纽约枪击案目标人物是谁，以及关于俄罗斯门骗局勾结的新报道，与巴克·塞克斯顿和亚伦·马特共同探讨

欢迎收听梅根·凯利秀，工作日中午东部时间在SiriusXM第111频道直播。我是梅根·凯利。欢迎来到今天的特别节目，精选本周MK媒体播客网络节目中明星们的精彩片段。以防你错过他们的亮点，我为你整理好了。艾米莉·贾辛斯基本周在《Afterparty》节目中邀请了亚当·卡罗拉现场访谈，他们深入探讨了斯蒂芬·科尔伯特以及关于艾伦的真相。

Welcome to the Megan Kelly show live on SiriusXM channel one eleven every weekday at noon East. I'm Megan Kelly. Welcome to this special episode today featuring some highlights from our MK Media stars on our MK Media Podcast Network shows this week. Just in case you missed their highlights, I got them for you. Emily Jasinski had Adam Carolla live on Afterparty this week where they dug into Stephen Colbert and the truth about Ellen.

林克·劳伦在他的节目《Spot On》中审视了像耐克这样的品牌——没错还有美国鹰——如何从2020年那些‘觉醒时刻’中回调。谢天谢地。马克·霍尔珀林在《NextUp》节目中剖析了民主党的现状及其领导人为何至今仍执迷不悟。而莫琳·卡拉汉则在她的节目《The Nerve》里犀利点评了格温妮丝·帕特洛那本寡淡无味的新传记。

Link Lauren, he took a look at the way brands like Nike and, yes, American Eagle have swung back from their woke moments back in 2020. Thank god. He did that on his show Spot On. Mark Halperin got into the state of the Democratic Party on NextUp and why their leaders are in denial right now. And Maureen Callahan took on Gwyneth Paltrow's bland new biography on her show, The Nerve.

祝您收听愉快，我们下周一见。大峡谷大学——一所位于亚利桑那州美丽凤凰城的私立基督教大学——坚信造物主赋予我们不可剥夺的生命权、自由权和追求幸福的权利。GCU信奉机会均等，认为美国梦始于人生目标。通过践行职业召唤，你可以影响家人、朋友和社区。以他人为先，让世界变得更美好。

Enjoy, and we'll see you Monday. Grand Canyon University, a private Christian university in beautiful Phoenix, Arizona, believes we are endowed by our creator with certain unalienable rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. GCU believes in equal opportunity and that the American dream starts with purpose. By honoring your career calling, you can impact your family, friends, and community. Change the world for good by putting others before yourself.

无论您追求学士、硕士还是博士学位，GCU的在线、校园和混合式学习环境都旨在帮助您实现独特的学术、个人和职业目标。截至2024年9月，GCU提供340多个学术项目，从您当下所在之处出发，为您铺就圆梦之路。服务他人之志在您手中，让其茁壮成长。在大峡谷大学找到您的人生使命。

Whether your pursuit involves a bachelor's, master's, or doctoral degree, GCU's online on campus and hybrid learning environments are designed to help you achieve your unique academic, personal, and professional goals. With over 340 academic programs as of September 2024, GCU meets you where you are and provides a path to help you fulfill your dreams. The pursuit to serve others is yours. Let it flourish. Find your purpose at Grand Canyon University.

私立、基督教、学费可承担。访问gcu.edu。

Private, Christian, affordable. Visit gcu.edu.

事实上，人们疏远半数观众的一个原因是，现在总体收视人数大幅减少，向忠实群体销售广告比试图分得大块市场蛋糕更容易，毕竟大家有太多选择了。你认为这就是现状，还是另有隐情？

One reason, actually, people alienate half of their audience is because so many fewer people are watching in general that it's it's easier to sell ads to a a loyal group of people rather than trying to bring in a giant piece of the pie because everyone has so many different choices. Do you think that's what's going on here, or is there something else happening?

我...说实话我不清楚很多现象背后的动因。分不清这是个人偏好还是赤裸裸的牟利企图。我个人向来是想说什么就说什么，从不在意谁会生气或谁在听。每个喜剧演员都这么说，但有些人恐怕口是心非。科尔伯特等深夜秀主持人...其实新闻主播、周日节目主持人和记者们过去也都是这样。

I, you know, I don't know what the dynamic is behind a lot of stuff. Like, I can't tell if it's just a personal preference thing or it's a overt attempt to make money. I personally have just always sort of said what I wanted to say and I never really thought much about who was angry or who was listening or anything. I mean, every comedian says that but I think some probably don't. I think Colbert any late night comedian And by the way, news anchors used to be this way and Sunday show anchors used to be this way and reporters used to be this way.

我们社会曾普遍存在一种斯多葛式的处世态度——没人会像佩德罗·帕斯卡那样滔滔不绝地讲述自己的情感困境...

They felt there was a kind of a thing in our society in general where you're a little bit stoic about things. There's no Pedro Pascal talking about all his emotional difficulties he's having because

他难道不够坚忍吗？

And was he not stoic?

是啊，你想骂人娘炮就直接扔下船是吧？我是说...这其实不只是深夜秀或政治圈的问题，而是整个社会的普遍现象——我正在实时思考这个问题。

Yeah. You wanna call a guy pussy, right? And thrown him off the ship. Like, well, what I'm saying is is there isn't I mean, I'm just sort of thinking this out in real time, but it wasn't about late night and it wasn't about politics. It was in general.

如果我在家里遇到问题，或是与子女有矛盾之类的，那是我们自家的事。就像家族私事一样，我不会像现在这样发推特——当年根本没有推特——或写专栏文章公开抱怨我多讨厌女儿，或是儿子正在变性之类的事。以前人们讲究体面，就像乘飞机时还会盛装打扮一样。

If I'm having issues at home or I'm issue with my children or whatever, that's our business. That's like our family business. I'm not gonna take to some Twitter that didn't exist back then but write op ed pieces and stuff talking about how much I hate my daughter or something or my son's transitioning or something. It was like there was a decorum. It's like people used to dress to go on an airplane.

要知道，过去的深夜秀主持人、新闻主播、记者、医生和律师不会被迫随时向公众表露对所有人的看法。比如六十年代如果出现特朗普式人物，杰克·帕尔顶多会说'这人不太对我胃口，但或许有人觉得他有趣'，或略带刻薄地暗讽几句，但绝不会对着镜头反复大骂'去他娘的特朗普'。那时人们恪守礼仪，我们无从知晓约翰尼·卡森的政治立场——正如他不想让我们知道他婚姻状况或家庭矛盾一样，他认为这些与观众无关。

You know. And so late night show hosts, news anchors, news reporters, doctors and lawyers weren't going to oblige and give you let you know how they felt about everyone all the time. You know, they you know, if you if you brought up a Trump like character, you know, in the sixties, then Jack Parr would have said, well, not exactly my cup of tea, but I'm sure some people find him amusing or some some some snarky and a little underhanded, but they wouldn't go fuck Trump and start screaming it over and over again into a camera lens. So it was like there was a decorum and we didn't know what Johnny Carson thought politically because he didn't want us to because he didn't believe just like whatever marital issues he was having or or situations at home. That wasn't our business.

他的职责是娱乐大众，而非让大众窥探他的全部隐私。而如今我们陷入某种怪圈，这些公众人物不再只是取悦观众的播报员，他们必须成为我们的朋友甚至精神伙伴，于是开始谈论本应私密的话题。比如大卫·莱特曼曾公开谈及心脏手术的生死时刻，含泪感谢救他的外科医生，场面确实感人——但约翰尼·卡森绝不会这么做，因为这既非观众应知之事，也违背喜剧本质。

He was there to entertain us and we weren't there to know everything about him. And now we've gone into some realm where these people have to be more than talking heads who entertain us. They have to be our friends and our, you know, co sponsors. And so they're gonna start talking about things that they never would have talked about that were personal. You know, Jay, I should say David Letterman famously had his whole heart situation and a medical scare and he got out there and you know came to tears and was talking about the surgeons that saved him and stuff and it was a moving moment but Johnny Carson wouldn't have done that because that wasn't for us, you know, and and it wasn't comedy.

喜剧表演才是他的本分，医疗隐私属于他的医生。总体而言，现在人们过度分享已成常态。无论是《观点》节目的女主持们还是深夜秀明星，如今我们必然清楚他们对政治的所有立场。

It was he was doing the comedy. That was him. That was his doctor. So I think in general, it's just a lot more sharing going on. And I think if it's, you know, the ladies from The View or a late night show, I think we're gonna know how they feel about politics nowadays.

那种保持距离的时代已经终结。但我怀疑现代人是否真愿意回到那个充满谜团的年代——想想看，一个人可以连续五十年每天上电视却无人知晓他是同性恋，大家只会说'那个74岁的老单身汉'。

There's no more of that. And I don't I don't know that people want to go back to those days where we had no idea. You know, I mean, hell, a guy could be gay for fifty years and be on TV every day. No one knew it. You know, that guy's a bachelor, and he's 74 years old.

至少我们确定大卫·莱特曼不是同性恋。现在播放约翰尼·卡森的这段录像。

Well, we knew David Letterman wasn't gay. Let's roll this clip of Johnny Carson.

他有个专属房间。

He had a room.

没错。这是FS5频道播出的片段，迈克·华莱士的采访，完美诠释了驱动整个深夜秀生态系统的传统理念。

Yeah. Let's roll Johnny Carson. This is f s five. He was being interviewed actually by Mike Wallace, and this sort of gets to, I think, the the sentiment that used to drive the entire, like, late night ecosystem. So this is s five.

有人说你从不触碰严肃争议，这会让你介意吗？我有标准答案：请问杰克·本尼、雷德·斯克尔顿这些喜剧大师何时用节目讨论严肃议题？那不是我的职责，人们难道不明白吗？

Do you get sensitive about the fact that people say he'll never take a serious controversy? Well, I have an answer to that. I said, now tell me the last time that Jack Benny, Red Skelton, Benny comedian, used his show to do serious issues. That's not what I'm there for. Can't they see that?

但观众认为拥有今夜秀就必须涉及严肃议题，这很危险。一旦开始这么做，就会滋生妄自尊大的错觉，仿佛你的话举足轻重。讽刺的是，这档节目本可以成为......

But you're neither they think that just because you have a tonight show that you must deal in serious issues. That's a danger. It's a real danger. Once you start that, you start to get that self important feeling that what you say has great import. And, you know, strangely enough, you could use that show as a form.

你能够左右人们的想法，但我认为作为一位艺人，你不应该这样做。

You could sway people, and I don't think you should as an entertainer.

亚当，他描述斯蒂芬·科尔特现状的准确程度几乎令人毛骨悚然，至少在我看来是这样。

Adam, there it's almost eerie how accurately he describes what Stephen Colbert has become, at least from my perspective.

是啊，我同意。而且你知道，可悲的是有很多...听着，十五年前我写过一本叫《五十年袋鼠幼崽》的书，结果十二年内预言就应验了。我是说现在有大量录像带、书籍、还有80年代的克格勃特工解释他们要如何操控美国人的思想——结果你会发现'这不就是我们刚刚经历的吗，那就是新冠疫情'。

Yeah. I I agree. And, you know, I mean, sadly, there's a lot of. Look I wrote a book fifteen years ago called fifty years wallaby chicks and basically happened in twelve years. So I mean there's lots of tape, lots of books, lots of KGB agents from the 80s explaining what they're going to do to the American mind and you go but that's what we just did, that was COVID.

世上有很多具有先见之明的东西。我认同这一点。但另一方面，这是你的节目，挂着你的名字，你应该有权表达所想。而一旦你说了想说的，就要准备好可能引发的任何后果。我觉得这就是我们现在的阶段。我不觉得科尔特是受害者，也不认为这超出了'随心所欲后必然承受的结果'的范畴。

There's a lot of prescient stuff out there. I agree on the other hand, it's your show and it's got your name on it and you should be able to say what you want. And then once you say what you want, you should be prepared for any consequences that may arise from saying whatever you want. So I think that's the stage we're at. I don't I don't find it I don't feel like Colbert's been victimized, and and I don't feel like this is anything other than what shall be when you just do what you wanna do.

就我个人而言，只要内容足够有趣，那就是我评判的标准。但有时候节目会变成激进主义之类的其他东西。

I mean, personally, I, you know, as long as stuff is funny, that's kinda that's the bar that it needs to clear for me. Sometimes stuff just turns into something else like activism or something.

嗯。好，我们把特朗普这篇帖子放出来。这是第一份材料，是他上周二在真相社交平台发的。

Mhmm. Yeah. Let's let's let's put this Trump post up. This is f one. This was a truth social from last Tuesday.

他说'有消息称——而且是个确切消息——吉米·坎贝尔将是下一个在平庸的深夜节目竞赛中出局的，紧接着法伦也会滚蛋。这些毫无才华的家伙拿着数百万薪水，却把所有曾经的优秀电视节目都毁了。看到他们完蛋真是大快人心，希望我也出了份力。'现在我们再看坎贝尔的回应，这是第二份材料。

He said the word is, and it's a strong word at that, Jimmy Kimmel is next to go in the untalented late night sweepstakes, and shortly thereafter, Fallon will be gone. These are people with absolutely no talent who were paid millions of dollars for, in all cases, destroying what used to be great television. It's really good to see them go, and I hope I played a major part in it. Let's also then put up Kimmel's response. This is f two.

他回复特朗普说'听说下一个是你'，可能又是在暗指《华尔街日报》那个关于特朗普在爱泼斯坦生日册里写过'美妙秘密'的报道——听起来简直像填词游戏。但亚当，你预见到坎贝尔会这么快就认怂吗？

He said, I'm hearing you're next, responding to Trump, or maybe it's just another wonderful secret alluding, of course, to that Wall Street Journal report that Donald Trump, said something about a wonderful secret in, Jeffrey Epstein birthday book, which is something that sounds like a mad lib. But, Adam, did you predict that Kimmel would become a chick this quickly?

首先，我们能放过可怜的吉米·法伦吗？那哥们就会模仿别人，弹个布鲁斯·斯普林斯汀的吉他啥的。

Well, first off, can we leave poor Jimmy Fallon out of this? That guy just does impersonations, does a great Bruce Springsteen plays acoustic guitar.

这倒是实话。

That's true.

我是说，我搞不懂他怎么会被卷进这堆烂摊子里。我不记得法伦做过任何涉及政治的事。而吉米向来脾气火爆，我记得有次录《男人秀》时，他差点直接揍了前排一个一直叫他闭嘴的家伙。具体我也不清楚。

I mean, I don't know how he got balled up in this whole mess. I don't know that Fallon's ever done anything political. Jimmy is always been feisty, I guess would be the when we were taping the man show once, he literally almost punched. I he almost punched a guy in, like, the front row, kept telling him to shut up or something. The guy, like I don't know.

那人大概是喝醉了什么的。我当时心想：这下要惹上官司了。我...

The guy was probably drunk or something. And he I I I was like I was like, you're gonna have a it's gonna be a lawsuit. I don't

明白。所以当时你是现场唯一的女性。

know. So you were the chick in that situation.

没错，当时就我一个女的在场。吉米讨厌特朗普，特朗普也讨厌吉米。吉米很有阿尔法气质，特朗普也是。

I was the chick in that I was the chick in that that situation. Jimmy hates Trump. Trump hates Jimmy. Jimmy's pretty alpha y. Trump's pretty alpha y.

我意识到现在有很多阿尔法男性之间的较量，像我们这些贝塔性格的人就只管捧着爆米花看戏。我个人其实挺喜欢特朗普和吉米，都接触过——当然和吉米更熟。他们截然不同，但骨子里或许都有某种相似的阿尔法特质在较劲。

I I realized there's a lot of alpha on alpha battles going on, you know, us betas are just popping the popcorn and sitting back and and watching. Letting the alphas I go like I like Trump and I like Jimmy. Like, I've I've known both. Obviously, I know Jimmy a lot a lot better. They're both exquisitely different, but, you know, there may be some of the same kind of alpha componentry somewhere lurking in both of them.

要知道，现在我女儿就在吉米手下工作——不是在节目组，是在他的沙龙。不对，其实就是在节目组。他这些年来待我和我的家人，尤其是我孩子，就像对待珍宝一样。对我向来慷慨大方。

And you know, the thing about Jimmy is my daughter's working for him right now. I mean, not not at the show. She's on it doing his salon. But no, she's at the show, and he he's he's treated me and my family and my kids especially like like, you know, precious gems his whole life. He's always been generous with me.

他对我一直很好。所以我没法说吉米·坎摩尔半句坏话。虽然不认同他说的每句话——当年共事时也是如此——但我始终敬爱他，觉得欠他份人情。我对特朗普也有好感。或许在某个平行宇宙里，这两个人能坐下来喝杯啤酒说笑，但绝不是现在。

He's always been good with me. So I cannot summon any negative words about Jimmy Kimmel. I don't agree with everything that comes out of his mouth, but I didn't agree with everything that came out of his mouth when we shared an office together for all those years. But I've always loved Jimmy and I've always felt indebted to Jimmy. And I like Trump as well and there is probably some universe somewhere where those two avatars could have a beer and have a have a laugh, but not today.

多么美好的画面啊。不过现在特朗普的论点连他的反对者和支持者都不认同——大家都在说这事其实和特朗普无关。

What a beautiful moment that one. I know. But is so okay. Trump is actually arguing something that a lot of his detractors or or a lot of his supporters are not. They're saying this had nothing to really do with Donald Trump.

人们只是觉得科尔伯特不好笑。结果特朗普偏要说'希望科尔伯特收视下滑是因为我'。这...

It was just that Colbert wasn't very funny. And here you have Trump saying, I hope I was the reason that Colbert started to fail. Is I there

我最反感有人给观点不合的喜剧演员扣'不好笑'的帽子。很多喜剧人我虽然不认同，但不会否认他们的才华。说吉米不好笑？那太离谱了。这种攻击反而显得你理亏——我自己就常被骂'既讨厌又无聊'，深有体会。

don't like I don't like when people hang the, like, not funny on people they disagree with. You know what I mean? Like, I disagree with a lot of comedians and there are some who aren't funny, but like you can't go about Jimmy, you can't go not funny, you know what I mean? And in a weird way, think you hurt your case when you just start people, I've had it obviously done to me. People do that thing where they go, this guy's an asshole and he's not funny.

就像，吉米做了三十五年喜剧表演，靠这个吃饭三十五年。他很有趣，懂得如何逗乐。你可能不赞同他某些笑话，但我不喜欢人们一概而论地说吉米·法伦没才华。其实他是个很有天赋的人。

It's like, well, Jimmy's been doing comedy for thirty he has been getting paid to do comedy for thirty five years. He is funny. He knows how to be funny. You may not agree with the some of his jokes, but I I don't like when people get, you know, wholesaling, you know, the untalented Jimmy Fallon. Like, Jimmy Fallon's a very talented guy.

我理解特朗普的策略，他必须笼统地抹黑。但奇怪的是，我觉得这反而有点伤到自己。这么说吧，就像AOC骂埃隆·马斯克是个白痴。

And I get what Trump's doing. You know, he's gotta paint with a broad a broad brush. But I I in a weird way, think you kinda hurt. You know, it's I'll put it to you this way. It's like when the AOC goes, Elon Musk, that guy's an idiot, man.

说他什么都不懂。好吧，那你现在看着才真叫蠢，因为他显然是有真才实学的。公平地说，他绝非蠢人。

He don't know anything, man. It's like, okay, bitch. You seem stupid. You seem really stupid now because, yes, he knows things. I'd say it's fair to say he's not an idiot.

顺便说，如果埃隆·马斯克算白痴，那AOC简直就是智障——按这逻辑她差不多该是植物人状态了，对吧？

And by the way, if he's idiot if if if if Elon Musk is an idiot, that makes AOC fully retarded. Like, if there is Right? I mean, she's gotta be almost vegetable.

医学意义上。

Medically.

她就像特里·夏沃那种状态。想想看，如果连马斯克都是低能儿，那我们也好不到哪儿去，懂我意思吗？

She's like Terry Schiavo. I mean, right? I mean, if you're just doing well, we're not in good shape either if Elon Musk is an imbecile. You know what I'm saying? Yeah.

总而言之，我讨厌那种全盘否定的论调。明明可以说'这人很聪明，做过不少好事，只是我反对他最近某件事'，对喜剧演员也是——我最烦有人说'噢我可幽默了'。

On the grand scheme of things, but so I don't like when people do that. Just say, you know, the guy's smart, he's done some good things, I disagree with this latest thing he did or whatever that thing, whatever your bitch is currently, you know. But I feel that way with comedians. I hate when people go, oh, I'm funny, you know.

标准是一样的。就像'反抗军'葡萄酒妈妈们被科尔伯特逗笑，MAGA选民被右翼倾向的喜剧演员逗笑——只要有人笑就算幽默，门槛低得很。

Well, it's the same standards. It's like if if the resistance wine moms are laughing at something that Colbert said and the, like, MAGA voters are laughing at something that a kind of right wing coded comedian said. It's funny because people are laughing. It's it's sort of the same it meets the same very low bar.

是啊。不过我认为特朗普确实要为很多人的...怎么说呢，堕落负责。不是说金梅尔，但总体而言他总能刺激到别人，让人对他产生执念，就像篮球电影里让菜鸟去骚扰对方明星中锋。

Yeah. Well, I don't you know, I do think I do think Trump is responsible for a lot of people's, I don't know, demise. I'm not talking about Kimmel, but I'm just saying, in general, he gets under their skin and then they get a sort of obsession with him and then they become preoccupied. And it's it's like in a movie it's like in a basketball movie where you say to your little player, you know, go bug their star center. Just keep bugging.

直到那人失控挥拳被罚下场。特朗普就有这种特质——当对方流着鼻血躺在地上，却冲教练咧嘴笑，因为对手正走向更衣室。特朗普身上就有这种特质。

And eventually, the guy snaps and punches him and gets thrown out of the game. Like, there's an element of that with Trump. And the guy's laying on the ground. He's got a bloody nose, and he looks at his coach and he smiles, you know, because that guy's going to the locker room. There's an element of that with Trump.

好的，那么这就完美过渡到独一无二的艾伦·德杰尼勒斯了。亚当，我想问你，如果你能稍等片刻别走开，我们马上要聊艾伦移居英国的事。不过首先，这些年我一直明确表态——我不仅支持生育。

Well, okay. So that's a great that's a great transition into the one and only Ellen DeGeneres. And I wanna ask you, Adam, if you stick around to this very quick break, all about Ellen's move over to The United Kingdom. First, though, over the years, I have, of course, been clear about this. I'm not just pro birth.

我是支持生命的，而支持生命意味着与母亲们站在一起，不仅在宝宝出生前，更在出生后长期陪伴。这正是我与Preborn合作的原因。Preborn太棒了，他们不止拯救婴儿，更让母职成为可能。他们提供免费超声波检查，向困境中的女性传播福音真理，并持续提供包括最长两年的经济援助在内的实际帮助。

I'm pro life, and being pro life means standing with mothers not only before their baby is born, but long after, and that is exactly why I partner with Preborn. Preborn is fantastic. They do not just save babies. They make motherhood abundantly possible. They provide free ultrasound sounds and share the truth of the gospel with women in crisis, and then they stay with real practical help, including financial support for up to two years after the baby is born.

这才真正体现了以基督为中心的慈悲——不仅为了婴儿，也为了母亲。现在就是您伸出援手的时候：仅需28美元就能提供一次救命超声波检查，让母亲有机会看见腹中宝宝。当她们亲眼看到时，选择留下孩子的概率会翻倍。整整翻倍。

And that is what true Christ centered compassion looks like, not just for the baby, but for the mother too. And here's where you can make a difference. Just $28 provides a free life saving ultrasound, one chance for a mother to see her baby. And when she does, she's twice as likely to choose life. Twice as likely to choose life.

Preborn今年计划拯救七万名婴儿。所以不要只说您支持生命，请付诸行动。今天就帮助婴儿、支持母亲吧！请访问preborn.com/emily或致电(855)601-2229。

Preborn is trying to save seventy thousand babies this year. So don't just say you're pro life. Live it. Help babies and support mothers today. Go to preborn.com/emily or call (855) 601-2229.

网址是preborn.com/emily。说到婴儿，让我们请回亚当·卡罗拉来聊聊艾伦·德杰尼勒斯——她现在不知为何在英国。接下来请看上周艾伦在节目中的片段，她谈及自己眼中美国正在发生的严重不公。

That's preborn.com/emily. Speaking of babies, let's bring Adam Carolla back in to weigh in on Ellen DeGeneres, who is now in The United Kingdom for some reason. So, let's go ahead and roll this clip of Ellen DeGeneres from last week s seven talking about what she perceives as a grave injustice occurring under our noses here in The United States.

美国所有人以及那些想剥夺同性婚姻权利的共和党人。我是说，这个话题又重新成为争议焦点了。

All people in America and Republicans who are would quite like to undo the right for gay people to get married. I mean, that's back on the table as a debate, I think.

完全正确。美国的浸信会正在试图推翻同性婚姻，至少想阻止未来的同性婚姻，甚至可能追溯废除。波西亚和我已经在关注此事，如果他们真这么做，我们就来英国结婚。

Absolutely. The the Baptist Church in in America is trying to reverse gay marriage. They're trying to, at at the very least, stop it from happening in the future and possibly reverse it. And Portia and I are already looking into it. And if if they do that, we're gonna get married here.

老实说，我

Honest to god, I

没意识到停顿台词。观众爱死这个了。

didn't realize pause lines. They love it.

怎么回事？我以为她们早就结婚了。她还声称——现在是F3信号——她是因为特朗普才移居英国。亚当，这让我想起你刚才说的：特朗普这个人似乎总能引爆某些天才的崩溃。你觉得艾伦也属于这种情况吗？

How is I thought they were married years ago. She says she's also this is f three. She says she moved to The UK because of Trump, which reminds me of exactly what you were just saying, Adam, that something about Trump himself seems to have triggered the unraveling of very talented people. Do you consider Ellen to be one such case?

嗯，艾伦一直是个刻薄的人。

Well, Ellen has always been a mean person.

然后

And

这不是，你知道，她三年前就和媒体有过冲突，这些故事大概两三年前就有了。但我上过她的节目，我是说，听着，我实话告诉你做每个节目时的情况。每个节目都有自己的个性，节目本身。不是播出的节目，而是幕后的。它们都多少带点主持人的个性。

it's not, you know, she had her dust up with the press and these stories probably three years, two or three years ago. But I did her show and I mean, look, I'll tell you truthfully sort of how it works when you do every show. Every show has its own kind of personality, the show itself. Not the on air show, but the behind the scenes. They all take on sort of the personality of their leader.

这就像是当你走进一家公司，人们总是很友好，或者走进另一家公司，每个人都挺讨厌的，你会想，这是怎么回事？为什么这家公司的人都这么刻薄糟糕？因为老板就是那样。所以当你去做莱特曼的节目时，我从这里开始说。当你做雷诺的节目时，雷诺的节目轻松愉快，人也很好，他们很放松，完全不会背后盯着你。

And it's sort of like when you go into a business and people are always all friendly or they go into business and everyone's sort of douchey, and you're going like, what's going on? Why is everyone so mean and crappy in this business? It's the owners that way. And so when you would go do Letterman, I'll start here. When you do Leno, Leno was fun and breezy and easy and people were nice and they were kinda laid back and they weren't looking over their shoulder at all.

氛围非常放松，吉米秀也很轻松友好，人们都很友善。而莱特曼秀的工作人员都很害怕，至少我去的那两次是这样。他们害怕是因为戴夫会吓唬他们。艾伦秀的工作人员也很害怕，非常害怕。

And it was very kinda laid back and Kimmel show is laid back and nice and people are nice. And Letterman show people are scared or they were scared when I did. Two times I did. They're scared because Dave would scare them. And Ellen show people were scared, real scared.

我知道他们害怕，因为我就坐在化妆间里，然后节目制作人进来，他说，好吧，我们讨论了要聊的圣诞假期之类的话题。我说，嗯，嗯。他说，你不会谈论肉或牛肉之类的东西吧？我说，不，我不会。我只会聊我们之前说过的圣诞假期、孩子或者他们的趣事。

And I knew they were scared because it's like I was just sitting in my dressing room and they're like segment producer came in and he went, all right, so we went over all the stuff we're gonna talk about Christmas vacation or whatever it was. And I go, yeah, yeah. Goes, And you you you're not gonna talk about meat or beef or or anything like that, right? And I go, no, I'm not. I'm I'm I'm I'm just gonna talk about the stuff we talked about going on vacation at Christmas or the kids or you know, their their anecdotes, you know.

好的。好的。好的。好的。然后他在我上台前二十分钟又回来，说，好吧，但别谈牛肉或肉之类的。我就想，你警告我两次了？

Okay. Alright. Okay. Alright. And he like came back like twenty minutes later before right before I went out and he's like, okay, but don't talk about beef or meat or or any and I was like You got two warnings?

是啊。是啊。我当时就想，这家伙吓坏了。这家伙真的害怕。后来我和一个签了保密协议的人聊过，我不会说他的名字，但他为艾伦写过稿子，我就问，艾伦人怎么样？

Yeah. Yeah. And I was like, oh, this guy's scared to death. This guy is scared. And then later on I talked to someone who signed an NDA so I won't say his name but he wrote for Ellen and I just went, how is Ellen?

他说，最糟糕的人，最糟糕的人。然后他又说，不是我共事过的最糟糕的人，是我见过的最糟糕的人。顺便说一句，我认识这家伙，他在罗斯的《朱迪·丘布俱乐部》时为罗斯工作过。最糟糕、最刻薄的。

And he said, worst person, worst person. And then he went, not worst person I've worked for. Worst person I've ever met. And by the way, I knew the guy did Rosie when Rosie was Judy Chubb Club. The worst and the meanest.

所以我不知道巅峰时期的罗斯和巅峰时期的艾伦，谁更刻薄一点，简直是泰坦之战。

So I don't know some kind of some sort of mean off between Rosie in her prime and Ellen in her prime, the Clash of the Titans.

怀念泥浆摔跤小姐。

Miss mud wrestling.

她，我喜欢那个，但她根本不是个好人。现在所有人都知道了我十五年前或无论何时了解到的事，但现在其他一切似乎都成了常识，我那时试图向大家解释她有多刻薄。不是因为她对我刻薄，而是因为大家都怕她，这意味着她很刻薄。她不会对我刻薄，我是节目嘉宾，对吧？所以我从我们的互动中看不出来，但从她员工畏缩的样子就能知道。

She's, I like that but so she's not a nice person at all. Which now everyone knows what I knew fifteen years ago or whenever I learned it, but now everything else seems to be common knowledge, which I would I was trying to explain to everyone how mean she was. Not because she was mean to me, because everyone was scared of her, which means she's mean. She's not gonna be mean to me, I'm a guest on the show, right? So I wouldn't know it from my exchanges, would know it with how her staff was cowering.

特朗普总统与美联储的争执会产生什么影响？美联储能否在正确的时间采取正确行动，还是我们将面临潜在的经济放缓？这对你的储蓄意味着什么？考虑通过Birch Gold Group将黄金纳入多元化配置。几十年来，黄金一直被视为经济停滞、全球不确定性和高通胀时期的避风港。

What will the effect of the sparring between president Trump and the Federal Reserve be? Can the Fed take the right action at the right time, or are we going to be looking at a potential economic slowdown? And what does this mean for your savings? Consider diversifying with gold through Birch Gold Group. For decades, gold has been viewed as a safe haven in times of economic stagnation, global uncertainty, and high inflation.

Birch Gold让你能极其轻松地将部分储蓄转为黄金。如果你有IRA或旧的401k，可以将其转换为税收优惠的IRA实物黄金，或直接购买黄金存入保险柜。首先获取知识。Birch Gold会免费寄送黄金信息手册，只需发送短信MK至989898。

And Birch Gold makes it incredibly easy for you to diversify some of your savings into gold. If you have an IRA or old four zero one k, you can convert that into a tax sheltered IRA and physical gold, or just buy some gold to keep it in your safe. First, get educated. Birch Gold will send you a free info kit on gold. Just text m k to the number 989898.

重申：发送MK至989898，考虑将部分储蓄转为黄金。这样即使美联储无法为国家抢占先机，至少你能为自己未雨绸缪。

Again, text m k to 989898 and consider diversifying a portion of your savings into gold. So if the Fed cannot stay ahead of the curve for the country, at least you can stay ahead for yourself.

经过多年的'觉醒'运动后，广告里出现个和你长相不同的人就受不了？看开点吧。耐克也一样，就像American Eagle，他们决定回归核心竞争力。

After years and years of wokeness, someone's in an advertisement that doesn't look exactly like you. Get over it. And Nike. Nike is another brand like American Eagle. They've decided to revert back to their core competencies.

他们现在通过斯科蒂·舍夫勒带着孩子出镜的新广告，优先展现传统、保守价值观和家庭。这支耐克广告很美，与2020年以大码女性为主的地板广告形成鲜明对比。他们在调整策略，对吧？过去四年他们配合拜登政府尝试了一种路线。

They're now prioritizing tradition, conservative values, family by putting Scottie Scheffler in this new Nike ad where he's with his child. It is a beautiful Nike ad, and it's in sharp contrast to their 2020 ad on the floor where they had plus size women. So they're switching it up. Right? They tried one thing, right, the last four years with Joe Biden.

在这个特朗普总统以压倒性优势胜选的11月5日后世界，他们正在回归，因为热爱家庭、保持健康、积极户外活动、推广传统保守价值观现在很受欢迎。这就是当下的潮流。由于自由市场和资本主义，耐克等大品牌正回归多年前的路线。你会看到新旧广告的对比，当然总会有人选择被冒犯。

In this post November 5 world where president Trump won overwhelmingly, they're switching back now because it's popular to love your family, to be healthy, to be active, to get outdoors, to promote traditional conservative values. That is what's popular now. And so Nike and a lot of these big brands, because of the free market, because of capitalism, they are going back to what they knew years ago. And it's why you see this side by side of how the ads looked years ago and how they look now. And, of course, some people are going to choose to be offended.

但生活不保证每个品牌广告都必须有和你长相相似的人。要对耐克生气随你便，但你去商店本就是为了买运动鞋、短裤和装备的。

But there is no guarantee in life that every single brand is gonna have someone that looks like you in an advertisement. Okay? If you wanna get upset with Nike, that's fine. But you can also just go to buy the sneakers and the shorts and the athletic gear. That's what you're supposed to be in the store for.

还有其他品牌如Calvin Klein。对吧？Calvin Klein曾主打性感热辣，拍过马克·沃尔伯格和尼克·乔纳斯的火辣广告。

But there are also some other brands like Calvin Klein. Right? Calvin Klein Calvin Klein, which was all about hotness. Right? Calvin Klein, they did all these hot ads with Mark Wahlberg and Nick Jonas.

九十年代和两千年代初，所有人都在拍Calvin Klein的广告，那是潮流。后来Calvin Klein决定搞政治正确结果自食其果。他们还找了一堆非二元性别女性留着胡子、男人穿裙子拍广告。真不知道他们的营销会议到底在搞什么名堂。

Everybody was doing these Calvin Klein ads, you know, in the nineties and the early two thousands. It was a whole thing. Calvin Klein decided to go woke and go broke. Also, I believe they put a bunch of, like, non binary women with beards and men in dresses. Calvin Klein, I don't know what was happening in those marketing meetings.

我们会把画面切到大屏幕上。但他们选择政治正确结果也凉凉了。现在能不能就找些性感的人拍广告？行吗？要求广告里出现养眼的模特很过分吗？

We'll put it up on the screen. But they decided to go woke and go broke as well. Now can we just have some hot people? Okay. Is it too much to ask that we have some hot people in ads?

也许这样能给官网带点流量？或许能让门店生意好些？反正我不想看什么超重的非二元性别大胡子女人，像马戏团小丑似的卖内衣给我。懂我意思吗？我不需要小丑来推销内衣。现在Calvin Klein总算回头找了些辣妹拍广告。

Maybe it will drive some traffic to the website. Maybe it'll drive traffic to the stores because I don't want to see, like, some overweight, non binary man, woman with a beard like a freaking circus clown selling me underwear. You know what I'm saying? I don't need a circus clown selling me underwear. And Calvin Klein, they've now gone back to putting some hot people in ads.

明白？他们新找了莉莉·柯林斯拍广告，美得惊人。看看Bad Bunny和其他模特，明显是彻底调头了。

Okay? They have this new ad with Lily Collins. She looks gorgeous. She looks stunning if you look at Bad Bunny. If you look at these other people in the Calvin Klein ads, they have clearly done an about face, a one eighty.

他们抛弃了那些非二元性别的楚巴卡怪胎，现在重新重视颜值。让我困惑的是，这些品牌搞极端政治正确时难道没想过——非二元性别者只占总人口的0.000...几%。但Calvin Klein因为DEI、ESG之类的潮流，和其他大牌一样盲目跟风。就像百威淡啤找迪伦·马尔瓦尼代言那样。

They've left the nonbinary Chewbacca trolls behind, and now they're prioritizing hotness. And what confuses me also when it comes to these brands that went so woke and so broke, Nonbinary people are, like, point zero zero zero zero zero whatever percent of the population. But Calvin Klein, because of DEI, ESG, whatever, a lot of these big brands thought we need to jump on this bandwagon. This is what we need to do. Sort of like Bud Light with Dylan Mulvaney.

非要抛弃多年成功的经验，搞这些荒唐的把戏。结果呢？彻底失败。所以现在他们找了西德妮·斯威尼。

Let's stray from everything we've known and everything that's worked for years and try this ridiculous tomfoolery, buffoonery, and clownery. Guess what? It didn't work. It didn't work. So now you've got Sydney Sweeney.

American Eagle也这样。虽然引发争议，但这种话题效应花钱都买不到——昨晚我和制片人聊到这事，联想到维多利亚的秘密时尚秀。作为2025年的纯同性恋者，我敢说绝对会准时收看维密大秀。

You've got American Eagle. People are in an uproar, but also this is something money can't buy because you'd have to spend a lot of money to get people talking about your brand. Now they're all talking about your brand. Now last night, I was talking to my producer, and this reminded us of the Victoria's Secret Fashion Show. Now as a gay man, a 100% gay man here in 2025, I will tell you with unequivocal certainty, I would make it appointment viewing to sit down and watch the Victoria's Secret Fashion Show.

懂？我爱看这场娱乐盛宴、华丽场面和表演嘉宾。他们总是请泰勒·斯威夫特或是魔力红来演出。

Okay? I love the entertainment. I love the pageantry. I love the music. They always had, like, Taylor Swift performing or they had Maroon five or whoever the hell was performing at the Victoria's Secret Fashion Show.

我就爱看那些零号身材、七尺高的超模穿着夸张服饰走秀。这就是维密秀的魅力所在，也是你们当年追看的原因。结果几年前他们想停办维密秀，就因为制作人Ed Razek说了句「跨性别者不符合品牌幻想」。

And I love to see these superhuman size zero zero zero zero seven foot tall Amazonian models traipsed down the runway, and ridiculous clownery outfits. Okay? That is why I like the Victoria's Secret Fashion Show. And it's probably why a ton of you also tuned in to the Victoria's Secret Fashion Show. Well, a few years ago, they tried to cancel the Victoria's Secret Fashion Show because Ed Razek, one of the developers of Victoria's Secret, one of the producers of the iconic fashion show, made a comment about, oh, trans women aren't the fantasy.

跨性别者不是品牌要打造的幻想——他有表达观点的权利吧？结果就被觉醒派给彻底封杀了。

Trans people aren't the fantasy. Right? He should be allowed to have his opinion. Well, he got canceled. He got so freaking canceled by the woke mob.

事实上，他们甚至多年没举办维密大秀了。整整几年都没办。最近他们带着维密秀回归，却宣布：知道吗？把那些骨感美人全请来。把那些穿四零码的瘦子全叫来。

In fact, they didn't even do a Victoria's Secret fashion show for years. They did not do one for years. Well, they came back recently with the Victoria's Secret fashion show, they said, you know what? Get those skinny bitches in here. Get those size quadruple zeros in here.

戴上天使翅膀。放起劲爆音乐，让她们在T台上摇曳生姿，确保摄像机里都录着胶片。而我们全都爱看。懂吗？没人会觉得自己应该永远像贝拉·哈迪德那样。

Put the wings on. Get the freaking music going and strut down the runway and make sure there's film in those cameras. And we all loved it. Okay? Nobody out there thinks they should look like Bella Hadid all the time.

明白吗？除非你缺乏安全感。除非你既缺乏安全感又脱离现实，你该知道这些是拥有私人教练、私人厨师、整形医生和美容师的非人类物种。我们普通人本就不该奢望去像超模那样。

Okay? Unless you are insecure. Unless you're insecure and you're not living in reality, you know that these are alien superhuman people who have personal trainers, personal chefs, plastic surgeons, aestheticians. Okay? Us as civilians, we're not supposed to look like superhuman models.

但有些人看到电视上的骨感模特还是会生气。这正是本期节目想呈现的二元对立——有些品牌就是可以用高挑纤瘦的超模打广告。这符合99%国民的形象吗？当然不。

But some folks still get offended by seeing skinny models on television. And that's sort of the dichotomy I'm trying to paint for you here in this episode right now. There are brands that are allowed to put skinny, tall supermodels in advertisement. Does that look like 99% of the country? No.

这像我那群体型背景各异的朋友家人吗？当然不像。但如果你非要感觉被冒犯，那只能说明你内心脆弱。我们不该总对品牌选用瘦模特意难平。听着——

Does it look like 99% of my group of friends and family who have all different shapes and sizes and backgrounds? Absolutely not. But if you choose to be offended, that is because you are insecure and you have thin skin. We shouldn't be so offended all the time that brands choose to give us some skinny models. You know what?

如果美国鹰牌决定让好莱坞新人、金发辣妹西德妮·斯威尼拍广告，而你选择感到冒犯，那是你的问题。你放任这种情绪侵蚀快乐。懂吗？不可能人人都和你长得一样。我走进会议室时也常常是唯一的同性恋者。

If American Eagle decides we're gonna put Sydney Sweeney, a skinny little hot blonde chick, ingenue in Hollywood in an advertisement and you choose to be offended, that's on you. You're allowing that to erode your happiness and eat away at you. Okay? Not everyone is gonna look like you all the time. I walk into rooms, I walk into meetings, and sometimes I'm the only gay person in there.

但我从不让同性恋成为全部人格。而那些网络自由派看到西德妮或维密秀的瘦模特就崩溃，正是因为他们太缺乏安全感。他们时刻需要外界认可，必须看到和自己一模一样的人——这很难，毕竟有些人长得像山怪或楚巴卡。

But you know what? I don't make being gay my entire personality. And so for these folks at home, these liberals on the internet, they feel so upset when they see Sydney Sweeney or so upset when they see the Victoria's Secret Fashion Show and these skinny models because they're so insecure. They need such outside affirmation all of the time. They need to see someone who looks exactly like them, which is tough because some of y'all look like trolls and you look like Chewbacca.

明白吗？这很残酷。那些在TikTok上挂着彩虹旗的非二元性别者（就像刚才画面里那些）总自寻烦恼。但电视剧不可能每个角色都像你。这些人已经毁了不少好剧集（后面会细说），就因为他们执著于 ticking every box。

Okay? It's tough. Some of these like LGBTQIA r two d two non binary folks sitting around on TikTok with the pride flags in the background as we just showed you. They choose to be offended, but someone isn't always gonna look like you in every single TV show. And they've ruined plenty of good TV shows, which we'll get to later in the episode, because they feel like they have to check every single box and every single quota.

被维密冒犯是你的选择。被美国鹰牌冒犯也是你的选择，你该对着镜子学会接纳自己。这就是我的处世之道，也是我给无数年轻人（包括私信留言的粉丝）和育儿家长的建议：与真实的自己和解。

If you choose to be offended by Victoria's Secret, that's on you. If you choose to be offended by American Eagle, that's on you, and you should go look in the mirror and get comfortable with who you are and your own skin. That is how I live. And that's the advice I give to so many people, especially young people growing up who message me, who leave comments, and this is the advice I give to parents who are raising young kids and raising young adults going out into the world. Be comfortable with who you are.

这可能需要数年历程，但你必须认清自我。这样踏入现实世界时，你才能坚强自信、不为琐事所扰。你不会因为广告里有个不像你的瘦模特就心态爆炸，也不会因社交媒体上的恶评就方寸大乱——因为世界本就如此。

It might take a journey. It might take years, but figure out who the hell you are. So when you go out into the real world, you're strong, you're secure, you know who you are, and you can't be offended by every little thing. You can't be knocked off your rocker, okay, because a brand puts some skinny model who doesn't look like you in an advertisement. You can't be knocked off your rocker because someone makes a negative comment about the way you look maybe on your social media because that's the way the world is.

努力认清自我，建立自信与安全感，这样你才能昂首阔步走进世界，成就一番事业。明白吗？我就是这么做的。从小我就清楚，我不可能成为一米八的超模，但沟通是我的天赋，也是我降临世间的使命。所以请回归本心，寻找你在这世上的使命——它很可能与走T台无关。

Do the work to figure out who you are and to be confident and secure in you are who you are so you can go out into the world and get shit done. Okay? That's what I did. I knew growing up, I'm not going to be a six foot tall supermodel, but communication is my skill, and it's what I was put on this earth to do. So go to the drawing board and figure out what you were supposed to do in this world, and it might not be being a supermodel.

因为我们99.9%的人，面前根本没有这条职业道路。不是每个人都能成为贝拉·哈迪德、吉吉·哈迪德或肯达尔·詹娜。这没关系。但你必须选择不再持续感到被冒犯，而这些品牌从'觉醒'回归数十年行之有效的策略，这种转变很有意思。

Because for 99.9% of us, that is not that is not the career path laid in front of us. We aren't all gonna be Bella Hadid, Gigi Hadid, and Kendall Jenner. That's okay. But you have to make the choice not to be offended constantly, and it's interesting to see these brands go from woke back to what was working for them before for decades.

但至少有四个方面客观上符合美国利益：首先是移民管控。在边境问题及我将列举的所有领域，特朗普确实存在越界行为，相关政策也有弊端，但边境管控符合国家利益，是多数美国民众的诉求。他制造了 spectacle（戏剧性场面），却也彻底改变了边境管控的范式与效能标准。

But I think there are four things at least that are objectively in the interest of The United States. One would be immigration, controlling the border that Trump has clearly in this area and all four of the areas I'm going to list. He's clearly done some things that people rightly say are overstepped, that these policies have some downsides. But controlling the border is something that's in the national interest, something a majority of the Americans want. Trump has created a spectacle, but he's also shifted the paradigm on what it takes to close the border and how effective it can be.

第二是关税政策。特朗普同样重塑了游戏规则，如今多国正按美国意志行事。本周曝光的欧美协议条款明显有利于美国和特朗普本人。

Number two, tariffs. Okay, Trump has changed the paradigm there, too. Lots of these countries now are doing what The United States wants. The coverage this week of the deal with the EU. Favorable to The United States, favorable to Trump.

就连惯常批评特朗普的媒体也承认这符合美国利益，他确实达成了有利协议。其目标很明确：在不损害美国及全球经济的前提下，借助美国市场优势重构全球贸易体系——目前进展顺利。

Even news organizations that don't normally say positive things about Trump have said this is in The United States interest. Trump got a good deal out of this. And again, the goal is clear. He wants to reengineer global trade by leveraging The US market and other American advantages without hurting the American or global economy. Right now, that appears on track.

虽然协议细节尚待完善，但这无疑是特朗普为国家利益取得的又一项前无古人的成就——就像边境管控一样。而民主党人却装作这些全是彻头彻尾的失败。

It's early. These deals are not fleshed out yet. But I'll say again, this is another area of Trump achievement in the national interest. Other presidents didn't do it, just like closing the border. And Democrats just pretend it's just a total failure.

第三点同样如此：控制公务员规模。特朗普极大增强了白宫精简行政机构的能力，已裁撤大量岗位并将继续推进。他打破了联邦政府必然持续膨胀的数十年铁律。

Same with number three, controlling the size of the workforce. Trump has turbocharged the capacity of a White House to control the size of the bureaucracy. He already has eliminated a lot of positions. He plans to eliminate more. This concept that we've had for decades that the federal government is just going to keep growing, He's figured out a way to change that.

此举虽非尽善尽美，但总体受到民众支持。最后是关于北约的改革：特朗普确立了成员国的义务条款，将欧洲国家搭便车的关系转变为更务实的交易模式。这种'后全球化'安排既保全了联盟，又使美国获得更有利条件。当然，特朗普的每个举措都存在客观缺陷。

Again, popular, not in every respect, overreach in some areas, but this is another area that Democrats are simply criticizing. Finally, as I mentioned before, NATO, where Trump has ensured that terms and conditions apply now to be a member. He's changed the relationship from one where the European countries were free riding and freeloading to one now that's more transactional. It's a post globalist arrangement in which the alliance can live on, but on terms that are far more favorable to The United States. Now, again, I'd say again, in each case, there are objectively downsides to what Trump has done.

但总体而言，这些变革方向积极且深得民心，近几十年来没有哪位总统具备如此彻底改变现状的决心与行动力。民主党只会夸大成就的阴暗面，紧盯薄弱环节（确实存在），却无视更重要的实质进展——正是民意浪潮助推了特朗普的施政能力。

But I'll say also in each case that overall, these directionally are positive and popular, and no other recent president has had the requisite desire or drive to change the status quo in such a fundamental way. In this country, the Democrats simply accentuate the downsides of these achievements. They find and highlight the weak links, and there are weak links, rather than grappling with what's actually happening that I think is more important. That the trends in this country in terms of public opinion have fueled Trump's rise in capacity to get stuff done. Trump has understood where public opinion was on these issues and others, and the Democratic Party has been and largely remains clueless.

特朗普精准把握了这些议题的民意走向，而民主党至今仍茫然不觉。这种现象不仅限于美国——纵观欧洲及其他西方工业民主国家，数十年来滋生的相同条件，正在引发对左翼政党的全面反叛。

Okay, this is to me fundamental if you're thinking about the connection between what Trump has done and what's happened with the Democratic Party. And it's not just The United States. Trump has read the mood of where things are and these issues and others, and the Democrats have failed. The American left has failed on these and and other issues. So if you look at Europe and the other industrialized democracies in the West, you see the same conditions that have grown over decades that have caused rebellion against the parties on the left.

失控的大规模移民、失控的犯罪、觉醒主义在各类文化机构中的主导影响、LGBTQ运动中被许多人视为越界的改变——尤其在跨性别领域、审查制度、过度监管、取消文化、新社会主义，这些现象在其他国家同样存在。金·斯特拉塞尔在《华尔街日报》上撰文分析美国现状，其深刻聚焦点甚至未被多数民主党人思考过：开放边境、无节制的开支、在教师工会行为违背儿童利益时仍对其支持。

Out of control mass migration, out of control crime, the dominant influence of wokeness in all sorts of cultural institutions, The LGBTQ changes that many have seen as overreach, particularly in the area of trans. Censorship, over regulation, cancellation, neosocialism, all these things exist in other countries. Kim Strassel has written about what's happened to The United States in The Wall Street Journal. Very good focus that most Democrats haven't even thought about. Open borders, unrestrained spending, supports for teachers unions when they're acting antithetical to the interest of our kids.

对气候变化病态般的专注、抨击警察、反对以色列、身份政治的霸凌——这一切已使民主党在本国逐渐丧失多个选民群体的支持，这与特朗普无关，尽管他顺势利用了这种局面。试想若共和党正失去其长期基本盘的支持，媒体会如何铺天盖地报道？这种反向情况正是当前民主党的重大危机。

An obsessive focus on climate change, bashing the police, being against Israel, the dominance of identity politics. All of this has caused Democrats in this country to lose support from demographic groups, independent of Donald Trump, although Trump has taken advantage of that. Imagine if the Democrats, if the Republicans rather, were losing support from interest groups that had long been a bedrock of their electoral success. Imagine if the reverse were happening, how much the media would cover it. This is a massive story.

有色人种选民和年轻选民正抛弃民主党，这是地震级的转变。特朗普现象具有独特性——所有工业化民主国家都面临相似问题，但它们尚未找到自己的'特朗普'。

Democrats losing support from voters of color, from younger voters. Massive. Now, Trump is singular. All these other industrialized democracies, they have the same issues. But what's different is they haven't found their version of Trump.

这些国家虽出现过'廉价版特朗普'，但缺乏他的政治天赋、攻击性魄力，以及颠覆旧秩序的决绝意志。因此它们的左翼政党（相当于美国民主党）虽比从前衰弱，却未被彻底击垮。

There have been kind of poor man's versions of Trump, but they haven't succeeded. They haven't had Trump's skill. They haven't had Trump's level of aggressiveness, tough enough and determined enough to take on the old order. So what's happened to these other countries with their left parties, their equivalents of the Democratic Party, is they're weaker than they were before. But they're not crushed.

多数国家左翼的衰落曲线远不如民主党这般陡峭——如今该党支持率在各类民调中屡创新低。我与少数民主党人探讨过此现象，但无论是民选官员、活动家、作家还是智库成员，几乎无人公开直面问题。为何？他们既惧怕被激进左翼清洗出党，更缺乏反思'我们如何走到这步'的创造力与自知之明。

They haven't declined as precipitously in most cases the way the Democratic Party has, who is now as low as they've been in poll after poll. I'm thinking about this stuff, and I talked to some Democrats who are, but very few prominent Democrats, whether you're talking about people in elective office, you're talking about activists, or writers, or people in think tanks, they're not even vaguely grappling with this problem in public. Why? Because they fear that the activists left will push them out of the party or cancel them. And because most of them lack the creativity and self awareness that's required to say, how did this happen?

这些趋势早在特朗普崛起前就已埋下伏笔。当个别民主党人战战兢兢试探'我们做错了什么'时，其措辞仍回避对现状的全面剖析与未来对策——正如我所说，他们害怕被左翼封杀。

How far back has this been going on? Some of these trends go well before Donald Trump's rise. When the few Democrats do tepidly and timidly put their toe in the water and say, what have we done wrong? They do it in a way that doesn't really give voice to a full analysis of what's happened and what needs to happen next. Because they're afraid, as I said, of being cancelled by the left.

他们唯恐与党内激进派步调不一。以希拉里·克林顿和拜登的顾问尼拉·坦丹为例，这位我见过最睿智的民主党人选择在保守派的《华尔街日报》而非《华盛顿邮报》或《纽约时报》发文，承认自己深度参与的拜登政府在美墨边境政策上的重大失误，并呼吁全面移民改革。

They're afraid of being out of step with the activist wing of the party. So, Niratandan, a liberal adviser to Hillary Clinton, adviser to Joe Biden, one of the smartest people in the Democratic Party, in my experience, very knowledgeable. She wrote an op ed piece in The Wall Street Journal, not in The Washington Post, not in The New York Times, but in the Journal, conservative editorial page. And she admitted that the Biden administration that she was part of, a big part of it, in advising on domestic policy, screwed up on the Mexican border. And she called for comprehensive immigration reform.

她在文章中犀利揭示特朗普移民政策中不得民心的部分，但为安抚党内自由派，仍被迫主张为部分非法移民提供公民身份途径（即许多美国人眼中的'大赦'）。若民主党到2028年仍不懂展现强硬立场，无论共和党提名万斯或其他人，都必将把民主党撕成碎片。

She rightly in her piece put in sharp relief all the unpopular elements of Donald of President Trump's immigration policies because some of the things Donald Trump has done are unpopular on the border. But she also felt compelled to call for a path to citizenship for some of the people in this country illegally. That is known by many Americans as amnesty. And she criticized other elements of what Donald Trump has done to try to stay on the good side of her liberal wing of her party. If the Democrats can't figure out how to lead with being tough in 2028, whoever the Republicans nominate, whether it's Vance or somebody else, they'll make men's meat of the Democrats.

特朗普阵营讥笑的是：即便2024年胜选已证明移民问题的关键性，民主党至今对此仍毫无头绪。再看纽约市民主党提名曼达尼为市长候选人的反应，更暴露该党对其当选将如何损害自身品牌的无知。

In Trump world, they laugh at how even now, even after Donald Trump's victory in 2024 was clearly fueled in large part by immigration. They laugh at how much the Democrats still don't have a clue on immigration and a range of other issues. Then you think about New York City and the nomination by the Democrats of Mr. Mamdani to be their mayoral candidate. The reaction to that, again, reveals how clueless far too many Democrats are about what his election would mean for their brand.

共和党正摩拳擦掌期待特朗普对决班达米——若后者当选纽约市长。有趣的是，特朗普圈内也有人反对其胜选，因担忧他会毁掉这座他们重金投资的城市。但左翼仍拒绝思考：选举具蒙达米背景及经济、执法等政见的人意味着什么？《纽约时报》近期刊载了特蕾西·麦克米伦·科托姆的评论文章...

Republicans are salivating at the notion of having Donald Trump be able to run against Bandhammi and campaign against him if he is the mayor of New York City. Now, are people in Trump's orbit who don't want him to win because they think he'd ruin the city and some of them have pretty big investments in New York. So, there's cross pressure there. But on the left, they continue to not grapple with what it would mean to elect someone with Mondami's background and stated positions on the economy and law enforcement, a range of other issues. There was an op ed piece of The New York Times by a woman named Tressie McMillan Cottom.

她辩称，对曼达米的反对几乎完全基于他的种族血统，而非他是一名社会主义者这一事实。本周《纽约邮报》一篇报道指出，党内许多重要人物及共和党计划将蒙达米塑造成民主党的形象代表。而像查克·舒默、哈基姆·杰弗里斯这样的国会民主党领袖——两人均来自纽约市，还有纽约州州长凯西·霍楚尔、纽约市长，他们都清楚这对政党在政治上的危险性。

She argued that the opposition to Mandami is based pretty much solely on his racial heritage rather than, say, the fact that he's a socialist. Okay, New York Post story this week talked about how so many prominent people in the party and the Republican Party plan to make Mundamy the face of the Democrats. And then you have people like Chuck Schumer, Hakim Jeffries, the leading Democrats in Congress, both from New York City. Kathy Hochul, the mayor of New York, the governor of New York. They know how dangerous this is politically for the party.

他们对此深感忧虑。但除了这三人尚未公开支持蒙达米之外，他们如同困在琥珀中动弹不得——因为基层选民不愿看到他们公开反对提名者。他们担心蒙达米可能获胜，却未采取任何明显行动阻止他迈向胜利的步伐。谁能替民主党破解这个困局？

They're really worried about it. But except for the fact that none of them, none of those three have publicly endorsed Mondami yet, they're frozen in amber because the base does not want to see them be outspoken against the nominee. And they're worried that he may win. But they're not doing anything, at least overtly, to stop his march to victory. Who can solve this for the Democrats?

谁能深思熟虑地发声？我认为现任民主党主席肯·马丁不行，前任领袖贝拉克·奥巴马、卡玛拉·哈里斯、乔·拜登也不行。这些人既无力阻止特朗普继续扩大优势，也无法同步完成另一项关键任务：重塑政党品牌，制定真正能改变局面的政策、理念和传播策略。是的，特朗普会继续经历成败起伏，民主党或许能在中期选举表现优异。

Who can speak out thoughtfully? I don't think that the current Democratic Party chair, Ken Martin, or the past party leaders, Barack Obama, Kamala Harris, Joe Biden, These these folks are not well positioned to try to stop Donald Trump on his march to achieving more or to do the other task that needs to be done in parallel, rebuild their party's brand to try to come up with policies and ideas and messengers that could really make a difference. Okay, Trump's going to continue to have success and failures. The Democrats may do very well in the midterms. They may well.

但每当特朗普遭遇挫败时，我认为这与民主党是否具备积极果断的应对能力无关——他们既未能反思品牌为何失民心，也未能改变在经济和社会议题上的形象。现有证据表明，民主党实际处境比民调显示得更糟，因为民调只是当下快照。时间所剩无几：中期选举特性难测，经济走向未明，爱泼斯坦事件后续未卜，民主党或能在2026年翻盘。但与我交谈的民主党人更担忧2028年——历史表明即便弱势政党仍可夺回众议院。

But in each case where Trump may have failure, I don't think it has much to do with the Democrats having a capacity to affirmatively and assertively meet the moment, to rethink why voters are so down on their brand, to change their image on the economy, on social issues. Because based on all the available evidence, the Democrats actually right now are on worse shape than the polling suggests, because the polling is a snapshot of where we are. They're running out of time. Again, because the nature of the midterms, because we don't know where the economy will be, we don't know what's gonna happen with the Epstein story, it's possible that the Democrats will have a good 2026. But the Democrats I talked to are far less worried about 2026 in the midterms because history suggests that even weak, the party could still do well enough to take back the House.

他们真正恐惧的是2028年，是政党能否重新定义自身并赢回选民。他们需要夺回白宫，尤其当前党内缺乏强力候选人。民主党的品牌形象如今在民调与历史维度双重失利，这才是致命危机。

What they're worried about is 2028. What they're worried about is the capacity of the party to redefine itself and to win back voters. They'll need to win the White House, particularly because they are a party right now without strong candidates. The Democratic brand on its own right now, it appears to be on the wrong side of both the polling and of the history. And that's a big problem.

背离民意与历史潮流是重大危机。追溯问题根源，某些趋势固然由来已久，但据我所知，最精明的民主党人最忧心的不是历史，而是未来——当社会议题、教师工会、经济、移民、政府支出、北约关系等众多领域动态失衡时，他们如何破局？

It's a big problem to be on the wrong side of polling and of history. You think back to where did this start to go wrong? As I said, some of these trends have been around forever. But what's to me and talking to the smartest Democrats I know what to me is their biggest concern is not the history, but the future. How can they fix this when so many of the dynamics on social issues, teachers unions, the economy, immigration, government spending, relationship with NATO.

在这些关键议题上，民主党缺乏对失误的反思。他们既难以批评特朗普又无法赞扬他——若给予肯定，想想首任期内《亚伯拉罕协议》的案例：私下询问任何民主党人看法，他们会说'精彩绝伦'；问及封锁边境政策，多数人承认'伟大成就'。但在红蓝对立的美国，任何对特朗普的赞许都会触怒基本盘，他们也担忧特朗普会如何利用这些赞誉。

On so many of these issues, there's no reflection about where things went wrong. And it's very hard for Democrats to criticize Donald Trump and praise him. Because if you give him any praise, think about in the first term with the Abraham Accords. Ask any Democrat privately. What do you think of the Abraham Accords?

但现实评估显示，民主党未能站在这些议题的正确面。我们既背离民意又违背历史规律。其他工业民主国家的自由派政党能存续，只因未遭遇特朗普这样的对手。重申一次：若你认为特朗普是拙劣的政治运动员，那就大错特错。他虽有许多不受欢迎的政策立场，却比民主党更懂得化解之道。

Privately, they'll say fantastic. Ask them what they think about shutting down the border. Most of them will say great, huge accomplishment. But in our polarized red blue America now, it's very hard for either party to praise. And you take heed from the base if you praise Donald Trump, and they're worried about what Donald Trump would do with that praise.

当处于错误立场时，他会竭力扭转局面。例如民主党指望在医疗补助计划和医保支出上占据道德高地，但特朗普绝不会被动挨打。他会不择手段调整立场，而民主党却未展现出同等的警觉性与灵活性。

But a realistic appraisal shows that Democrats are not getting on the right side of these issues. We're on the wrong side of public opinion, the wrong side of history. These other industrialized democracies, their liberal parties, have survived because they haven't faced Trump. And I'll say again, if you think Trump is a bad political athlete, you're making a mistake. Trump has lots of unpopular policy positions, but he knows how to mitigate them better than the Democrats know how to mitigate theirs.

And he fights to get on the right side of issues when he's on the wrong side. Democrats, for instance, are counting on being on the right side of Medicaid and Medicaid spending and people on healthcare. Trump's not going to sit back passively and be on the wrong side of that. He'll do whatever he can as much as he needs to change. The Democrats have not shown the same level of awareness, the same level of nimbleness.

And he fights to get on the right side of issues when he's on the wrong side. Democrats, for instance, are counting on being on the right side of Medicaid and Medicaid spending and people on healthcare. Trump's not going to sit back passively and be on the wrong side of that. He'll do whatever he can as much as he needs to change. The Democrats have not shown the same level of awareness, the same level of nimbleness.

因此我要再次提出这个问题：民主党是如何走错了路？我们还能列举出许多其他事例。在此我们讨论过部分原因，比如2016年和2020年试图阻止伯尼·桑德斯获得提名、阻挠小罗伯特·肯尼迪参选、对特朗普发起法律战。民主党做出这一系列阶段性举动，部分源于'特朗普恐惧综合征'，部分因为他们过于依附党内建制派。虽然这份清单很长，但核心在于他们在关乎美国民众利益的议题上站错了队。

And so I say again, this question, how did the Democrats go wrong? And there's plenty of other things we could list. We've talked about some of them here, trying to block Bernie Sanders from the winning the nomination in 2016 and 2020, trying to keep Bobby Kennedy off the ballot, lawfare against Trump. There's a there's a whole range of things that are kind of episodic that Democrats did in part because of Trump derangement syndrome, in part because they were too wedded to the establishment of their party. It's a long list, but the core of the list is being on the right side of the issues that matter to the American people.

我至今鲜少遇到能激情阐述为何在跨性别运动员参与女子体育赛事议题上立场错误的民主党人。真的非常罕见。他们仍在不断向党内意识形态基础靠拢。

I still find rarely find any Democrats who can speak with passion about how they got on the wrong side of the issue of trans athletes and girls and women's sports. Rarely. They continue to drift back towards the ideological, base of the party.

你知道我和家人多么爱我们的狗狗们。是的，就连可爱的斯特雷特威克也不例外。我无法想象没有它们的生活。它们过得很好，但有些狗狗就没这么幸运了。

You know how much my family and I love our dogs. Yes. Even sweet Stretwick. I can't imagine life without them. They have a great life, but some dogs are not so lucky.

正因如此，我非常高兴向你介绍Delta Rescue——全球最大的终身非安乐死动物庇护所。他们已拯救了数千只狗，还有猫和马匹。他们为所有动物提供庇护所、安全保障，最重要的是给予关爱，这项善举已持续超过四十五年。Delta Rescue完全依靠捐款运营，捐赠还可享受税收优惠。咨询你的遗产规划师如何既能壮大资产又能帮助需要关爱的动物，登录官网查看遗产规划栏目了解更多信息。

And that's why I'm super glad to tell you about Delta Rescue, the largest no kill care for life animal sanctuary in the world. They've rescued thousands of dogs plus cats and horses too. They provide all the animals with shelter, safety, and most of all, love, and they've been doing it for more than forty five years now. Delta Rescue relies solely on contributions, and giving can bring tax benefits too. Speak with your estate planner about how you can grow your estate while helping animals in need, and check out the estate planning tab on their website to learn more.

我们深爱自家的雷霆和斯特鲁德威克，但也希望其他需要关爱的狗狗能找到归宿。你难道不这么想吗？立即访问deltarescue.org了解更多。网址是deltarescue.org。我是梅根·凯利，SiriusXM电台《梅根·凯利秀》主持人。

We love our Thunder and Strudwick, but would like other dogs who need love to find it too. Wouldn't you? Visit deltarescue.org today to learn more. That's deltarescue.org. I'm Megan Kelly, host of the Megan Kelly show on SiriusXM.

这里是畅所欲言的平台，我们将与当今政界、法律界及文化领域最具影响力的人物展开坦诚而犀利的对话。你可以在Triumph频道收听《梅根·凯利秀》，这个SiriusXM旗下频道汇聚了许多你可能熟知并喜爱的主持人，比如劳拉博士、格伦·贝克、南希·格雷斯、戴夫·拉姆齐，还有本人梅根·凯利。无论居家还是外出，无需车载设备，通过SiriusXM应用即可随时收听。

It's your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations with the most interesting and important political, legal, and cultural figures today. You can catch the Megan Kelly show on Triumph, a SiriusXM channel featuring lots of hosts you may know and probably love. Great people like doctor Laura, Glenn Beck, Nancy Grace, Dave Ramsey, and yours truly, Megan Kelly. You can stream the Megan Kelly show on SiriusXM at home or anywhere you are. No car required.

我经常这么收听。超爱SiriusXM应用，提供无广告音乐、各大体育赛事直播、喜剧、谈话节目及播客等丰富内容。现在订阅可享首三个月免费。

I do it all the time. I love the SiriusXM app. It has ad free music coverage of every major sport comedy talk podcast and more. Subscribe now. Get your first three months for free.

登录siriusxm.com/mkshow订阅即享三个月免费收听。重复一遍：siriusxm.com/mkshow可获三个月免费。具体条款适用。

Go to siriusxm.com/mkshow to subscribe and get three months free. That's siriusxm.com/mkshow and get three months free. Offer details apply.

过去一周随处可见的格温妮丝传记今天正式发行了。到处惹是生非的家伙们，省省钱吧。我来告诉你书里写了什么没写什么，咱们一起聊聊。

The Gwyneth biography, which has been everywhere for about the past week, it's coming out today. Troublemaker troublemakers everywhere. Just save your money. Okay. I'll tell you what's in it and what's not in it, and we can talk about it.

周末读完感觉挺煎熬的。真的相当乏味。要知道这位主人公可是个两极分化的人物——大众要么爱她要么恨她，没有中间派。这位在文化圈活跃了三十年的争议人物，如今已年过五旬。

I read it over the weekend, and it was kind of a slog. It was kind of a slog. And, you know, that's a lot to say for somebody who most people either love her or hate her, but there's no in between. So she's a polarizing figure who has been in the culture for about thirty years. She's in her fifties now.

她二十岁出头就成名了。我是说，我们长期生活在格温妮丝·帕特洛的阴影下，而媒体能挖到的最佳头条也就这样了。上周我们从传记里总结了几个重点：其中一个极具格温妮丝风格的轶事是，她曾向朋友抱怨（据传）不得不向布拉德·皮特解释Beluga鱼子酱和Osetra鱼子酱的区别——这事我还真查了，我自己之前也分不清。

She got famous when she was in her early twenties. I mean, we've been living with Gwyneth Paltrow for a long time, and if the best you can come up with is, the headlines okay. So there there were a few takeaways we got last week. One of the most Gwyneth anecdotes ever, she had to she complained, allegedly, to a friend that she had to tell Brad Pitt the difference between Beluga caviar and Osetra caviar, which I had to look up. I didn't know the difference either.

我压根不知道还有Osetra鱼子酱。她还对化妆品帝国继承人艾琳·兰黛说，布拉德·皮特蠢得像袋屎。听着，我觉得布拉德·皮特活该被骂，他早该挨这顿骂了，现在报应来了。

I didn't know there was an Osetra caviar. And and she told the cosmetics scion, Erin Lauder, that Brad Pitt is dumber than a sack of shit. And listen, I think Brad Pitt's got that coming. He's had it coming for a while now. He's getting it.

传记中还暗示，尽管布拉德当年名气更大，但两人在一起时，格温妮丝如火箭般蹿红的事业让他隐隐感到威胁——这一点我完全相信。另外根据这本号称《格温妮丝传》的书（不知道的还以为写的是英国女王呢，其实她才50岁），她还干过些荒唐事。

And there are also hints in this biography that Brad, even though he was a much bigger star, when they got together, was threatened a bit by Gwyneth's what was clearly a meteoric rise, and that wouldn't surprise me. Now Gwyneth also, according to this book Gwyneth, the biography I mean, you would think it was like a queen of England. It's not that it's a short life. She's only 50. Okay.

书中记载，她曾对已故化妆师凯文·奥库安说，最爱本·阿弗莱克对她玩

According to this book, she told the late makeup artist Kevin Akwan that she loved it when Ben Affleck tea bagged her. I understand that there may be troublemakers among you who do not know what trouble sorry. What you know what trouble is, what tea bagging is. And I'm gonna pause here and pay homage to the great John Waters whose movies, like, saved me as a kid. Like, I like, I would go rent them and just, like, die.

现在我理解可能有捣蛋鬼不知道'捣蛋'抱歉。你们知道什么是'捣蛋'，什么是'茶包'。我要在此暂停，向伟大的约翰·沃特斯致敬，他的电影在我小时候救了我。我会去租来看，然后笑到眼泪直流。

I just laugh till tears were coming down my face. Now, he is credited with introducing the phrase tea bagging into the lexicon. It was a movie he did called Pecker, I think. So this is this is I'm gonna warn you, it's graphic. Children are around.

他被认为是将'茶包'这个词引入词典的人。应该是通过他拍的电影《派克》，我先警告你们，这个描述很直白。孩子们可能在场。

You don't wanna listen to this aloud. But it's very funny. So here's John explaining this sex act to a writer at Boing Boing in a piece that was published 04/17/2009. John Waters, and I quote, teabagging, it sounds so dainty, doesn't it? It sounds like you took your teabag out of your fine china, and you just put it daintily on the saucer out of your sight.

你们不会想公开听这个。但非常滑稽。这是约翰在2009年4月17日发表于Boing Boing的文章中向作家解释的性行为。约翰·沃特斯原话：'茶包，听起来多优雅啊是不是？就像把你精致的茶包从瓷器里取出来，轻轻搁在茶托上。'

Teabagging, John tells us, is, quote, by my definition, the act of dragging your testicles across your partner's forehead. In The UK, it is dipping your testicles into your partner's mouth. I didn't invent the term or the act, but I did introduce it in my movie, Pecker. Teabagging was also a popular dance step that male GoGo boys did to their customers for tips at the Atlantis and now defunct bar in Baltimore. Hope this helps.

约翰告诉我们，'茶包'根据他的定义，是'将睾丸拖过伴侣额头的动作'。在英国，指的是把睾丸浸入伴侣口中。我没有发明这个词或行为，但我在电影《派克》里引入了它。茶包也曾是巴尔的摩现已关闭的Atlantis酒吧里，男舞者为赚小费对客人跳的热门舞步。希望这解释清楚了。

John Waters always helps in the culture. He always helps. Now the good part. It's all good, but this is great. Ben Affleck is scandalized by this.

约翰·沃特斯总在文化领域助人解惑。现在说精彩部分——其实全程都精彩，但这个尤其劲爆：本·阿弗莱克对此震怒了。

He has been leveled by this. He is utterly furious, and he is contemplating reportedly a lawsuit. An Affleck source told Radar Online last week that, quote, this isn't going away quietly. Ben is livid, and he is ready to fight back. Now I am sorry.

他被彻底击垮了。据说正考虑提起诉讼。有消息源告诉Radar Online：'这事不会悄悄过去。本暴怒不已，准备反击。'

But just like Brad Pitt, I'm not sorry, actually. This is Ben's karma. I bet Jennifer Garner was livid when rumors circulated that Ben was having an affair with Blake Lively on the set of The Town. Go look at those paparazzi pics of those two, the body language. Or when he was accused of sleeping with the nanny, which he has always denied, but, I mean, come on.

她开着一辆敞篷雷克萨斯扬长而去。她当时正忙着在社交媒体上发布自己跟着凯蒂·佩里的《Girl on Fire》对嘴唱跳的视频。或者我确信——在他那次臭名昭著的奥斯卡获奖感言中（我们前几期节目刚回顾过），他说他们的婚姻是场苦工；又或是他告诉霍华德·斯特恩，自己曾借酒逃避现实，因为...这该怎么说？我不是直接引用原话——他觉得自己被困在那段婚姻里了。

She walked away with a drop top Lexi. She was going on social media, posting images and video of herself to Katy Perry's Girl on Fire. Or I'm I'm sure I'm sure during his infamous Oscar speech, which we all just revisited an episode or so ago in which he said that their marriage was work, or when he told Howard Stern that he drank himself into oblivion because he I'm I'm I'm like, this is a what do you call it? I'm not quoting directly. He's he felt trapped in their marriage.

要我说，本·阿弗莱克接得住这招。他能优雅应对，就当是还债。我们稍后节目会如约聊回他，说到詹妮弗·洛佩兹最近的舞台表演——我都想称之为'性剥削'了，但这个词听起来比实际情况更阴暗，事实上确实更阴暗。

I mean, I think Ben can take this one. Okay? I think he can field it elegantly and just accept it as payback. And we will come back to him later, as promised, in the show when we get to J Lo's latest on stage I I mean, I would call them sexploits, but that almost sounds like it's darker than that. It's actually darker than that.

现在说回格温妮丝的书。这本书真的毫无看点，后半本全在讲Goop品牌。谁在乎啊？

Now, okay, back to the Gwyneth book. There is otherwise really nothing in this book. Okay. The last half of the book is about goop. And who cares?

你真想读她怎么突发奇想创业？怎么进行A轮融资？怎么管理员工？难道要看枯燥的损益表？这本书干巴巴的，显然格温妮丝圈子里没人接受作者采访，一个都没有。

Do you really want to read about how she got the idea or how how she came to, you know, do series a rounds of funding or how her her she interacts with her employees or her managerial style. Like, do you wanna see the p and l's, the profit and loss sheets? It's so dry. This book is so dry, and it's clear that nobody in Gwyneth's circle talked to the author. Nobody.

唯一与我们Nerve网站相关的内容涉及艾米·格里芬——她那套说辞最多算牵强附会（我们近期节目分析过）。但在这么本催眠读物里，我要先读这段：作者先提到德瑞克·布拉斯伯格（她这次倒没写错），去年夏天传闻说德瑞克在阿曼甘塞特别墅作客时半夜逃离，因为...他把床弄脏了，连张字条都没留就沿着蒙托克公路溜了。

The only passage, by the way, that's relevant for our purposes at the nerve, it goes to one a Amy Griffin, who I think I think her claims are specious at best. Those claims that are in the tell, we addressed again in a recent episode, but I'm going to read the passage in this otherwise snooze of a book about well, okay. So this graph first goes to Derek Blasberg, who she does clock accurately in here, and he is the guy who, last summer, Gwyneth was reportedly spreading the word that, Derek had been a guest at her house in Amagansett and had fled in the middle of the night after literally shitting the bed, and he left a mess for the maids to clean up and didn't leave a note or apparently even send a text giving a heads up. Fled like a thief in the night down Montauk Highway. Okay.

格温妮丝承认：'初见德瑞克时我很怀疑，心想你是专职的名人跟班吧？'（没错他就是）书中接着写：'当时格温妮丝的圈子还包括对冲基金大亨约翰·格里芬的妻子艾米·格里芬，其公司G9投资了Goop。'

When I first met him, meaning Derek, I was a little dubious, Gwyneth admitted. I was like, are you a professional friend of celebrities? Yes. That's my aside. Anyway, Gwyneth the the the author then goes on to say Gwyneth Gwyneth's circle around this time also included Amy Griffin, wife of billionaire hedge fund founder John Griffin, whose firm g nine also invested in goop.

格温妮丝起初告诉朋友，格里芬是她'追随者'，'想成为我'。艾米要是听到这段该多精彩，你明白这是真的。但后来她疏远别人，反倒和格里芬走近了。

At first, Gwyneth told friends Griffin was one of her, quote, disciples and, quote, wants to be me. I hope Amy Griffin is listening. So good. You know it's true. But then she moved closer to Griffin and distance from others.

毕竟艾米是Goop大金主嘛，你懂的。顺便揭秘下这种未经授权的名人传记运作模式：出版前六个月，作者要和营销部开会——

Well, you know, Amy is a big a big, investor in goop. So, you know, that's how that works. Okay. I also wanna give you guys just a little peek behind the curtain as to how most of this stuff works, especially when it comes to unauthorized celebrity biographies. So what the the author will have a meeting with sales and marketing about six months before the publication.

他们会问：'有什么爆炸性新料？我们要把首刊权卖给《人物》杂志，争取让你上《CBS周日早间》《观点》或《今日秀》——现在主流媒体渠道太少，能挤进去很难。'

And they will say to the author, what are the headlines? What's the stuff that nobody knew before? And that's the stuff we're going to try to plant as a first serial in, like, a meaning, like, a serial edition in, like, a People magazine. We're gonna try to get you booked on CBS Sunday Morning or The View or the Today you know, one of the very like, there are very few mainstream media outlets left you can go to. So to get in is, like, is really hard.

所以除非内容重磅，否则只能靠噱头上头条。《人物》杂志用了三四页图文报道后，这本书就被榨干了——真的什么都不剩。

And so usually what happens is unless you are bringing something really weighty to your subject matter, it's gonna be the flashy stuff that gets the headlines and and the the first serial in People magazine, which I believe was, like, three or four pages, like, with art. And, that's it. And and and and they stripped this book for those parts. There's nothing else in this book. Nothing.

这真的让我很生气，因为这完全是在抢钱。你懂吗？就像前几天，格温妮丝这件事突然开始疯传。她的前夫是酷玩乐队的克里斯·马丁，最近因为那对搞外遇的天文学家夫妇上了新闻——后来他们被开除、解雇、辞职，反正就是走人了。所以我敢打赌是那位天文学家去找她，然后他们一起策划了这个。

It just makes me angry because it's such a money grab. You know? It's like anyway, so Gwyneth, just the other day, this started going viral. You know, her ex husband is Chris Martin of Coldplay, who has found himself in the news cycle over the astronomer couple who are having an affair and have since been fired, let go, resigned, whatever. And so, I I bet astronomer went to her, and they came up with this.

看看吧。

Take a look.

感谢您对Astronomer的关注。嗨，我是格温妮丝·帕特洛。我受聘在非常临时的基础上代表Astronomer 300多名员工发言。过去几天Astronomer收到了很多问题，他们希望我来回答最常见的几个。

Thank you for your interest in Astronomer. Hi. I'm Gwyneth Paltrow. I've been hired on a very temporary basis to speak on behalf of the 300 plus employees at Astronomer. Astronomer has gotten a lot of questions over the last few days, and they wanted me to answer the most common ones.

是的。Astronomer是运行Apache airflow的最佳平台。

Yes. Astronomer is the best place to run Apache airflow.

所以如果你在听的话，那段打字音效伴随的图文内容是：问：OMG。实际WTF。非常可爱。非常聪明。然后我们就看到——这样的格温妮丝很讨喜。你看，这就是我觉得换个更优秀的作者、更聪明的人，坦白说本可以在这里加入些文化批判的地方。

So if you're listening, the question in that little typing, sound accompanying that was a graphic that said q colon underneath o m g period what the actual f. Very cute. Very clever. And then we get so so that's likable Gwyneth. And see, this is where I really think a better author, a smarter one, frankly, would have been able to bring some sort of cultural criticism to bear here.

因为你能看到格温妮丝在这种场合里完全讨喜又风趣，眨眨眼点点头，我们都懂这个玩笑。但转头又能看到上周她在播客做‘问我任何事’时那个让人完全受不了的格温妮丝。有人问：你觉得你丈夫最爱她哪点？接下来请系好安全带。系紧了。

Because you you have a Gwyneth who can be completely likable and funny in something like that and, like, winking and nodding, and we're all in on the joke. And then you get the totally insufferable Gwyneth, who last week was doing an ask me anything for her podcast. And she's asked, what do you think your husband most loves about her? And this is what buckle in. Buckle in.

这段有点长，但我们必须完整播放才能达到效果。以下是他的回答。

This is a little bit of a lengthy segment, but we gotta run it at length for the full effect. This is what we get.

你想看布拉德那段吗？

Did do you wanna see Brad's thing?

哦，他说：说实话我没有最爱的一点。我爱你的每个方面。你身体的美丽，你在空间中移动的姿态，你工作时微微出神的样子，你手掌赋予锅具的魔力，你对荤段子和光滑墙面的热爱，你对艺术的渊博认知，你裸体时的自在和对虚伪之人的厌恶。你撒娇时的模样，你在路上发火的样子。我爱你深夜在床边大口喝水的姿态。

Oh, I honestly don't have a favorite, he said. I truly love every aspect of you. Your physical beauty, the way your body moves through space, the way you disappear a little when you're working, the way your hands add something to a pan, your love of dirty jokes and well plastered walls, how much you know about art that you feel so comfortable naked and hate fake people. When you're needy, when you're angry on the road. I love when you chug water by the bedside at night.

我喜欢你选择忧虑的事物和处理问题的方式。我爱你的晨间习惯，还有你假装我催你出浴时的小剧场（其实我根本没提过）。我爱你膝盖后侧的肌肤和足弓的弧度，爱你在床上戴好保持器后对我微笑的模样。我爱你全力以赴的坚持和屡屡成功的战绩。我的天啊。

I like the things you choose to worry about and how you handle problems. I love your morning routine and when you act like I've been demanding you to get out of the bath when I haven't said a word about it. I love the skin on the back of your knees and the arch of your feet and when you smile at me in bed after you've put in your retainers. I love how hard you try and how often you succeed. Oh my god.

如果你愿意，我可以继续。

I can keep going if you like.

我觉得那段差不多有28秒，很长的一段。也许更长，可能接近一分钟。首先，这家伙显然知道如何维持家庭和睦。

I think that segment was, like, twenty eight seconds. That's a long segment. Maybe longer. Maybe closer to a minute. First of all, this guy clearly knows how to keep the peace at home.

明白吗？你喜欢我什么？他列了一长串清单，包括像粉刷平整的墙壁，以及她在空间中移动身体的样子。你忘了时间这个维度，布拉德。这是她丈夫布拉德·法尔查克说的。

Okay? What do you like about me? He submits a laundry list that includes things like well plastered walls and, like, moving her body moving through space. You forgot time on that continuum, Brad. It's Brad Falchuk, her husband.

我是说，稍微有点自知之明、不那么自恋的人，读到一半就会停下来，觉得这些内容太多了，不该让大家听这些。对吧？我们谁都不想听这些。不过这倒是个性十足的表现，对吧？

I mean, a person with a little more self awareness and a little less narcissism would have stopped less than halfway through that text and said, this is a lot, and I'm not gonna subject you guys to it. Okay? None of us wanna be subjected to that. That is a provocative personality, though. Okay?

这点你得承认她。而这本书给我们的感觉就像读书报告——格温妮丝说了这个，做了那个，然后别人又说了这个做了那个。我不想要总结，我想要能深入咀嚼的内容，所以省省你的钱吧。

You gotta give her that. And in this book, what we get is the equip it's the equivalent of a book report. Gwyneth said this, then she did that, then somebody else said this and did that. I don't want a summary. I want something I can sink my teeth into, so save your money.

感谢收听梅根·凯利秀。不废话，不站队，无所畏惧。

Thanks for listening to the Megyn Kelly show. No BS, no agenda, and no fear.