that lactate's not being metabolized in the skeletal muscle, it's going to the liver to get converted back to glucose.

所以现在你正在训练肝脏的线粒体。

So your liver now you're training your liver's mitochondria.

当你进行力量训练时，你是在进行增肌。

When you're doing strength training, you're doing hypertrophy.

因此我认为正确的看待方式是：你应该锻炼所有需要保持的功能。

So I think the right way to look at it is just you should be exercising all the things that are functions that you need to keep.

这意味着耐力、力量、灵活性、敏捷性、平衡性、本体感觉，以及能够对环境做出反应的能力。

And that means endurance, it means strength, it means mobility, it means agility, it means balance, it means proprioception, it means being able to respond to your environment.

某种程度上来说，参加有他人参与的运动很重要——比如当有人扔飞盘而你需要反应时，你正在训练大脑中能为反应系统供能的线粒体。

Think to some degree, like just playing a sport that has other people in it is important because if someone's throwing a frisbee and you need to react to that, you're training mitochondria in your brain that are able to energize the systems that provide your reaction time.

我认为大脑的认知训练包括记忆力训练、创造性思维培养等各个方面。

And I think cognitive exercise for your brain is things like working on your memory and on your creative synthesis and all those different aspects.

我确实觉得很多人在25岁时会想'我才不在乎能不能记住25个数字'。

And I do think that a lot of people are thinking about this when they're 25, they're like, I don't care if I can memorize a string of 25 numbers.

但当你75岁什么都记不住时，你就会在意了。

But you're gonna care if you can't remember anything when you're 75.

我认为我们需要对此进行全面思考。

I think that we really need a broad thought about this.

顺便问一下，你知道职业运动员中哪类人最长寿吗？

But by the way, do you know what athletes live the longest from the pros?

让我猜猜。

Let me guess.

棒球？

Baseball?

实际上，体操运动员和撑杆跳高运动员比普通人群多活八年。

It's actually gymnasts and pole vaulters have eight years on the general population.

如果你看看今年早些时候发布的一项研究，它统计了所有国家职业运动员的数据，这些运动员的死亡日期被公开，并且足够有名气以至于有关于他们的文章发表。

And if you if you look at there's a study that came out earlier this year, and it tallied up all of the pro sports players from all of the countries who had the dates of their death published and who were notable enough to have been had an article published about them.

所以他们有数百个样本。

And so they had many hundreds.

我忘了具体的样本量。

I forgot I forgot the exact sample size.

但他们能够从统计学上调整运动员来源的普通人群的死亡率。

But they were able to statistically adjust the the mortality rate to the general population from which the athlete came.

所以，比如，如果是一名希腊运动员，就会根据他们去世时希腊的死亡率进行调整。

So if, you know, if it was a Greek athlete, they were adjusted to the mortality rate of Greece when they when they died.

就像，在调整了地理位置和年龄等因素后你所预期的那样。

Like, how what you would expect after adjusting for location and age and so on.

而在男性运动员中，体操和撑杆跳运动员比普通人群多活八年。

And in the male athletes, you had gymnasts and pole vaulters with eight years on the population.

还有自行车选手，当然还有相扑选手。

And you've got cyclists who've and of course, you've got sumos.

相扑选手的寿命比常人短十年。

Sumo wrestlers are ten years below.

还有很多运动项目如受伤率很高的格斗类项目，对手部冲击特别大，虽然运动本身对身体能量系统的训练有积极作用，但高受伤率抵消了这些好处，所以结果处于中间水平。

And you have a lot of sports like that have high injury rates that are especially a lot of stuff that has impacts to the hands, martial arts, and things like that, where probably the sport itself and its impact on training your body's energy systems is positive, but just the injury rate is is taking you out, so you're you're kind of like not you're kind of in the middle.

你与普通人群的寿命非常接近。

You're very close to the general population.

自行车选手只比普通人群多活两年。

Cyclists only have two years on the general population.

所以我觉得有几点特别有意思。

And so what what I thought was interest I think a few things are interesting about that.

首先，在长寿领域有很多人从专攻自行车运动的人那里获取关于如何训练以延长寿命的大部分信息。

So first of all, there's a lot of people in the longevity space are taking most of their information about how they should train for longevity from people who specialize in cycling.

真的吗？

Really?

嗯，是的。

So, well, I yeah.

我不想点名，但你知道，市面上很多人都是从这个领域获取信息的。

I'm not gonna name names, but there's, you know, a lot of just the people out there who are you know, that's where it's coming from.

而且你知道，自行车运动对心肺健康确实很有好处，这点很有道理。

And I you know, it makes a lot of sense that cycling is you know, it's good for cardiorespiratory fitness.

大量数据表明，良好的心肺健康是长寿的关键因素。

There's a lot of data that having good cardiorespiratory fitness is a key factor for longevity.

但当你看到一项研究显示体操运动员和撑杆跳运动员比自行车运动员多活六年，而自行车运动员只比普通人群多活两年时，我就想：什么情况？

But when you look at a study where gymnasts and pole vaulters have six extra years on the cyclists and the cyclists only have two extra years on the general population, I'm like, What?

你看，长寿并不全取决于心肺健康。

You know, it's not all about the cardiorespiratory fitness.

所以当我想到这是一项观察性研究时，你知道的。

And so when I think about there's it's, you know, it's an observational study.

你无法证明因果关系，但这确实让人思考。

You can't prove cause and effect, but it just does make you think.

我对这个问题的思考有几个方面。

And the way that I think about that is a few things.

首先，体操运动员和撑杆跳高运动员之间的共同点，肯定不是身高，因为体操运动员通常较矮而撑杆跳高运动员较高。

So first of all, the commonalities between gymnasts and pole vaulters, they're it's definitely not height because gymnasts tend to be short and pole vaulters are tall.

所以身高因素相互抵消了。

And so the height cancels out.

他们确实都很健康。

Definitely they're fit.

有趣的是，自行车运动员下肢发达，而体操运动员和撑杆跳高运动员上肢发达。

They do both have it is interesting that they have you know, cyclists have a good lower body and gymnasts and pole vaulters have a good upper body.

所以这确实很有趣，让人不禁思考是否可以跳过练腿日。

So I do think that's interesting that it does make you wonder if you could skip leg day.

我不提倡跳过腿部训练日。

I don't advocate skipping leg day.

在我看来，真正的原因在于全身运动功能的协调性——这种协调性能够培养他们所需的特定技能，而这些训练内容在你只专注于确保心肺功能足以支持跑步或骑行时往往被忽略了。

To me, what I think is actually going on here is I think that functionality of movement throughout the whole body to facilitate very to facilitate the kind of skills that they have is is training it's training at things that are getting left out when you just make sure that your heart and lungs are able to support your running or your cycling.

我认为其中一些因素可能相关，虽然我不确定他们具体避免了哪些致命疾病。

And I think that some of those involve are probably related I don't know what they're not dying of.

因此可以推测，他们患心脏病、癌症和神经系统疾病的概率更低，因为这些正是人们通常的致死病因。

So presumably they're getting less heart disease or getting less cancer and they're getting less neurological disease because that's what people are dying of.

对吧？

Right?

就像平均而言，如果有人活得足够久让人分析死因，你知道的，糖尿病、髋部骨折这类病症正侵袭更年轻的人群。

Like the in the average, if you get far enough for someone to analyze why you died, you know, they're like diabetes and hip fractures and things like that are hitting younger people.

但一般来说，如果人们因年老而死亡，首要死因是心脏病，其次是癌症，而神经系统疾病——如果他们活得比前两者更久，就会出现各种不同的死因，神经系统疾病的多样性变得相当突出。

But in general, if people are dying because they got old, they're dying of heart disease first, cancer second, and neurologic like they outlive those two things, you get this diverse spread of things that people die of and neurologic diverse neurological diseases becomes pretty heavy.

所以我认为心肺健康可能是预防心脏病的最大因素。

So I think cardiorespiratory fitness is probably the biggest thing in preventing heart disease.

但癌症变得非常有趣，因为有项啮齿动物研究表明拉伸运动能抑制肿瘤生长。

But cancer becomes very interesting because there was a study in rodents that showed that stretching prevents tumor growth.

而我

And I

以为

thought

这太疯狂了。

this was wild.

我最初是在Huberman的节目里听说这个的。

I first heard about this on one of Huberman's shows.

于是我查阅了那项研究，当时就觉得这太疯狂了，因为我恰好对免疫功能有些其他了解。

And so I looked up the study and I was like, this is wild because I happen to know some other things about immune function.

其中一点是，T细胞在预防感染方面很重要，同时它们也会在自身免疫疾病中攻击你。

So one thing is that when in T cells, which are important both to prevent infections and are also important because they attack you during autoimmunity.

它们的重要性还体现在能够杀死癌细胞。

And they're also important because they kill cancer.

T细胞要被激活时，它们自身能量不足，所以会从周围环境中获取能量。

For T cells to be activated, what they do is they don't have enough energy themselves, so they push off the local environment.

这种能量获取过程会在细胞内产生运动蛋白，从而生成激活T细胞所需的能量。

And that pushing off creates motor proteins inside that generate the energy to activate the T cell.

而癌症的做法是改变其细胞外环境来破坏这一机制，因为这样T细胞更难从中获取能量。

And what cancers do is they modify their extracellular environment to compromise that because it's harder for the T cell to push off of it.

我从克罗恩病研究中还了解到，除了药物治疗外，最佳的治疗方法是采用流质饮食。

Now I know another thing from Crohn's research, which is that the best way to cure Crohn's disease besides some of the drugs that they're on is a liquid diet.

最新研究表明，流质饮食的作用机理是消除了肠道内向外推压的压力，这种压力会引发炎症激活并攻击身体。

And the recent research on how the liquid diet works is that it removes the pressure in the intestine that is pushing out and is causing inflammation to activate and attack the body.

对吧？

Right?

我把这三件事综合起来想，就觉得很有道理：相对比例、拉伸程度、关节组织质量等因素，很可能在癌症和自身免疫疾病中有着严重被低估的因果关系。

So I'm synthesizing these three things and I'm like, this makes a lot of sense that the relative proportions and how stretched out and like what is the quality of your joint tissue and things like that, probably has a lot of severely underappreciated causation in terms of cancer and autoimmune disease.

所以我认为，如果能优化功能性机械运动能力——比如像杂技演员那样在秋千上翻转、在吊环上摆动、推举身体等动作——看看实际功能性机械活动会产生什么影响，将会非常有趣。

So I think it would be very interesting to see if actual functional mechanical activity, like if you optimize for functional mechanical activity such that you can swing around from acrobat from a trapeze and flip around in the air and swing on rings and push yourself up and stuff like that.

这是否会促进更好的免疫功能，因为你的身体结构更合理？

Does that pay forward into better immune function because your body is more properly structured?

我无法证明这一点，但我觉得这两种运动方式很值得思考。

I can't prove that, but I think it's very interesting to think about for those two exercises.

还有一个让我觉得很有趣的现象是，体操运动员和撑杆跳运动员都会花很多时间倒立。

And then it is very interesting to me that gymnasts and pole vaulters both spend a lot of time upside down.

他们倒立的时间虽然不长，但会反复多次进行倒立，对吧？

And they don't stay upside down for very long, but they just, they repeatedly are upside down quite a bit, right?

所以，这些都只是假设性的有趣想法，对吗？

And so, is just, again, is all just hypothesizing interesting ideas, right?

一个有趣的观点是：振动平台相当于久坐人群的体操运动。

So one interesting idea is that a vibration plate is the sedentary man's gymnastics.

而倒立比行走更能促进体液循环。

And that flipping upside down is better at circulating body fluids than walking.

就像振动平台比行走更有效一样，实际上花时间进行倒立和翻转动作对促进体内液体循环非常有益。

And like a vibration plate is better than walking, but actually spending time in the upside down state and flipping around is actually very good for circulating the fluids in your body.

我无法证明这些观点，但思考起来都很有意思。

I can't prove any of this, but it's all very interesting to think about.

但我从中得出的结论是，你不想陷入只优化最大摄氧量之类的事情。

But what I kind of conclude from this is you don't want to get sucked into just optimizing VO two max or something like that.

从体操运动员身上真正要学的是，他们能做而我不擅长的事情有哪些？

You really want to the lesson from the gymnast is like, what are all the things that a gymnast can do that I can't do?

我应该尽我所能去接近这些能力。

And I should be able to approximate them in the best way that I can.

我对这个观点理解得稍微更字面化一些。

And I take that a little bit more literally.

所以我实际上正在尝试把所有训练都转化为体操版本。

So I actually do like, I am trying to convert all my workouts into, like, what's the gymnastic version of this?

你认为这是因为倒立动作吗？

And you think it's because of flipping?

你不觉得是拉力吗？这两者都涉及协调性和爆发力运动。

You don't think it's a pull I'm they're both involving coordination, explosive movement.

对。

Right.

而且我我认为我

And I I think the I

认为我

think I

认为是的。

think that yes.

所以我认为这种技能训练对神经系统疾病的预防很重要，但我正试图将它们与那三点联系起来。

So I think this the skill training is is big for spill off into neurological disease because but I'm just trying to connect them to the three things.

我不确定他们具体因何死亡率较低，我们需要更多研究来证实。

So I'm not sure exactly what they have lower rates of death from, we need more studies to see that.

但身体力学我认为是一个非常有趣的潜在解释，说明为何他们癌症发病率更低。

But the body mechanics I think is a very interesting possible explanation of why they'd have lower rates of cancer.

而你刚才说的我认为完美解释了为何他们神经系统疾病发病率会更低。

And what you just said I think is a great explanation of why they would have lower rates of neurological disease.

我认为这有点像，你知道，在长寿领域人们常犯的另一个错误是，他们花了太多时间逆向思考如何从100岁倒推。

And I think it's kind of like, you know, if you look at I think another thing that people mistake in the longevity space is they spend too much time thinking about like reverse engineering a 100 backwards.

到那时我不想失去什么？

What do I wanna not have lost by that time?

而没有足够的时间专注于保持最佳机能。

And not enough time just being in peak function.

以骨量为例，骨量在25到30岁左右的中青年时期达到顶峰。

Because if you look at bone mass for example, bone mass goes up until you're in your mid twenties, maybe 25 to 30.

男女之间略有差异。

There's a little bit difference with men and women.

但之后就会逐渐下降。

But then it just goes down after that.

如果你想在75岁时拥有良好的骨量，最重要的资本就是在25岁时达到非常高的峰值骨量。

And if you wanna have good bone mass when you're 75, the most important asset you could possibly have is to have really good peak bone mass when you're 25.

对吧？

Right?

所以我真的认为，就像我之前说的，你可能觉得在任何年龄记忆25个数字都不重要。

So I really think that like, it's just like I said before, you might not think memorizing a string of 25 numbers is important at any age.

但你要知道，如果你能拥有极佳的记忆力峰值，那会为你日后记忆力的衰退留出很大缓冲空间。

But you know, if you're gonna have really awesome peak memory, that gives you a lot of room to decline later on.

而如果你试图逆向思考75岁时不想忘记什么，我认为你把标准定得太低了。

Whereas if you're trying to reverse engineer like what you don't wanna be able to not remember when you're 75, I think you're just setting the bar way too low.

对吧？

Right?

所以如果你20岁，你应该思考的是：有哪些运动是我做不到的？

So if you're 20, you should be thinking about like, what are all the sports I can't do?

我不是说选择某项运动有什么问题，但我确实认为，趁年轻时每年尝试一项新运动对每个人都有好处。

And not, you know, I'm not saying there's anything wrong with picking a sport, but I do think it's it would be good for everyone when they're young enough to do so to just try a different sport once a year.

也许他们不会爱上这项运动，但可能会学到一些东西，比如'哦，我没想到自己做不到这个'。

And maybe they don't love it, they don't fall in love with it, but maybe they learn something like, oh, I didn't realize I couldn't do that.

举个例子，去年我就尝试了一点巴西柔术和拳击。

So for example, I did last year, I did a little bit of BJJ and I did a little bit of boxing.

我当时就想，天啊，我的脚步在拳击中已经不如从前灵活了。

And I was like, goddamn, like, my feet don't move like they used to in boxing.

而在巴西柔术中，我做前后滚翻时有点头晕。

And in in BJJ, was I was getting a little dizzy doing forward and backward rolls.

我当时想，这大概是因为我太少练习——那时我还没开始思考体操运动员倒立的问题。

I was like, don't spend enough this was before I started thinking about the gymnast being upside down.

我就意识到，我平时倒立的时间太少了。

I was like, I don't spend enough time being upside down.

所以我买了些垫子，现在每天雷打不动地做一组前后滚翻——虽然现在不练柔术了，但我把前后滚翻纳入了晨间例行训练。

So I was like so I bought some mats, and then now I just know, I do I do one forward and backward roll every day no matter I don't do BJJ right now, but I just do one forward and backward roll every day as part of my morning routine.

但我也调整了训练方式，比如想着：既然能做靠墙倒立撑，为什么还要做过头推举呢？

But I've also switched, like, was like, why would I overhead press when I could try to do I can do wall push ups now.

我希望到明年就能做到倒立撑了。

My hope is by next year I'll be able to do handstand push ups.

不过目前还在练习倒立阶段，看看效果如何吧。

But I'm working on a handstand right now, so we'll see how that goes.

但我认为，仅仅因为你能专注于一件事，就可能会忽略掉——比如，我最喜欢的锻炼方式难道不...我是说，很多人都在做他们所有喜欢的锻炼项目，却忘了他们根本没有做任何旋转动作。

But I think just because you can focus on one thing, you can really miss out that like, oh, my favorite workout activities don't I mean, this is how many people are doing all their favorite workout activities and forgetting that they don't have any rotation.

他们没有任何侧弯动作。

They don't have any side bending.

你懂吗？

You know?

就像如果你尝试一项不同的运动，就会意识到：哦，我之前完全没注意到自己根本做不到这个动作？

Like if you would just try a different sport and be like, oh, what did I not realize I wasn't able to do at all?

然后选择它并加入你的训练计划中。

And then pick that and put it in your workout.

要知道，如果你有个很棒的编程师，那你的训练计划可能就很完美了。

Know, because if you've got a great programmer, then maybe your workout is perfect.

但我认为我们大多数人都会倾向于选择一些自认为不错的锻炼项目。

But I think most of us can like, we gravitate towards some of the exercises that we think are good.

即使你以为自己在做多样化训练，比如CrossFit，CrossFit却设法剔除了所有旋转动作。

And even if you think you're mixing it up, like CrossFit, CrossFit managed to to eliminate rotation from everything.

比如，几乎每种涉及投球的运动都需要旋转动作。

Like, the like, every sport that involves throwing a ball involves rotation.

对吧？

Right?

嗯，他们有时候确实会。

It's Well, they they do sometimes.

他们会侧身对着墙投球。

They throw the ball sideways against a wall.

这里面确实有些

There's there's some

旋转动作。

rotation in it.

可能他们特意加进去的。

Maybe they worked it in.

我练CrossFit时，我们做的投球训练是墙球。

When I did CrossFit, the ball throwing we did was wall balls.

当时感觉就像是

And it was so it was like

我认为这完全取决于是谁在教。

Depends in I think it depends entirely on who's teaching it.

但是，是的。

But Yeah.

这很有道理。

That makes a sense.

风车式。

Windmills.

没错。

Yep.

风车式确实是的。

Windmills are Yeah.

当然。

For sure.

一种旋转形式。

A form of rotation.

他们做的很多腹部练习都是旋转动作。

There's a lot of ab exercises they do that are rotational.

是的。

Yep.

好的。

Alright.

所以我可能那不太公平。

So I that maybe that wasn't fair.

但是，嗯。

But Yeah.

但我的意思是，很多人，很多人，很多人根本没有做任何旋转动作。

But my point is that, like, a lot A lot of a lot of a lot of people are not doing any rotation.

对吧？

Right?

对。

Right.

所以...我只是想让你关注那种多样性，比如我在锻炼时有哪些功能没有锻炼到？

And and so I I just I just you just wanna tap into that that diversity of, like, what functions am I not exercising when I exercise them?

当我们谈论技能时，我们说的是神经系统和认知系统协同配合的舞蹈。

When we're talking about skills, we're talking about the neurological system and the cognitive system synergistically in a dance.

谈到老年人时，认知功能衰退的表现之一就是失去解谜能力，而他们认为延缓这种衰退的方法就是做填字游戏等各种不同类型的活动。

When you talk about old people and one of one of the things that happens when cognitive function declines is you you lose your ability to do puzzles, and one of the way to stave that off, they believe, is, like, do crosswords, do a bunch of different things.

你的国际象棋。

Your con chess.

做些能让你的大脑积极运转的事情。

Do something that's actively making your mind fire and work.

这不就更有意义吗？一项技能而非单纯的锻炼，不只是卧推、深蹲这类动作，而是像泰拳击打沙袋或轻度对练这样的实际技能，你在运动的同时也在思考，这非常不同，因为你要有意识地观察对手的动作。

Wouldn't it just make sense that a skill versus just a a workout, just bench pressing and squats and stuff like that, but it's an actual skill where you're doing, like, Muay Thai, hitting pads, or even light sparring that you're you're thinking as as well as exercising, which is very different because you're you're con you're you're consciously aware of your opponent's movement.

你在计算这些动作。

You're calculating it.

你正在尝试把握时机。

You're you're you're trying to time things.

在你的身体与思维之间存在着一种纯粹的舞蹈，这在常规锻炼中是不存在的。

There's a whole dance going on between your body and your mind that doesn't really exist in straight workouts.

因此仅此一点，我认为就能有效抵抗许多与年龄相关的身体活动或功能衰退。

So that alone, I would think, would fight off a lot of the age related decline in physical activity or physical function.

是的。

Yeah.

我觉得你刚才提到了几个要点。

I think there are you mentioned a couple things in there.

所以我认为掌握技能、策略和反应时间是不同层面的东西。

So I think it's a separate thing to have a skill and to have strategy and to have reaction time.

但我认为你确实应该全面覆盖这些方面。

But I but I think you definitely wanna be hitting all those bases.

因此制定一个关于应该锻炼哪些内容的总清单是好的，比如需要力量训练，并将其分解到不同运动平面。

So I think it's it's good to have a general checklist of what should you be exercising and see that it like takes strength and break it down into the different planes.

此外还要兼顾技巧、策略、反应速度、敏捷性、爆发力、平衡感和力量

And then also take skill, strategy, reaction time, agility, quickness, balance, power.

你必须找到方法——要知道同时训练所有内容很难，但你要设法在不同训练重点之间循环切换。比如上个季度我苦练跳绳不绊脚的技巧，现在该如何保持这个技能不退化？

And you have to find a way to you know, it's hard to work everything at once, but you gotta find a way to maybe maybe you cycle through switching your focus, but you find like what is if I if I worked on really being able to jump rope without tripping my feet up last quarter, how am I gonna take that skill and not lose it?

就拿我来说，当我意识到自己在拳击训练中被迫跳绳时表现有多糟糕后，我就特别专注于跳绳练习。

And so for for me, for example, like I really focused on jump roping when I realized how horrible I was at it when I was forced to do in boxing.

所以我非常集中精力地努力提升跳绳技巧。

And so I I very intensively tried to get good at jump roping.

现在我不想再练这个了，但我已经养成习惯，每天早上热身时都要连续跳50下跳绳。

And now I don't wanna work on it anymore, but I've just taken in like, okay, every morning I have to do 50 uninterrupted jump ropes just in the course of my warm warm up.

只是为了保持你已经掌握的

Just to kinda keep whatever skills that you've

那些技能。

developed.

只是为了确保我不会丧失那种协调性的基本能力。

Just to just to make sure that like I'm not losing the basic capacity to do that that coordination.

是的。

Yeah.

如果我开始退步，我就意识到需要在这方面多下功夫。

And if I start to, then I realize I have to work on it more.

是的。

Yeah.

我认为新事物可能比那些你非常熟悉且高效掌握的东西更能提升能力。

New things, I think, would enhance that even more maybe than things that you're very comfortable with and things you're very efficient at.

比如说，如果你是个运动员，无论从事什么运动，然后你说我要尝试柔术或武术。

Like, say, if you're an athlete in whatever sport and you say, you know, I'm going to try jujitsu or I'm gonna try martial arts.

就像这种完全陌生的新事物，你虽然在锻炼，但必须全神贯注地思考。

Like, something completely new like that where you're working out, but you're really thinking cause you've gotta, like, really concentrate.

侧踢并不是一种自然的动作。

It's not like a natural movement to throw a sidekick.

你必须非常专注于抬膝、扭转身体等一系列动作。

You have to really concentrate on picking your knee up, twisting your body, and all that jazz.

我觉得类似这样的活动能保持一切运转良好。

Like, I think stuff like that would, you know, just keep everything firing.

不是吗？

No?

我想你是对的。

I think you yeah.

我是说，我觉得应该两者兼顾。

I I mean, I think you should do a mix.

你总是想推动自己取得新成就，但同时也要合理安排，以免失去已经获得的成果。

Like, you always wanna be pushing yourself to a new to new achievements, but then you also I think you wanna structure things so that you don't lose the ones that you that you did.

没错。

Right.

我觉得我们很多人一生都在不断取得成就又失去它们，然后

Like, I I think a lot of us go through life just making achievement, losing it, and

我们就像，

we're, like,

原地踏步，修修改改，毫无进展。

treading, modding, going nowhere.

当我真正投入巴西柔术时，我很久都没再练踢拳了。

I when I really got into jiu jitsu, I stopped doing any kickboxing for a long time.

偶尔会去打打沙袋，就像在说，哦，我还能做到。

Every And now and then, would just hit the bag and just like, oh, I still can do it.

但当我重新开始训练泰拳时，恢复流畅状态所需的时间之长让我震惊。

But then I started training Muay Thai again, and it was kinda shocking how long it took me to get, like, the flow back.

就是那种真正行云流水的感觉。

To, like, where it really, like, comes off smooth.

所有动作都显得有点吃力，那种‘哦，我其实没掌握这些技能’的感觉很让人沮丧。

Everything seemed like a little labored, and it was just disheartening to, like, oh, I don't really have these skills.

就像我得重新掌握它们一样。

Like, I have to, like, reacquire them.

你知道，我明明知道该怎么做的。

You know, I know how to do it.

我确实做过，但现在一切都显得很勉强。

I've done it, but it's just, like, right now, everything's little.

神经通路像是被泥浆堵塞了。

The pathways are filled with mud.

你明白我的意思吗？

You know what I mean?

动作不够干净利落。

It's not clean.

不够漂亮犀利。

It's not nice and sharp.

所有动作都有些走样。

Everything is a little funky.

要知道，如果你想精进柔术，就不可能每天再花两小时练泰拳。

And, you know, but if you wanna get good at jujitsu, you don't have time for two hours of Muay Thai day.

根本不可能兼顾。

You just don't.

明白吗？

Know?

所以你必须做出取舍。

So it's like you gotta pick your poison.

你得选择你喜欢什么，不喜欢什么。

You gotta pick what you like, what you don't like.

是啊。

Yeah.

嗯，我认为你必须明确自己的目标和衡量标准。

Well, I I think you have to decide what your goal is and what your metric is.

要知道，没有人能同时在七项运动上都达到精英水平，或者在任意七件事上都非常出色。

Like, you there's no way that anyone is gonna be good at, like, seven you know, gonna be elite level at any two sports or, like, great at any seven.

对吧？

Right?

所以我觉得你得问问自己：我是否想在领带系法上做到非常出色？

So I think you have to say, like, okay, do I want to be really good at my tie?

而这一点，你并不需要通过那样做来实现健康老龄化。

And that and that's you you don't have to do that to have healthy aging.

对。

Right.

但在泰拳训练中，确实有些动作是你必须能够完成以保持健康老龄化的。

But there are things that you do at Muay Thai that you do have to be able to do to have healthy aging.

所以如果你只是从‘如何判断自己正在进行健康老龄化’的角度来思考的话，

So if you're just thinking about it from the perspective of how do I know that I'm engaging in healthy aging?

我认为你不该说‘哦，我必须恢复到打领带的最佳状态’。

I think you you don't you don't wanna say like, oh, I need to be I need to be as good as I ever was at my tie.

你只需要问问自己‘为什么我在某些方面表现不佳’？

You just have to say, okay, like, why am I bad at some of that?

以及‘这是我普遍需要的能力吗’？

And is that something that I need in general?

我认为通过这样的思考，你往往能意识到‘啊，我真正缺失的是身体不再灵活了’。

And I think oftentimes, by doing something like that, you can think about it and you can realize, oh, what I'm what I really can't do is I'm not agile anymore.

我真的无法再快速转移重心了。

I really can't, like, shift my weight quickly anymore.

或者说，我的反应速度真的变慢了。

Or I really can't like, my reaction time is slow.

比如，我老是头部被击中，因为我躲不开。

Like, I I just keep getting hit in the head because I don't move it.

你明白吗？

You know?

如果你意识到这些问题，我认为你必须找到方法训练这些能力，因为日常生活都需要它们。

If you're realizing those things, then I think you gotta you have to find some way to train those because you need those for everything.

生活中不挑战自己很容易，但这样你就意识不到自己正在失去什么。

And it's just it's easy to not challenge yourself in life and don't realize what you're losing.

所以你必须通过挑战自己做不到的事情，来发现自己的弱点。

So you do have to challenge yourself with something you're not able to do to figure out what you're weak in.

嗯。

Mhmm.

是的。

Yeah.

其中一个

One of the

我想提的是你之前提到的，你谈到武术家可能因为长期积累的伤病而丧失部分功能，比如你提到的手部受伤。

things I wanna bring up you brought up earlier, you were talking about martial artists and perhaps, like, injuries accumulating over time and you lose some of your function because of that, like you mentioned hands, hand injuries.

这是否是人们需要考虑的因素，可能他们没意识到，也许仅仅是身体损伤，比如被击打造成的伤害，或者过度训练导致的伤害，当然还有减重带来的身体损伤。

Is that something that people need to take in consideration that maybe they don't, that maybe just physical damage, like, terms of getting hit and physical damage perhaps from overtraining, physical damage certainly from cutting weight.

你知道，很多选手在赛前减重，比赛前24小时基本处于生死边缘，我觉得这完全疯了，是武术比赛中最可避免的伤害行为，然而却无处不在。

You know, a lot of these guys cut weight, they're basically on death's door twenty four hours before a fight, which is, I think, completely insane and the most avoidable damaging thing about martial arts competition, and yet it's ubiquitous.

几乎所有人都在这么做。

It's like almost everyone does it.

是啊。

Yeah.

我是说，我觉得这其中有一定的主观性。

I I mean, I think there is a degree of subjectivity to it.

如果你的，你知道，如果你对美好生活的定义是赢得一场可能让你在未来三年内丧命的比赛，那么，你又怎么能反驳别人所选择的这种价值观呢？

If your, you know, if your idea of what a life well lived is is to win an event that might have you die in the next three years, then, you know, how are you gonna argue with that that value that someone has adopted?

但如果你是从'如何保持健康长寿'的角度来思考这个问题，

But if if you are thinking about it from the perspective of how do I stay healthy through how do I live a long healthy life?

那么预防伤病就必须成为你的首要考虑，而非次要。

Then injury prevention has to be your number one consideration, not your number two.

我认为即便你只是想追求'怎样才能变得最强'，

I think even if you were just trying to see say like, how how can I be the strongest I could be?

你仍然需要把预防伤病放在第一位。

You would still need injury prevention to be number one.

因为，你知道有多少人因为受伤，不得不中断正在进行的训练三个月，结果重新开始时反而比受伤前倒退了六个月的水平。

Because, you know, how many people take three months off from a lift that they're working on and wind up six months behind where they had been when they start again as a result of that injury.

如果他们把这六个月用来持续变强，现在会达到什么境界？

And where would they have been if they spent that six months getting stronger?

而如果每两三年就要经历一次这样的中断，这对你能发展的技术水平和最大潜力都会造成巨大损耗。

And if you're gonna do that every two or three years, like, that's taking a lot like, a huge toll off even the skill that you could develop and and your maximal capacity at that.

但就像我一开始说的，我真的认为线粒体功能每年下降1%、到70岁时减半的最简单解释就是：当我受伤时，我的线粒体完全专注于伤口愈合，于是从用于修复基础机能的账户中支取了一部分资源。

But like I was saying at the beginning, I I do I really think that the simplest explanation for why mitochondrial function declines 1% per year and gets cut in half by age 70 is just this, like, when I was injured, my mitochondria were completely obsessed with healing from that injury, and a little bit came out of the account used to repair the home base.

这正是我想表达的意思。

That's what I was getting at.

是的。

Yeah.

没错。

Yeah.

所以对于那些受过很多伤的武术家来说——比如手骨骨折、肋骨断裂、膝盖手术、肩部手术——他们很多人都经历过这类伤病。

So for someone who's had, like, like, say, a martial artist who's had broken hands, broken ribs, knee surgery, shoulder surgery, a a lot of these guys have gone through a bunch of stuff like that.

每经历一次这样的伤病，都会造成一点损耗。

Like, so each one of those things is taking a small toll.

是啊。

Yeah.

确实。

Yeah.

是啊。

Yeah.

确实如此。

For sure.

这是人们没有考虑到的事情。

That's not something that people consider.

你可能会想，哦，你已经从那次伤病中恢复了。

You can you think, oh, you recovered from that injury.

现在你是100%恢复了。

Now you're a 100%.

但你还带着从伤病中恢复的代价。

But you're a 100% with the tax of having recovered from that injury.

是啊。

Yeah.

而且很多人甚至未必能从伤病中完全恢复。

And and a lot of people aren't necessarily fully recovered from the injury either.

哦，很多人其实都没有。

Oh, Many many aren't.

是啊。

Yeah.

很多人其实都没有。

Many many aren't.

你知道吗，我曾经跟一个在马拉松中受伤的人聊过，他以为自己已经康复了。

I've you know, I I talked to to to a guy once who was He got injured in marathon running, and he thought he was recovered.

但我认为他并没有完全康复。

I thought he wasn't recovered.

他还以为自己有什么代谢问题，因为他总是生病。

And he thought there was some kind of metabolic stuff wrong with him because he's getting sick all the time.

我就说，兄弟，你还没康复呢。

I'm like, bro, you didn't recover yet.

你怎么还出去跑那么多步？

Like, what are you doing going out and doing all that running?

是什么伤来着？

Like What was the injury?

我不记得具体是什么伤了，但属于跑步常见的伤病之一。

I don't remember the I forgot the specific injury, but one of one of the common running injuries.

是啊。

Yeah.

综合格斗中很常见的情况是有人被击倒后，因为过早复出再次被击倒。

One of the things that's really common in MMA is someone getting knocked out and then getting knocked out again because they come back too quickly.

最近一场大赛就发生了这种事，这些选手总想尽快重返赛场赢回胜利。

It happened recently in a big fight, and it's just there's there's a thing that happens with these guys where they just wanna get back in there and get a win.

很多时候他们都说：我准备好了，

And a lot of times, they're like, I'll be ready.

不会再被击中了，

I won't get hit again.

我知道之前哪里出错了。

I know what I did wrong.

我这次会表现得更好。

I'll I'll be better this time.

但他们现在更脆弱了。

But they're more vulnerable now.

比如，他们可能会被击倒。

Like, they can get knocked out.

这只是神经损伤吗？

Is this just neurological damage?

这只是脑震荡的影响，还是你认为这是脑震荡本身、恢复过程以及身体因需要从创伤中恢复而能力下降的综合作用？

Is this this just a function of the concussion, or do you think it's a function of the concussion, the recovery from it, and the diminishing capacity of the body because it had to recover from that traumatic injury?

我认为所有这些因素都有。

I think it's all of those.

但不仅如此。

It's the but that too.

对吧？

Right?

所以不只是你被击倒后大脑现在更脆弱这个事实。

So it's not just the fact that you got knocked out and your brain is more vulnerable now.

就像是，不。

It's like, no.

不。

No.

不。

No.

你的身体更脆弱了。

Your body's more vulnerable.

你可能没有以前那么强壮了。

You're probably not as strong as you were.

你的恢复速度可能也没以前快了。

You're probably not recovering as quickly.

是啊。

Yeah.

我是说，大脑虽然是身体的一小部分，但它在能量消耗方面却大得不成比例。

I mean, the the brain is it's a small part of the body, but it's massively outsized in terms of the energy that it consumes.

所以想想看，如果你实际上在修复大脑功能，而它却要从身体中汲取更多不成比例的能量，再想想身体其他部分要为支持大脑运转付出多少努力。

And so think about if think about if you're, you know, if you're actually healing the ability for it to like, if it's just sucking even more disproportionate energy from the body and just think about how much the rest of the body works to support the brain.

比如，肝脏整天都在工作以确保大脑获得足够的能量。

Like, the liver is working all day long to make the brain get enough energy.

所以，没错，脑损伤后的恢复过程不可能不对整个系统造成损耗。

So, yeah, there's there's no way that healing from a brain injury is not taking a toll systemically.

这是不可能的。

That's impossible.

但你认为加速或增强这种肌酸效果会是个很好的选择吗？

But to accelerate or enhance that creatine, you think, would be a very good option?

肌酸是已被证实具有这种功效的物质之一，相关研究中使用的是每天20克的剂量。

I mean, creatine is one of the ones that's been demonstrated to do that, and it and it's been studied twenty grams a day.

我不认为有人真正清楚，比如，你真的需要20克吗？

I don't think anyone really knows, like, do you need 20?

30克会更好吗？

Is 30 better?

5克能起到同样效果吗？

Could it have been done with five?

但大多数脑部研究采用的剂量都在20克左右。

But the most of the brain research is being done with doses around twenty grams.

有种观点认为肌肉会优先吸收，因此需要高剂量才能让大脑获取到。

And there's the thought is that the, you know, the muscles are gonna take first dibs and you need to have a high dose to get it to the brain.

这方面还有很多未知，但作为默认方案，如果我正在从脑外伤中恢复，会选择服用肌酸。

There's a lot we don't know about that, but as a default, if I was healing from a traumatic brain injury, would take the creatine.

我认为面对如此严重的情况时，确实需要了解自身的限制瓶颈在哪里。

And then I think if you have something that's this serious, you do want to know what your limiting bottlenecks are.

所以我觉得做线粒体检测就是其中一种应用场景——比如现在有个六个月的黄金恢复期，需要最大化所有可能性。

So I think actually doing mitochondrial testing is that's like one of the applications would be like, oh, now it's really important that I have a six month window where I need to maximize everything I can.

因此通过检测来了解个体特殊需求，我认为能在关键时刻大大加速康复进程。

And so, you know, testing to understand your unique needs, think, would be would be a way to supercharge that process when it's needed.

我认为，回到人们普遍能做什么这个问题上，你提到的亚甲蓝就是其中之一，我个人甚至不会在没有检测表明我需要它的情况下服用。

And I think that there are and, you know, to to take this back to to, like, what can people do in general, I think methylene blue you mentioned is is one of those ones where, like, I wouldn't even I personally wouldn't even take it without testing showing that I need it.

但辅酶Q10很有趣，因为它实际上是由人体自身合成的，同时也存在于食物中。

But CoQ10 is an interesting one because CoQ10 is actually made in the body, and it is found in food.

很多人强调亚甲蓝是第一种药物，它是医药史上的首创。

And so there you know, methylene blue was a lot of people emphasized that it was the first it was the first drug.

可以说它是医药领域的开山鼻祖。

So it's like the first, you know, of pharma, basically.

但在此之前，它实际上是被专利为一种能让衣物染蓝且洗涤不褪色的物质。

But before that, it was actually patented as something that would turn your clothes blue but wouldn't come out in the wash.

这就是亚甲蓝最初的专利用途。

That that was the patent on earthly blue.

而辅酶Q10，你通过食物摄入。

You know, whereas CoQ ten, you eat food.

它就存在于食物中。

It's there.

你的身体会自行合成它。

Your body makes it itself.

它存在于哪些食物中呢？

And What what kind of food is it in?

心脏部位含量最高。

Heart is the best.

正如我之前所说，你应该吃全动物部位。

Is the and so I was saying before, you should be eating nose to tail.

如果你要吃肉，就应该吃心脏。

Like, if you're gonna eat meat, you should be eating heart.

我个人吃的肉大部分是混合的——大约60%是绞碎的牛肉，其余是肝脏、心脏和肾脏的混合。

I I personally most of my meat is actually a blend of it's like 60% ground beef, and the rest of it is a blend of liver, heart, kidney.

我吃的就是肝脏、心脏和肾脏的混合。

And there are some other mine is just liver, heart, heart, kidney.

最近我看到有些公司推出了含有少量脾脏和肾上腺的产品。

There are some other companies that I've seen recently come out with ones that include spleen and adrenals in very small percentages.

但我坚信应该食物优先，药物最后。

But that's I I do strongly believe in a food first, pharma last approach.

这并不意味着我反对药物，而是说即使是补充剂，如果能通过食物满足需求，就应该优先选择食物。

And that doesn't mean like I'm against pharma, but it means that even with supplements, like if you can meet a need with food, you should meet the need with food.

你应该策略性地使用补充剂，而不是用它来替代不良饮食。

You should use supplements in a strategic sense, not as a replacement for a bad diet.

这些补充剂应该...接下来你会说，好吧，我确实很难获取足够的某种营养素。

And those supplements should, you know, what you would do next is say like, okay, I'm really having trouble getting enough whatever nutrient.

也许我会通过补充剂来弥补这一点。

Maybe I'll supplement it to compensate for that.

但我认为你应该继续探索那些天然存在于体内的物质作为补充剂，它们当然对身体是安全的，因为本来就存在。

But I think you should go on down the line with, you know, other things that are like supplements of things that occur naturally in your body that are of course safe to be in your body because they're always gonna be there.

或许你可以通过补充这些来打破衰老的恶性循环，或促进治愈的良性循环——当你已经通过食物获取了所有营养后，我认为可以开始尝试这类补充。

Maybe you can supplement with that to help break a vicious cycle of aging or to stimulate a virtuous cycle of healing that, you know, that I would once you're getting all your nutrients and you're trying to do that from food, I would I think that you could start playing around with that stuff.

但即便如此，辅酶Q10就是个很好的例子。

But even then, so CoQ10 is a great example.

比如，我会先尝试多吃些心脏部位的食物，而不是直接每天补充400毫克的辅酶Q10。

I would I would try eating more heart before I would try supplementing with four hundred milligrams a day of CoQ10, for example.

我能问你个问题吗？

Can I ask you this?

鸡心和牛心有区别吗？

Does it matter if it's chicken heart, beef heart?

有没有哪种更好？

Does is there a superior?

我认为我们目前没有足够的数据来证明这一点。

I don't think we have enough data to say that.

辅酶Q10属于那种营养数据库里都查不到的成分——USDA数据库里都没有，但学术文献里有记载。

So CoQ10 is one of those things where the nutritional databases are not that I mean, you're not even gonna find it in USDA database, but there's published literature.

不过我还没看到对不同动物心脏的对比研究。

But I have not seen all the different hearts compared.

那我们怎么知道心脏里含有辅酶Q10呢？

So how do we know that CoQ ten is in heart?

在心脏组织中，只要测量过的地方都能发现辅酶Q10的存在。

Well, wherever it's been measured in heart, it's there.

因此，作为代表性样本的心脏组织，其辅酶Q10含量比其他器官高出一个数量级。

So, like, the representative examples of heart that were used were, like, an order of magnitude higher in CoQ 10 than anything else.

不过...但当我们...是的...

And is But I but there when we have Yeah.

抱歉打断一下。

I'm sorry.

我的意思是，我们尚未对不同种类的心脏进行系统性的对比研究。

Oh, I mean, we just haven't seen all of the different hearts compared to each other.

烹饪方式会影响其含量吗？

Is it dependent upon how it's cooked?

比如三分熟还是全熟？

Like, whether it's rare, well done?

我认为烹饪过程中确实会流失部分，但具体流失量我记不清了，应该不会全部流失。

I Is that I think you lose some during cooking, but you're but it's I forget how much, and I don't think it's all of it.

所以我认为，在所有情况下，烹饪食物时越温和，效果越好。

So it's I think it's you're all I mean, you're always the more gently you cook your food, the better off you are in every conceivable case.

虽然可能不是每次都最美味。

It might not always taste the best.

当然，寄生虫除外。

Except for parasites, of course.

我是说，你不需要把牛排煮全熟来避免这个问题。

I mean, you don't need to make a steak well done to avoid that.

不是牛排，是猪肉。

Not not steak, but pork.

对。

Right.

对。

Right.

是的。

Yeah.

我

I

我是说其他东西，尤其是一些野味。

mean, other things, especially some wild game.

对。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

我说得没错。

I'm right.

所以考虑到这一点，食物的营养价值在相对温和烹饪时总是最高的。

So taking that taking that into account, the nutrient value of the food is always gonna be highest when the when the food has been cooked relatively gently.

不过话说回来，辅酶Q10很有意思，因为从文献来看很难反对服用它，毕竟有数十项临床试验。

But but anyway, so so CoQ ten is is interesting because it it's hard to argue against taking it from the literature because there's dozens of clinical trials.

其中不少是关于心脏病的。

Quite a bit of it is in heart disease.

它在多种心脏病形式中看起来相当有前景。

It looks pretty promising in various forms of heart disease.

但如果你查阅那些文献，会发现一个剂量反应关系：每天服用100到200毫克辅酶Q10的人，其血糖、胰岛素和血压平均水平比不服用的人要好。

But if you look at that literature, what you see is a dose response where at one to two hundred milligrams per day of CoQ ten, the average person's glucose, insulin, and blood pressure looks better than not taking it.

然而每天服用400毫克辅酶Q10的普通人，其血压、血糖和胰岛素水平实际上比不服用时更差。

But the average person at four hundred milligrams of CoQ ten is actually having worse blood pressure, glucose, and insulin than they were without taking it.

而且个体差异非常大。

And the variability around that is huge.

所以可能有人服用100毫克效果反而更差，而另一个人可能在400毫克时达到最佳效果。

So one person is probably gonna be worse at a hundred milligrams, whereas another person might get their best at four hundred milligrams.

这就好比，如果你查阅文献后要问：普通人在哪个剂量区间能达到最佳效果？

But it's like, if you looked at the literature and you you would say, where is the sweet spot where the average person is gonna be doing really good?

答案应该是每天100到200毫克。

It would be a hundred to two hundred milligrams a day.

但我认为存在很多极端案例——有些人获得奇迹般的效果，而有些人虽然谈不上灾难性后果，但确实情况变得更糟。

But I think there are, I've seen a lot of edge cases on either side where some people get miracles and some people get, I wouldn't say catastrophe, but just, they just get worse off.

所以，很多人抱怨失眠问题。

So, a lot of people complain about insomnia.

他们抱怨心跳加速或心悸。

They complain about their heart racing or heart palpitations.

诸如此类的各种情况，比如过度刺激，感觉灯光太亮或声音太强等等，就是感官过度敏感。

Various things like that, overstimulation, feeling like the lights are too bright or the sounds are too strong or whatever, just hyper sensory awareness.

这种情况并不常见，但那些遇到罕见反应的人总会来问我。

It's not common, but it's but it's And and all the people with the uncommon stuff always ask me about it.

对。

Right.

在更高剂量时？

At higher levels?

还是不？

Or No.

不。

At no.

仅仅一百毫克左右。

At just, like, a hundred milligrams.

就像，他们就是那些高度敏感的人。

Like, they're they're just hypersensitive people out there.

好的。

Okay.

然后

And then

这种情况罕见吗？

And is this rare?

这是不是像

Is this like

我不知道它有多普遍。

I don't know how common it is.

我的意思是，我能告诉你的是，在试验过程中，你会看到一些人报告胃肠道副作用，这非常常见。

So what I mean, what I can tell you is that across the trials, you see some people reporting GI side effects, which is super common.

这类情况很少被提及，但你永远不知道他们是否专门调查过这个。

You don't see a lot of this mentioned, but you never know if they were looking for it.

很多时候，副作用清单取决于他们询问了哪些副作用。

Like, a lot of times, the side effect list is dependent on what side effects they asked about.

那这个药是需要随餐服用还是空腹服用？

And Is this something you take with food or without food?

最好是

It would be better to take

随餐服用。

it with food.

副作用是否与服药时间有关？

And is the side effects is it dependent upon when they take it?

比如早上还是晚上服用？

Like, whether it's morning or evening?

我认为对一些抱怨失眠的患者来说，他们觉得晚上服药时症状会更严重。

I think for some people that have complained about insomnia, they have thought that it was worse when they took it in the evening.

有道理。

Makes sense.

对吧？

Right?

是的。

Yeah.

所以如果早点服用，也许能提升功能或增加能量水平？

So maybe increase function if you took it early or maybe increase energy levels?

嗯，你知道的。

Well, you know okay.

我想先铺垫一下，这确实有助于解释：要判断自己是否健康，实际应该考虑哪些方面？

So I think let me set the stage for this with just kind of like I think this really helps explain, like, what should you be actually be thinking about to know that you're healthy?

我认为我们经常陷入困境，就像医学界认为健康仅仅意味着没有疾病。

And I think we struggle a lot with, like, think the medicine just thinks that being healthy is just not having any disease.

我觉得我们作为健康社区，很难给健康下一个准确的定义。

And I think we, as just kind of the, you know, wellness community or whatever, struggle to come up with a good definition for health.