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这里是iHeart播客《纯人工保证》
This is an iHeart podcast, Guaranteed Human.
嘿，你好
Hey there.
医生
Doctor.
我是杰西·米尔斯
Jesse Mills here.
我是加州大学洛杉矶分校男性健康诊所主任，想向大家介绍我的新播客《邮件室》
I'm the director of the men's clinic at UCLA, and I wanna tell you about my new podcast called The Mail Room.
我是乔丹，这档节目的制作人
And I'm Jordan, the show's producer.
和大多数男性一样，我已经很久没去看医生了
And like most guys, I haven't been to the doctor in
实在太久了
way too long.
我会
I'll be
提出那些我们本该问却一直没问的问题。
asking the questions we probably should be asking but aren't.
每周我们都会深入探讨男性健康领域，从睾酮水平、健身到饮食和生育能力。
Every week, we're breaking down the world of men's health from testosterone and fitness to diets and fertility.
我们将用通俗易懂的方式聊科学，为你真正好奇的问题找到真实答案。
We'll talk science without the jargon and get your real answers to the stuff you actually wonder about.
所以请在iHeartRadio应用、Apple播客或你获取喜爱节目的任何平台关注《邮件室》。
So check out the mail room on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your favorite shows.
大家好啊？
What up, y'all?
我是你们的老铁舞台凯。
It's your boy, Kev on stage.
我想告诉你
I wanna tell you
关于我的新播客《并非我的高光时刻》，我在节目中与那些我钦佩的艺术家、运动员、艺人、创作者、朋友等取得巨大成功的人士，畅谈他们遭遇的重大失败。
about my new podcast called not my best moment where I talk to artists, athletes, entertainers, creators, friends, people I admire who had massive success about their massive failures.
他们搞砸了什么？
What did they mess up on?
他们经历过怎样的心碎，又从中汲取了什么教训？
What is their heartbreak, and what did they learn from it?
我被评委批得体无完肤。
I got judged horribly.
评委们直接说：你就是垃圾。
The judges were like, you're trash.
难道我不知道你是怎么入选节目的吗？
Don't I know how you got on the show.
在iHeartRadio应用、苹果播客、YouTube或任何你收听播客的平台，关注我和Kev主持的《并非我的高光时刻》。
Check out not my best moment with me kept on stage on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.
你是否曾听过那些真实犯罪节目后，发现自己疑问比答案还多？
Have you ever listened to those true crime shows and found yourself with more questions than answers?
谁会冒充整座城市的人？
Who catfishes a city?
吸食人类遗骸真的安全吗？
Is it even safe to snort human remains?
这是《浑身是劲》的剧情吗？
Is that the plot of Footloose?
我是喜剧演员罗里·斯考维尔，我要告诉你乔什·迪恩和我新开了一档播客，专门歌颂世界上最蠢罪犯的惊人创意。
I'm comedian Rory Scovel, and I'm here to tell you Josh Dean and I have a new podcast that celebrates the amazing creativity of the world's dumbest criminals.
节目名叫《无罪之罪》，是一档真实犯罪喜剧播客。
It's called Crimeless, a true crime comedy podcast.
你可以在iHeartRadio应用、苹果播客或任何你收听播客的平台找到我们。
Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
我知道他名声在外，但迟早会自食恶果。
I know he has a reputation, but it's gonna catch up to him.
加布·奥尔蒂斯是个警察。
Gabe Ortiz is a cop.
他的兄弟拉里，一个加布直到为时已晚才想解开的谜团。
His brother Larry, a mystery Gabe didn't wanna solve until it was too late.
他是这个帮派的首领。
He was the head of this gang.
你愿意为这个事业冒险吗？
You gonna push that line for the cause?
把我们收为门徒，向我们展示了所谓的'游戏规则'。
Took us under his wing and showed us the game, as they call it.
当拉里被杀后，加布必须揭开一段危险的往事，这段往事可能摧毁他所有的认知。
When Larry's killed, Gabe must untangle a dangerous past, one that could destroy everything he thought he knew.
请在iHeartRadio应用、Apple播客或任何你获取播客的平台收听《奥蒂兹兄弟》。
Listen to the Brothers Ortiz on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
大家好，欢迎回到《二十岁的心理学》，在这档播客中我们将探讨二十多岁面临的人生重大转变及其心理意义。
Hello, everybody, and welcome back to the psychology of your twenties, the podcast where we talk through some of the big life changes and transitions of our twenties and what they mean for our psychology.
大家好。
Hello, everybody.
欢迎回到节目。
Welcome back to the show.
欢迎回到播客，无论你是新听众、老听众，还是身处世界哪个角落。
Welcome back to the podcast, new listeners, old listeners, wherever you are in the world.
非常高兴你们能回来收听新一期节目，我们将继续解析二十多岁的心理世界。
It is so great to have you here back for another episode as we, of course, break down the psychology of our twenties.
我对今天的节目特别期待，因为内容和我们平时有点不同。
I am so very excited for today's episode because it's a little bit different from our usual content.
可以说这期节目在某种程度上把我两个播客的特色结合起来了。
It kind of marries, I would say, my two podcasts together in a way.
如果你们不知道，我还有另一个叫《真言》的播客，我把它形容为《二十多岁心理学》的精神小妹版。
If you guys didn't know, I have another podcast called Mantra, which I describe as like the spiritual little sister of the psychology of your twenties.
我们会深入探讨这里谈到的很多话题，但会从更哲学的角度出发。
We go in-depth into a lot of the stuff we talk about here, but from a more philosophical perspective.
虽然对某些人来说可能有点玄乎，但我真的很喜欢那种额外的深度，以及那些对话中的微妙之处，它们能带来新的视角。
And you know, it may be a little bit woo woo for some, but I really like having that added depth and, like, the nuances of those conversations to kinda give things a new angle.
今天我们将深入探讨这个领域，从占星学和灵性的角度来审视我们的二十多岁，当然仍会保持科学的视角。
And today, we're kind of diving more into that realm and taking a more kind of astrological spiritual take on our twenties, but of course, still with, like, a scientific lens to it.
我们要讨论的这个概念，如果你已接近三十岁或正处于二十多岁后期，可能之前就听说过。
We are talking about an idea that if you are in your late twenties, maybe on the brink of 30, you have heard about before.
这就是土星回归的概念。
It is the idea of Saturn's return.
关于土星回归这个概念，首先，很多听众都向我提出过这个问题。
So this concept of Saturn returns, firstly, so many of you have asked me for this question.
其次，这个概念现在确实很热门。
But secondly, it's really having a moment.
它在流行文化中频繁出现，特别是在歌曲中。
It comes up so much in pop culture, especially in songs.
比如剪刀姐妹乐队的歌曲《土星土星》。
You know, Scissor's song, Saturn Saturn.
我想歌名应该就叫《土星》。
I think it's just called Saturn.
凯西·马斯格罗夫的歌曲《更深的井》
Casey Musgrove's song, Deeper Well.
我知道爱莉安娜·格兰德的新专辑里有首歌是关于这个的
I know Ariana Grande has a song about it on her new album.
在这些歌曲中，艺术家们都在讲述这个他们各自独特经历的关键时刻——在27、28、29岁时，生活突然给了他们当头一棒，人生轨迹彻底转向
And in each of these songs, you know, these artists talk about this pivotal moment that they've each uniquely experienced in which at 27, 28, 29, their lives just suddenly shocked them and kind of just completely did one eighty.
对于这个年龄段的人来说，经历一场巨大且完全无法预知的人生转折其实是相当普遍的
It's actually a rather common experience for people at this age to just go through a magnificent, completely unpredictable life shift.
如果你相信这个理论，这是我们每个人都必须经历的阶段
And if you believe the theory, it is something that actually all of us must go through.
我们都会以某种形式经历这种体验
All of us are gonna have some form of this experience.
土星回归的概念源自占星学
The idea of Saturn returns comes from astrology.
它本质上是一个占星事件——当土星这颗行星运行到你出生时的相同位置时，恰逢你告别二十多岁、步入三十岁的阶段
It basically represents a astrological event whereby Saturn, the planet, returns to its same position as when you were born right as you exit your twenties and enter your thirties.
根据这个理论，正是这个原因带来了如此多独特的转变。
And that's what brings, according to this theory, so many unique shifts.
分手、失去、新的职业道路、重大的身份转变，所有这些都可能是我们在这个阶段会经历的。
Breakups, loss, new career pathways, major identity shifts, all these things are what we can expect from this period.
但当然，正如往常一样，这些事件不可避免的背后也有心理学解释需要我们探讨。
But there is, of course, as always, a psychological explanation to the inevitability of these events that we also need to discuss.
所以今天，我将从心理学角度分析土星回归这个激动人心的篇章。
So today, I'm gonna offer this psychological breakdown and psychological perspective on the return of Saturn on this exciting chapter.
你可以期待什么，为什么一切突然改变，发展角度的解释，科学角度的解释。
What you can expect, why everything suddenly changes, the developmental explanation, the scientific one.
最重要的是，对于那些正在经历这个阶段的人，如何充分利用这个时期，如何度过这个阶段。
And most importantly, for those of you going through it right now, how to make the most out of this period, how to get through this.
我们还会讨论这个概念的历史。
We're also gonna talk about the history of the concept.
我们将探讨罗马和希腊神话。
We're gonna talk about Roman and Greek mythology.
我知道很多有趣的事情和那些成功度过这一阶段的人们的故事，还有更多内容要分享。
I know so many fun things And stories of people who have made it out on the other side, plus so much more.
所以即使你认为占星学不适合你，相信我，我也持怀疑态度。
So even if you don't think that astrology is for you, believe me, I'm also very skeptical.
但我确实认为你会惊讶于这些内容可能有多少会与你的生活相关，以及你可能学到的东西。
I do think that you'll be surprised by how much of this might just apply to your life and what you might learn.
那么闲话少说，让我们深入探讨土星回归的心理学意义。
So without further ado, let's dive into the psychology of Saturn's return.
好的。
Okay.
让我们先把简单的内容说完。
So let's get the simple stuff out of the way.
什么是土星回归？
What is a Saturn return?
我已经给出了一个简单的解释，但土星回归基本上是指土星回到你出生时它在天空中的位置。
I've kind of already given a very light explanation, but Saturn return is basically when the planet Saturn circles back to the same position in the sky that it occupied the moment that you were born.
由于土星绕太阳公转一周大约需要27到30年，你的土星回归期通常发生在27至30岁左右。
Now because Saturn roughly takes about twenty seven to thirty years to complete an orbit around the sun, your Saturn return tends to land at around 27 to 30.
有人说可能会更早，比如26岁就发生。
Some people say earlier can happen at 26.
根据出生时间的不同，也可能延迟到31岁才发生。
It can happen up to thirty one depending on when you were born.
而且它并非只发生在某一瞬间。
And it doesn't just happen in one moment.
不是短短一秒钟的事。
It's not just like a second.
这是一个季节。
It is a season.
有时这个季节会持续两到三年之久。
It is a season that sometimes stretches two to three years.
这是一个逐渐积累又突然爆发的历程，某种程度上会摧毁我们的生活，但有时却是为了更好的未来。
It is a process of buildup and fallout that kind of decimates our lives in a way, but sometimes for the best.
土星回归，实际上你不仅会经历一次。
Saturn return, you don't actually just have one.
有些人可能会经历三次。
You some people could have three.
大多数人会经历大约两次。
Most people have about two.
在58到60岁左右，你会再次经历一次。
Around the age of 58 to 60, you experience another one again.
然后在80到90岁左右，如果你足够幸运，可能会经历最后一次。
And then around the age of 80 to 90, if you're lucky enough, is when you'll experience perhaps your final one.
据说每次回归都标志着人生新阶段的开始。
Each return is said to mark a new kind of stage in life.
第一次是真正步入成年期的转变。
The first one is the shift into true adulthood.
第二次是步入长者智慧的转变，第三次则是进入传承阶段的转变。
The second is the shift into elder wisdom, and the third is the shift into legacy.
在这些时期会发生许多变化。
And a lot will change during these periods.
我们了解流行文化中对土星回归的提及，但从历史上看，这种周期的记载可以追溯到古罗马和希腊占星术，在那里土星或希腊的克洛诺斯不仅仅是一颗行星，它是一位代表纪律、限制、边界和时间本身的神。
So we know the pop culture references to Saturn returns, but historically, references to this cycle go way back to ancient Roman and Greek astrology where Saturn or Cronus in Greece wasn't just a planet, it was a god that represented discipline, restriction, boundaries, and time itself.
土星神还代表着农业、财富、季节和狂欢。
The god Saturn also represented agriculture, wealth, the seasons, partying.
所以他身兼多职。
So he had a lot of hats.
他身兼多职。
He had a lot of hats.
但从占星学角度看，土星被认为是类似监工的行星。
But astrologically, the planet of Saturn is considered kind of a taskmaster planet.
监工行星——在研究这期节目之前我并不知道——基本上象征着因果业力的课程。
So a taskmaster planet, I didn't know this before researching this episode, basically signifies karmic lessons.
这颗行星负责或影响着我们如何面对自身局限、如何面对现实、如何面对那些我们可能逃避过的事物。
It's a planet that's responsible or influences how we face our limits, how we face reality, how we face the things that we perhaps avoided.
因此在占星术语中，土星回归意味着你二十多岁建立的人生框架将面临考验，你需要直面这些结构。
And so in astrology speak, Saturn return, all of this comes to this point whereby you confront the structures that you've built in your twenties, and you are tested on them.
你必须判断这些框架是真正属于你的，还是从他人期待中借来的。
And you have to determine whether they are truly yours or they are borrowed from other people's expectations.
这就是为什么我们会感觉生活仿佛分崩离析。
And this is why our life feels like it kind of falls apart.
即使表面不明显，你的生活也即将发生改变。
Even if it's not noticeable, things are going to change for you.
这是成年的必经之路。
It is a coming of age.
实际上这是个转危为机的契机，能让你创造更符合深层目标与人生使命的生活。
And it's actually an opportunity to put a positive spin on it, to create a life that really aligns with your deeper purpose and your deeper goals.
现代对土星及土星回归的普及始于二十世纪，尤其是1960-70年代占星学热潮期间，当时通灵、塔罗牌、算命等产业爆发式增长。
So the modern popularization of Saturn and Saturn returns really started in the twentieth century, particularly with the boom of astrology in the nineteen sixties and seventies when psychics, tarot cards, fortune tellers, like that industry exploded.
过去十年这种现象确实经历了复兴，一方面归功于流行文化，另一方面社交媒体让人们开始用这个标签命名这种经历。
It's definitely had a renaissance though in the past decade, obviously, due to pop culture, but also due to social media where people have started to name this experience using this label.
这确实让许多人在接近三十岁时所经历的混乱找到了合理的解释。
And it's really validated for a lot of people the chaos that they have come to experience or are experiencing in their late twenties.
也许土星回归只是对我们正在经历之事的一种隐喻。
Maybe Saturn Returns is just a metaphor for the things that we are enduring.
让我们把视角拉远一点。
Let's zoom out a little bit.
为什么我们如此被这种解释所吸引？
Why are we so drawn to this explanation?
为什么我们总体上会喜欢占星术、数字命理学、周期论、命运论或人生如四季这类解释？
Why do we like explanations like this in general of astrology, of numerology, of cycles, of fate, or the idea that life comes in seasons?
因为这正是它的本质。
Because that's what this really is.
首先，我们喜欢土星回归这类概念的原因是，人类天生就是寻求意义的生物。
First off, the reason that we like the idea of a Saturn returns or anything of this sort is that we are meaning making creatures.
在充满不确定性的时期——比如二十多岁的成年初期——拥有一个认知框架确实能让我们感到安心。
When things are uncertain, like early adulthood, like our twenties, having a framework can really soothe us.
无论框架多么随意，它们确实能提供一种心理上的安全感，以及我们可以赖以生存的叙事。
Frameworks, however arbitrary, they do actually provide a psychological feeling of safety and a narrative by which we can live.
我们喜欢模式，因为它们给予我们掌控感。
We like patterns because they give us a sense of control.
即便生活显得糟糕可怕，你也能想着：好吧。
Even if life feels terrible and scary, you can feel like, okay.
也许此刻发生这些事，正是因为有人给我的这个解释。
Well, maybe this is supposed to happen right now because of this explanation that someone is giving me.
这就是为什么我们对这些体系的信仰往往在二十多岁时增强——那时我们极度渴望结构化的外部体系，来解释为何生活总是起起落落。
And that is why our belief in these systems actually does tend to increase in our twenties when we are desperate in in many ways for structured external systems and explanations for why life is, like, hitting all of these ups and downs.
心理学中甚至有个完整的分支专门研究这种意义构建，称为叙事心理学。
There is literally a whole field of psychology dedicated to this idea of meaning making, and it's called narrative psychology.
这个领域基本认为：人类的身份认同、我们对世界及周遭环境的理解，都是通过故事和我们讲述给自己的故事构建的。
This field basically says that humans' identities and our understanding of the world and the world around us, like, is constructed through stories and the stories we tell ourselves.
你如何经历分手，将取决于你对自己恋爱关系的故事叙述。
How you experience a breakup will be determined by the story of your relationship.
你与兄弟姐妹的关系是由你童年的故事决定的。
How you relate to your siblings is determined by the story of your childhood.
你对待风险的方式取决于那些关于风险真正含义、我们需要经历什么、星座或宇宙在向我们传达什么的故事或民间传说。
How you approach risk is determined by stories or folk stories of what this really means and what we need to go through and what the stars are telling us or what the universe is telling us.
从这个角度看，占星学是一种象征性的叙事体系，为我们提供了极具意义的人生剧本。
In this way, astrology is a symbolic storytelling system, which provides us with a really meaningful narrative for life.
无论它是否真实——我不会对此下任何定论——其实这根本不重要。
Whether it is real or not, like, I'm not gonna make any statements either way, it doesn't actually matter.
它是否真实并不重要。
It doesn't matter if it's real.
重要的是它给我们带来的慰藉。
It's the comfort that it provides us.
在我看来，那些真正来自星空或星座的东西更像是额外的馈赠。
And anything that, you know, is real that comes from that or that comes from the stars is kinda just a bonus in my mind.
那么让我们来聊聊土星回归期间通常会发生什么吧。
So let's talk about what actually tends to happen in this Saturn return season.
因为占星学的解释是一回事，但这一切背后还有非常坚实的心理学基础。
Because the astrological explanation is one thing, but there is also very solid psychological side to all of this.
而这就是为什么理解'初显成人期'这个概念变得尤为重要。
And that's where this idea of emerging adulthood becomes important to understand.
杰弗里·阿奈特是一位发展心理学家。
Jeffrey Arnott, he is a developmental psychologist.
他创造了'初显成人期'这个术语，基本上是用来描述18岁到29岁之间的时期。
He coined the term emerging adulthood to basically describe the period between 18 and 29.
对很多人来说这是个过渡阶段——你不再是青少年，但也还没有完全进入大众认知中的成年状态。
That is for a lot of people an in between stage where you are not a teenager anymore, but you may not be fully settled into what most people think of as adulthood either.
在这个阶段，由于期望值的变化、大脑发育的进程，以及外部环境等因素，我们身上会发生一些变化。
Now at this stage, a few things start to happen to us because of changing expectations, because of how our brain is developing, because of, you know, external things.
主要是我们开始觉得需要更认真地对待'成为成年人'这件事，但同时仍有许多未解的疑问和需要学习的东西。
Mainly, we start to feel like we need to get more serious about this adult thing, but also we still have a lot of unanswered questions and things that we need to learn.
这两种现实——求知的需求与未知的状态——开始相互碰撞。
And those two truths, the need to know and the not knowing, start to clash against each other.
我们先来谈谈这种困惑对我们人际关系的影响。
Let's start with the impact of this confusion on our relationships.
对许多人来说，二十多岁时人际关系——尤其是恋爱关系——成为这一阶段的核心焦点。
For a lot of people, relationships are at the front and center of this period in their twenties, romantic ones especially.
你会看到这种情况经常发生，我自己也屡见不鲜。
You will see this happening, and I have seen this happening quite regularly.
比如你可能从22岁就和某人在一起，到了28岁却发现，这个人已经不再像刚开始约会时那样与你契合了。
You know, you might have been with someone since you were 22, and by 28, you know, you're realizing that a person, this person isn't quite the same match to you as you were when you first started dating.
这就是为什么这个年龄段的分手如此普遍。
This is why breakups around this age is so common.
你正处于这样一个转折点。
You're kind of at this turning point.
要么我们承诺共度余生，要么抓住二十多岁最后的单身时光或寻找新伴侣的机会，感觉这就是我们必须做出决定的时刻。
Either we commit and we make this for the rest of our lives, or we have this opportunity to really have our last moment of being single in our twenties or find someone new, and it feels like this is the point where we have to decide.
我随便就能想到四个人——仅过去一年里，他们都在即将30岁时结束了四年以上的恋情。
I can think of literally four people off the top of my head who I know who have broken up with their partner of four plus years right before they turned 30 in the past year alone.
这是一个非常普遍的现象。
It is a huge phenomena.
心理学家甚至追踪这一理论，能够观察到二十多岁后期关系解体的模式，他们认为许多长期关系要么在此阶段结束，要么传统地过渡到婚姻状态，这实际上是人们一个相当正常的转折点。
Psychologists even track this theory and can track this pattern of relationship dissolution in the late twenties, and they suggest that many long term relationships either end or tradition transition into marriage during this period, and it's actually quite a normal turning point for people.
这是人们最可能分道扬镳的常见时期之一。
It's one of the most common times and time periods when people are likely to split up and to go their own way.
所以如果你在二十多岁末期或土星回归期经历了一场天崩地裂的分手，这其实并不罕见，而且很可能说明你在这个时刻做出决定是件好事。
So if you have been through a really seismic, terrible, life shattering breakup at the end of your twenties or during your Saturn return, it's actually not that uncommon and it's actually probably a good thing that you have made this decision at this moment.
另一个非常著名的理论来自埃里克·埃里克森。
Another really famous theory comes from Erik Eriksen.
我们经常讨论他。
We talk about him a lot.
他是一位德裔美国精神分析学家。
He's a German American psychoanalyst.
他认为这种现象发生的原因在于，我们此时正经历着所谓'亲密vs孤立'的发展阶段。
And he says that the reason this happens is because we are moving through what we call an intimacy versus isolation stage of development at this point in time.
当我们步入二十多岁的尾声时，确实会开始形成更加稳固的自我认知和身份认同。
So as we enter our late twenties, we do start to develop a much more secure sense of self and identity.
这是我们所有人都期待的事情，随着年龄增长。
It's something that we all look forward to, you know, the older we get.
我们更了解自己了。
We know ourselves more.
这种新获得的自我意识，正是开始暴露那些年轻时可能被容忍或忽视的根本性不兼容之处的原因。
This newfound self awareness, that is what begins to expose fundamental incompatibilities that were maybe tolerated or overlooked when you were younger.
你可能曾围绕这个伴侣或这个人构建了自己的身份认同，或者曾共同经历过某些事情。
You may have built your identity around this partner or this person or may have been something together.
但随着你更深入地认识自己，随着岁月流逝建立起独立的身份认同，你会意识到：这个人不适合我。
But as you have found yourself more, as you have created your own independent identity just by aging, you realize, like, this person isn't for me.
你需要空间。
You need space.
你可能最终需要分手。
You may ultimately need to break up.
同样地，你知道，结婚或安定下来的期望变得更强烈了，我认为你也开始需要回答一些非常存在主义的问题。
As as well, you know, the expectation to get married or settled down becomes louder, I think you also start to have to answer some very existential questions.
比如，我余生想要以这种方式被爱吗？
Like, do I wanna be loved this way for the rest of my life?
如果爱情永远只是这样，这足够吗？
If this is all that love will ever be, is this enough?
说真的，你现在就需要回答这个问题。
And by golly gosh, like, you need to answer that question now.
我知道这会带来一种末日将至的感觉，一种字面意义上的恐惧，但这是你必须面对的，以免最终陷入这些困境。
And I know it creates such a sense of impending doom and such a sense of, like, literal terror, but it's required of you so that you don't end up in these situations.
我们经常看到人们处于无爱的婚姻中，或是与多年前就知道不适合的人在一起，到了多年后只希望自己在28岁时就及时止损——这么说可能显得很冷酷。
We see all the time of people in loveless marriages or with people they really knew they weren't meant to be with years and years down the line wishing that at 28, they just cut their losses to sound completely callous.
这不仅仅是浪漫关系的问题。
It's not just romantic relationships.
友情在这个阶段也会发生重大转变。
Friendships shift in big ways during this time as well.
还记得在青少年时期甚至二十出头时，友谊仿佛是与生俱来的。
Remember how in your teens and even early twenties, friendships were like they were inbuilt.
对吧？
Right?
你几乎不需要刻意维系。
You didn't really have to try.
那确实建立在便利的基础上。
It was definitely from a place of convenience.
学校、室友、共同的经历、相同的爱好。
School, roommates, shared experiences, shared hobbies.
你总能找到志同道合的人。
You could always find someone there.
但随着年龄增长，当我们搬家、工作、恋爱、生子时，友谊突然需要真正有意识的维护了。
As we get older, as we move, as we take up jobs, as we couple up, as we have kids, friendships suddenly require a real intentional maintenance.
许多人到了二十五六岁、二十七八岁时，会发现自己的人际关系已悄然流失，环顾四周才惊觉：啊，已经没人留在身边了。
And a lot of people will hit the mid twenties, late twenties mark, having had people fall off kind of in trickles for a while and look around and be like, oh, there's no one left.
我感到深深的孤独。
I'm deeply lonely.
最近我自己也有这样的时刻。
Had this moment myself recently.
就像，我经常在播客里谈论孤独，这似乎是我持续不断的战斗。
Like, I feel like I talk about loneliness a lot on the podcast and it's been like an ongoing, you know, battle with me.
但我刚刚经历了这样一个时刻：我的许多朋友都移居海外了。
But I just had this moment where a lot of my friends have moved overseas.
过去六个月里，我有三位最好的朋友都搬到了国外。
Like, three of my best friends have moved overseas in the last six months.
我当时就想，哇，我的朋友圈和人脉网络比以前单薄多了。
And I was like, wow, my my friendship circle and my network is a lot thinner than it used to.
这让人非常恐慌。
And there's a lot of panic in that.
会忍不住想：我难道想让情况一直这样下去吗？
There's a lot of panic in being like, do I want it to remain this way?
还是我应该尝试做些改变？
Or do I wanna do something try things to change that?
再次强调，研究数据一致支持这个观点。
Again, the research consistently backs this up.
例如，在一项涵盖270多项研究的综合分析中，研究人员发现社交网络规模通常会随着年龄增长而缩小。
For example, in a meta analysis of over 270 studies, researchers found that on average, social networks decrease in size as people age.
最急剧的下降就发生在现在这个阶段——青年晚期，也就是我们二十七八岁到三十出头的时期。
The steepest decline occurs at this point right now in young adulthood, in our late twenties, early thirties.
这背后有很多客观原因，但简单来说，我们的生活普遍变得更忙碌了。
There's a lot of circumstantial reasons for this, but basically, if we think about it, our lives generally get busier.
通常我们觉得能合理投入友谊的精力会大幅减少。
And typically, like, the effort that we feel we can reasonably put into our friendships becomes a lot smaller.
这就是为什么你的朋友变少了。
And it's why you have less friends.
这就是为什么你可能会感到非常孤独。
It's why you might find yourself being very lonely.
但这并不意味着这种情况会持续下去，成为你余生的常态。
Now it doesn't mean that that's, like, gonna happen and be the way for the rest of your life.
我认为这又是一次警醒。
I think it is again the wake up call.
我想在未来五十年都这样生活吗？
Do I want to live like this for the next fifty years?
好的。
Okay.
我们稍作休息，回来后我们将讨论家庭话题。
We're gonna take a short break here, but when we come back, we're gonna talk family.
我们将讨论职业发展。
We're gonna talk career.
我们将探讨身份认同，以及如何度过土星回归的动荡期。
We're gonna talk identity, and also how to overcome the tumultuous period of your Saturn return.
请继续关注。
Stay with us.
你有没有听过那些真实犯罪节目，结果发现疑问比答案还多？
Have you ever listened to those true crime shows and found yourself with more questions than answers?
这是什么？
And what is this?
这怎么会是个我们都不了解的故事呢？
How is that not a story we all know?
等等，这是什么？你在哪里看到的？
What what's this you where is that?
为什么是湿的？
Why is it wet?
朋友们，我们有个节目特别适合你。
Boy, do we have a show for you.
由Smartless Media、Campsite Media和Big Money Players联合出品，带来《无罪可诉》。
From smartless media, campsite media, and big money players comes Crimeless.
和我——调查记者乔什·迪恩一起参与。
Join me, Josh Dean, investigative journalist.
还有我，喜剧演员罗里·斯科维尔，让我们一起庆祝世界上最愚蠢罪犯们惊人的创造力。
And me, Rory Scovel, comedian, as we celebrate the amazing creativity of the world's dumbest criminals.
我们将深入调查人们违法的一些最愚蠢方式。
We'll look into some of the silliest ways folks have broken the laws.
说实话，这感觉更像是个高级恶作剧而非犯罪。
Honestly, it feels more like a high level prank than a crime.
谁会冒充整座城市进行网络诈骗？
Who catfishes a city?
并认识一些令人难忘的反英雄角色。
And meet some memorable antiheroes.
那里有成千上万愤怒又饥渴的猴子。
There are thousands of angry horny monkeys.
如果你认为她是女巫就鼓掌，这让你毛骨悚然。
Clap if you think she's a witch, and it freaks you out.
他有X光透视能力。
He has X-ray vision.
我怎能不跟随她呢？
How could I not follow her?
说实话，我得跟着他。
I honestly, I gotta follow him.
他能看穿我的一切。
He can see right through me.
在iHeartRadio应用、Apple Podcasts或任何你获取播客的地方收听《Crimeless》。
Listen to Crimeless on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
父亲坚信魔鬼正在攻击我们。
Dad had the strong belief that the devil was attacking us.
两兄弟，一个虔诚的家庭，两条截然不同的道路。
Two brothers, one devout household, two radically different paths.
加布·奥尔蒂斯成为了德克萨斯州最高级别的执法官员之一。
Gabe Ortiz became one of the highest ranking law enforcement officers in Texas.
总计三十二年的执法经验。
Thirty two years total law enforcement experience.
但他的兄弟拉里却留在原地，建立了完全不同的遗产。
But his brother Larry, he stayed behind and built an entirely different legacy.
他是这个帮派的首领，没人能对他指手画脚。
He was the head of this gang and nobody was gonna tell him what to do.
你会为了这个事业突破界限。
You're gonna push that line for the cause.
收我们为徒，向我们展示了他们所谓的'游戏规则'。
Took us under his wing and showed us the game, as they call it.
当拉里遇害时，加布被迫直面他试图逃避的过去，并揭开了他从未预料到的秘密。
When Larry is murdered, Gabe is forced to confront the past he tried to leave behind and uncover secrets he never saw coming.
我父亲有着我们完全不知道的另一面人生。
My dad had a whole another life that we never knew about.
当时我妈妈开始尖叫着我爸爸的名字，然后我就听到了一声枪响。
Like, my mom started screaming my dad's name, and I just heard one gunshot.
《奥尔蒂斯兄弟》是一个关于信仰、家庭的扣人心弦的真实故事，讲述了两个生命如何渐行渐远，又以最惨烈的方式发生碰撞。
The Brothers Ortiz is a gripping true story about faith, family, and how two lives can drift so far apart and collide in the most devastating way.
请在iHeartRadio应用、Apple播客或您获取播客的任何平台收听《奥蒂兹兄弟》。
Listen to The Brothers Ortiz on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
嘿，你好。
Hey there.
我是杰西·米尔斯医生。
Doctor Jesse Mills here.
我是UCLA健康男性诊所的主任，想向您介绍我的新播客《邮件室》。
I'm the director of the men's clinic at UCLA Health, and I wanna tell you about my new podcast called The Mailroom.
我是乔丹，这档节目的制作人。
And I'm Jordan, the show's producer.
和很多男性一样，我已经很多年没去看过医生了。
And like a lot of guys, I haven't been to the doctor in many years.
我将提出那些我们本该问却从未开口的问题。
I'll be asking the questions we probably should be asking but aren't.
因为男人们通常只有在脸皮快掉下来或者骨折时才会去看医生。
Because guys usually don't go to the doctor unless a piece of their face is hanging off or they've broken a bone.
要看是哪根骨头。
Depends which bone.
哇。
Wow.
确实如此。
That's true.
每周我们都会剖析男性健康这个独特领域，从睾酮水平、健身到饮食、生育能力，以及卧室里发生的那些事。
Every week, we're breaking down the unique world of men's health from testosterone and fitness to diets and fertility and things that happen in the bedroom.
你是指睡觉吗？
You mean sleep?
对。
Yeah.
差不多吧，乔丹。
Something like that, Jordan.
我们将用通俗易懂的语言探讨科学，为你真正好奇的问题提供真实答案。
We'll talk science without the jargon and get you real answers to the stuff you actually wonder about.
无论你是27岁、97岁，还是介于两者之间，都会很有趣。
It's gonna be fun whether you're 27, 97, or somewhere in between.
《男士健康》不仅仅关乎六块腹肌和营养补充剂。
Men's Health is about more than six packs and supplements.
它关乎能量、自信和人际关系。
It's about energy, confidence, and connection.
我们不仅希望你活得更久。
We don't just want you to live longer.
我们希望你活得更好。
We want you to live better.
所以请在iHeartRadio应用、苹果播客或你获取喜爱节目的任何平台查看邮件室。
So check out the mail room on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your favorite shows.
大家好啊？
What up, y'all?
我是你们的老伙计凯文，在台上呢。
It's your boy, Kev on stage.
我想告诉你
I wanna tell you
关于我的新播客《并非我的高光时刻》，我会与艺术家、运动员、艺人、创作者、朋友以及我钦佩的那些取得巨大成功的人士，聊聊他们经历过的重大失败。
about my new podcast called not my best moment, where I talk to artists, athletes, entertainers, creators, friends, people I admire who had massive success about their massive failures.
他们搞砸了什么？
What did they mess up on?
他们的心碎时刻是什么？
What is their heartbreak?
他们从中又学到了什么？
And what did they learn from it?
我被评委们狠狠批评了。
I got judged horribly.
评委们说：'你糟透了'。
The judges were like, you're trash.
他们不知道我是怎么入选节目的。
I don't know how you got on the show.
嘘。
Boo.
有人带了西红柿。
Somebody had tomatoes.
不。
No.
我开玩笑的。
I'm kidding.
但他们要是有西红柿的话，肯定会朝我扔过来。
But they if they had tomatoes, they would have thrown the tomatoes.
说实话吧。
Let's be honest.
我们都有过那些宁愿忘记的时刻。
We've all had those moments we'd rather forget.
我们撞到了头。
We bumped our head.
我们犯了个错误
We made a mistake.
交易泡汤了
The deal fell through.
我们很尴尬
We're embarrassed.
我们失败了
We failed.
但这个播客正是关于这些经历以及我们如何渡过难关的
But this podcast is about that and how we made it through.
所以当他们让我坐下时，他们
So when they sat me down, they
就开始闲聊，然后他们直接问：你有什么想法？
were kinda like we got into the small talk, and they were just like, so what do you got?
有什么创意？
What what ideas?
我当时就想，哦，糟了。
And I was like, oh, no.
什么？
What?
在iHeartRadio应用、苹果播客、YouTube或任何你收听播客的平台，关注我和Kev的舞台表现——虽然那不是我最好的时刻。
Check out not my best moment with me, Kev on stage, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.
我们已经讨论了土星回归给我们的恋爱关系和友情带来的变化。
So we've talked about the changes that Saturn Return brings up for our relationships and for our friendships.
而家庭关系以及这个人生阶段中动态变化，可能会爆发成一种非常独特的关系形态。
And then there's our family and how shifting dynamics during this period of our life can really explode out into this very unique kind of relationship.
我觉得这方面的影响可能会悄然而至。
I think this one can kinda sneak up on you.
在二十出头时，家庭对你来说可能就像背景噪音。
In your early twenties, I think family is like background noise.
就像，你那时更专注于探索外面的世界。
Like, you're kinda out in the world.
你就像是在过自己的生活。
You're, like, living your own life.
也许你只是偶尔给家里打个电话，节假日回去看看。
Maybe you're, like, calling home once in a while, like, you visit on the holidays.
一个很普遍的现象是，到了二十七八岁左右，家庭角色往往会突然重新回到生活中心，我们就像绕了个轨道，突然又开始在很多方面依赖他们，几乎和小时候一样，特别是在情感方面。
It's a very common thing that around your late twenties, often, like, the role of your family comes rushing back to the front row, and we kind of turn around, do this orbit, and rely on them suddenly almost as much as we did when we were children for a lot of things, especially emotionally.
对很多人来说，这也是开始真正意识到父母正在老去的时候。
For many of us, this is also when the reality of, like, aging parents starts to land.
你会开始注意到一些细节，比如父亲的记忆力在衰退，母亲更容易疲倦，或者在为祖父母庆祝重要生日时突然意识到他们可能时日无多。
Like, you do start to notice little things, like your dad's memory is slipping or your mom gets tired more easily or, you know, you have this moment where you celebrate you celebrate, like, a huge milestone birthday for your grandparents and are like, I don't think they have many years left.
这也是很多人首次经历重大失去的时期。
It's also when a lot of people experience real serious loss.
有些人会更早经历这种痛苦，但多数人是在这个阶段开始失去父母，或是目睹他们健康状况急剧恶化，这迫使你不得不直面生命的脆弱性——不仅是他们的生命，更是存在的本质，以及在有限时光里认真对待每件事、追求真正想要的东西的重要性。
Some people experience it earlier, which is heartbreaking, but I think this is when a lot of people start to lose parents or they start to really see serious declines in their well-being that forces you to reckon not just with, like, the fragility of life and of their lives, but, like, yeah, the fragility of existence and how serious it is to take things seriously and to, like, really go after what you want when time is finite.
这又引出了许多关于存在意义的大问题。
That's a lot of, again, big existential questions.
这一切都回到了我们心底的这种质疑。
All of it is coming back to this this questioning that is, like, in the back of our mind.
对某些人来说，这也是第一次真正体验到照顾他人的滋味。
For some of us as well, this is, like, the first time where you get a real taste of, like, caregiving.
也许你开始帮忙处理账单、预约医生。
Maybe you start helping with bills, with doctor's appointments.
也许你成为了稳定的情感支柱。
Maybe you become, like, a steady emotional support.
这种角色转换会让人感到迷失方向。
And this role reversal can feel disorientating.
对吧？
Right?
其实有个术语叫'孝道成熟期'。
There's actually a phrase called filial maturity.
是叫孝道吗？
Is it filial?
孝悌？
Fililil?
我不知道该怎么发音。
I don't know how to pronounce it.
你知道那种只在书面见过某个词的感觉吗？
You know when you only ever see a word written down?
肯定有人会在评论区纠正我。
Someone's gonna correct me in the comments.
我就用'孝'这个发音吧。
I'm gonna go with filial.
孝道成熟期。
Filial maturity.
它基本上描述的就是这个阶段——成年子女开始像父母照顾他们那样照顾父母，并真正开始把曾经的照顾者看作完整的个体。
And it basically describes this exact stage when, like, the adult child becomes the parent to their parent, and they start to really see their caregivers as whole people.
你知道，你不再抱有他们无所不能的幻想了。
You know, you no longer have that, like, fantasy of them being invincible.
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比如，他们也有极限。
Like, they have limits.
他们也有缺点。
They have flaws.
他们需要你的照顾。
They need you to take care of them.
这真的非常苦乐参半且艰难，因为你必须承认自己正在进入这个新角色——作为一个成年人，可能不得不在某个阶段独自面对这一切，并且必须接受时间流逝、这个人可能不会永远陪伴的事实。
It's really, really bittersweet and very difficult because you have to kind of acknowledge that there's this new role you're entering as this adult who may have to do this alone at some stage and who has to come to terms with the fact that time is passing and this person might not always be there.
但家庭工作不仅仅关乎你的直系亲属和父母。
But family work isn't just about your immediate family and your parents.
还包括当我们开始质疑：我想要自己的家庭吗？
It's also, like, when we start to question, like, do I want my own family?
我想要孩子吗？
Do I want kids?
你懂吗？
You know?
这是你第一次真正可以放空自己。
This is the first time where you can really zone out.
我知道很多人年轻时就有了孩子，但特别是在我们这一代，我感觉二十出头时我们都在高喊'自由'。
And I know a lot of people, like, have children younger, but especially in this generation, I feel like we spend a lot of our early twenties being like, freedom.
耶。
Yay.
比如我要去探索，我要尝试各种新事物。
Like, I'm gonna be exploratory, and I'm gonna just try things out.
而且我试着不要像自己希望或应该的那样严肃对待这一切。
And, like, I'm gonna try and not take this all as seriously as maybe I want to or I should.
我要尽情玩乐，然后到了27岁突然意识到：我需要开始回答一些人生大问题了。
And I'm gonna have fun, and then it's like you get to 27, and you're like, I need to start answering some big questions.
关于是否要孩子，我是否具备为人父母的能力，我是否已经处理好原生家庭问题足以胜任这个角色——这些问题和其他无数事情一样，突然同时砸到你面前。
And whether I want kids, whether I'm capable of being a parent, whether I've dealt with my family shit enough to be good in this role, again, it's like landing straight in your lap along with, like, a million other things all happening at the same time.
这就是为什么土星回归常被称为一个累积的过程。
This is why, like, Saturn Return is often referred to as, like, cumulative process.
对吧？
Right?
不仅仅是分手。
It's not just the breakup.
也不仅仅是友情的破裂。
It's not just the friendship, you know, dissolution.
不只是关于我未来想要什么的大问题。
It's not just the big questions about what do I want for my future.
还有家庭。
It's then family.
还有关于你身份认同的问题。
It's then questions about your identity.
当然，还有韩国。
And, of course, also, Korea.
就像，如果我们不讨论职业身份和工作中的转变，就无法真正讨论土星回归及其对我们的影响。
Like, we cannot talk about Saturn return and what it will do to us if we do not talk about the shifts that we will experience in our professional identity and at work.
这个影响巨大
This one is huge.
二十出头时，我们尝试各种可能，第一份工作、实习、体验不同事物
Again, early twenties, experimentation, first jobs, internships, trying things out.
其实没那么严重
It's not that serious.
但也可能很严重
It might be serious.
并不一定是永久性的
It's not necessarily permanent.
然后就像倒计时开始了，你会突然觉得天啊
Then it's like the clock has been counting down, and you're like, oh my god.
突然间我必须做出决定
Suddenly, I have to make a decision.
试验期结束了
The trial period is over.
我要选择这种生活，还是另谋出路？
Am I going to commit to this life, or am I gonna choose something else?
这真的是我想做的事吗？
Is this what I wanna do?
真的就这样了吗？
Is this really it?
有些人彻底转行，我见过朋友这样做，看着他们转变真是精彩。
Some people pivot completely, and I have seen friends do this and it's been marvelous to watch.
他们重返校园。
They go back to school.
他们开始创业。
They start businesses.
他们追逐创意项目。
They chase creative projects.
另一些人则更加认真，开始加倍努力并考虑攀登企业晋升阶梯。
Others just get more serious, and they start to double down and think about climbing the corporate ladder.
但几乎每个人都会在职业生涯的这个阶段感受到这些：面对困境的无力感、对更多意义的渴求、以及对未来的恐慌。
But almost everyone will feel this at this moment in their career of confronting feelings of feeling stuck, of needing more meaning, of panicking about their future.
《职业行为杂志》的一项研究跟踪了28至30岁左右的年轻人，发现那些对工作最不满意的人，未必从事的是糟糕的工作。
There's actually a study from the Journal of Vocational Behavior that followed people in their late twenties around 28 to 30 and found that those who felt most dissatisfied at work weren't necessarily in bad jobs.
他们中很多人收入颇丰。
A lot of them were making good money.
问题是这些工作与他们逐渐认识到的个人价值观并不匹配。
But it was that these jobs didn't line up with what they were recognizing that they personally valued.
换句话说，他们重视创造力，却只做着追求效率的工作。
In other words, you know, they cared about creativity, but they were only doing a job that cared about efficiency.
他们渴望人生意义，但工作除了提供丰厚薪水外别无他物。
They craved purpose, but, you know, their job only offered a good paycheck and nothing else.
这种错位正是不适感的来源，而且往往在我们这个年纪达到顶点——当我们终于开始对比想象中的生活与现实生活时。
The mismatch is where the discomfort is coming from, and it does tend to come to a head right around this age when we are finally comparing the life we thought we'd have with the one that we're actually living.
这种不满情绪部分也源于简单的地理因素。
Part of that dissatisfaction also links to just like plain old geography.
环境在土星回归阶段扮演着极其重要的角色。
Environment plays a really big role in the Saturn return stage.
我和朋友们有个玩笑说，每个澳大利亚人到了27岁都会搬去伦敦。
There's this like joke that me and my friends have that everyone in Australia turns 27 and moves to London.
因为天啊，这简直像是个普遍规律。
Because, oh my god, like, it just seems like such a common pattern.
我自己就在这么做。
I'm doing it.
我甚至无法反驳，自己成了这个笑话的主角。
Like, I can't even like, I am the butt of my own joke.
没错，我就要搬去伦敦了。
Like, I'm moving to London.
我感觉在这个阶段内心会有个强烈呼唤：让我看看还有什么其他可能，再决定是否'立即购买'现有的生活。
I felt like there's this big call in you at this stage to just be like, let me see what else is out there before I click buy now on the life that I currently have.
二十多岁的尾声正是身心迁徙的高发期，我们的人格特质也将随之改变。
The late twenties are like a hotspot for moving both physically and psychologically, and we're also gonna see our personality shift as well.
人们经常引用这个观点，说大脑在25岁就完全成熟了。
People often quote this idea that, like, the brain fully matures at 25.
这其实是不正确的。
That's actually not correct.
你可能经历很多动荡的部分原因是，你期望自己已经进入更成熟、更聪明的思维系统。
Part of the reason why you might be experiencing a lot of, like, tumultuousness is because, you know, you expect to feel like you have locked into this more mature, smarter thinking system.
但实际上，你的大脑将经历另一轮快速的修剪和变化，这会影响你二十多岁后期的性格。
But, actually, you are going to experience another rapid burst of pruning and changes in your brain that will influence your personality in your late twenties.
在二十多岁的后期，我们很多人会变得稍微更有责任心。
In our late twenties, a lot of us become slightly more conscientious.
我们往往会变得更负责任、更可靠，这只是因为我们在适应生活中面临的越来越多的角色。
We tend to become more responsible, more reliable, simply because we are adapting to the increasing roles that we are facing in our lives.
但随之而来的是对这种变化局限性的更深刻认识。
But along with that comes a heavier awareness of the limits of this change.
你无能为力。
You can't do anything.
你不可能成为一切。
You can't be everything.
这就是那种，像是，过早失败的隐隐感觉可能出现的地方。
And that's where this, like, creeping feeling of, like, premature failure can show up.
这种挥之不去的想法，像是，我本该搞定一切的。
This nagging feeling of, like, I should have had it all figured out.
而我们对此的反应实际上可能相当不理性。
And how we respond to that can actually be quite irrational.
所以大家都在说，你会变得更成熟，能做出更成熟的决策，生活得更直截了当，然后在我们二十多岁的最后阶段，这种所谓的消亡爆发或回光返照就会出现——就在我们即将锁定新的成熟思维模式之前，就在我们即将告别这段人生阶段之前，我们会最后一次重温它，然后华丽谢幕。
So everyone's saying, like, you get more mature, you're able to make more mature decisions and be more straightforward with your life, then there is this final burst, often in our late twenties, where we might call it an extinction burst, we might call it rallying, where right before we feel like we've locked into, like, our new and mature brain, right before, like, we feel like we're going to retire this part of our life, we revisit revisit it one more time, and we go out with a bang.
丹·麦克亚当斯是研究叙事身份认同的研究者。
Dan McAdams, he is this researcher who studies narrative identity.
他写过关于29岁左右许多人会经历他称之为救赎转折点的现象。
He has written about how around 29, many people have what he calls a redemptive turning point.
就在那一刻，你二十多岁以来一直对自己讲述的那个故事，突然就不想要了。
It's that moment when the story you've been telling yourself for most of your twenties, like, just are like, don't want it anymore.
或者你会想，如果要结束这个故事，我得先跑个题再说。
Or you're like, if I'm gonna finish this story, I'm gonna go off on a major tangent before I do.
很多人都有这样的时刻，他们的性格几乎倒退或回到早期阶段，然后才迎来最后的绽放。
A lot of people have this moment where they're like, their personality almost regresses or returns to an earlier stage before it, like, comes back for, like, its final moment.
这并不是说一旦你到了30岁，就被定型了。
And it's not to say that, like, once you turn 30, like, you're locked down.
这就是你余生将要成为的样子。
This is who you're gonna be for the rest of your life.
不。
No.
你的大脑会继续发育。
Your brain continues to develop.
实际上，你的个性会在一生中持续变化。
Your personality actually does continue to change for the rest of your life.
但这正是那些我们真正能看到活动激增或差异化的时刻之一。
But this is just one of those moments where, like, you we really see, like, a spike or, like, a differentiation in activity.
所以如果土星回归让你感觉一切都在改变，要知道这其实是人类发展的正常阶段。
So if Saturn return, your Saturn return feels like everything is changing, it's good to know that this is actually just a part of human development.
我认为将其视为一个必须经历的过程会让人感到非常宽慰。
I think it's very soothing to see it as something that see it as a process that you have to go through.
如果这一切听起来很像是四分之一人生危机或人生低谷，你的感觉没错。
If all of this is sounding suspiciously like a quarter life crisis or rock bottom, you are not wrong.
占星学的定义是一回事。
The astrological definition is one thing.
这其实还有另一个名称。
This does have another name.
无论我们称之为土星回归，还是四分之一人生危机，这些概念实际上非常相似。
Whether we call it Saturn return, whether we call it a quarter life crisis, these are actually incredibly similar.
有人做过研究，将这两种经历的自述报告和轶事报告进行对比，发现它们本质上描述的是同一现象。
And people have done studies where they have compared self reporting and anecdotal reporting on these experiences side by side, they're kind of explaining, like, the same thing.
我认为，用四分之一人生危机的视角来看待土星回归，能让我们从心理学角度获得更深刻的理解。
And applying a quarter life crisis perspective on our Saturn returns, I think, gives us and gives like, allows us to have a more psychological take on it.
这不仅仅是一个流行心理学术语。
This isn't just a pop psychology term.
再次强调，这是一个非常真实的过渡期，如果你把20个人聚在一个房间里，你完全可以绘制出这个模式。
Again, this is a very real transition that if you got a 20 in a room, you could literally map it.
你可以一次又一次地绘制出这些变化开始发生的轨迹。
You could map it time and time again where these changes start to happen.
为什么爱情中的压力、事业中的压力、家庭中的压力会迫使我们改变自我。
Why tension in love, tension in careers, tension in family is going to push us to change who we are.
好吧。
Okay.
我们该怎么办？
What do we do about it?
我觉得我已经说得够多了，关于你们将要经历或已经经历的事情，以及可能的原因。
I feel like I've gone on long enough about, like, the things that you are going to experience or have experienced and perhaps why.
如果你感到完全迷失，觉得生活已经无法挽回，那么你至少应该迈出的第一步是什么，才能在这个阶段感觉稍微好受一点？
And if you're feeling totally, like, lost and, like, life is beyond repair, what is the first step that you have to take to at least just feel a little bit less uncomfortable in this period?
我们能做些什么来帮助自己？
What can we do to help ourselves?
好吧，我会给你一些建议——这些建议不完全来自我个人经历，但也确实包含了我跌入谷底和艰难时刻的体验，以及那些经历过并愿意分享故事的人们的经验。
Well, I'm gonna give you some suggestions from not really my own experience, but from, yeah, my own experience with, like, rock bottom moments and hard moments, but also from people who have lived to tell the tale.
这是一场朝圣之旅。
This is a pilgrimage.
对吧？
Right?
这是一场数百万人的身份认同朝圣之旅。
This is an identity pilgrimage that millions no.
在你之前已有数十亿人经历过。
Billions of people have gone through before you.
所以尽管现在感觉孤立无援，但研究表明，那些在二十多岁时积极应对身份认同发展和不确定性、并直面挑战的人，最终会获得更深刻的自我认知。
So as isolating as it feels right now, research does show that people who actively wrestle with their identity development and with uncertainty in their twenties and who confront it head on, they actually emerge with stronger self knowledge.
与那些试图忽视问题或在不喜欢的生活中硬撑的人相比，他们在三十多岁时会展现出更强的心理韧性。
They emerge with greater resilience in their thirties compared to people who try and ignore it or push through in a life that they don't actually like.
虽然听起来不像毒鸡汤导师，但你现在经历的这些强烈挣扎最终是件好事，它让你避免在这条路上越陷越深，否则将来你会感到更难抽身，需要牺牲更多才能离开。
So not to sound like a toxic positivity guru, but going through this now and as intensely as you are is ultimately a good thing and is saving you from investing further in this life and then feeling like you're even more responsible for it, and you'd have to sacrifice so much more to leave.
别因为这句话骂我。
Don't shoot me for saying that.
我知道如果你正在经历这些，这种话可能是你内心最不想听的。
I know that if you're going through it right now, like, secretly, that's not something that you wanna hear.
但付诸行动并从中寻找意义，确实对整个过程大有裨益。
But the application and and finding meaning in it all actually is really helpful for the process.
引用叙事认同研究就会发现：我们如何诠释自己的身份、经历和挑战的意义，会极大影响我们应对它们的方式。
If we think back to that narrative identity research again, we will find that the story we tell ourselves about who we are and what we're going through and why our challenges are important actually makes a huge difference to how we approach them.
这很大程度上取决于认知重构的能力。
And a lot of this does come down to reframing.
人们很容易把一段关系、工作、友谊或城市的终结视为失败。
It's easy to see endings, the ending of a relationship, a job, a friendship, a city that you lived in as a failure.
但在这个阶段，结束往往只是重新校准方向，甚至可能是一种保护。
But during this period, endings are often just realignments or maybe even protection.
无论你称之为行星、上帝、宇宙还是你的大脑，你都需要为人生这段时期贴上一个标签，并理解它为何是必要的，这样才能获得那种让你觉得无法以其他方式获得的深刻意义。
Whether you wanna call it the planets, god, the universe, your brain, you need to give this period in your life a label, and you need to acknowledge why it may be necessary in order to have that meaning that makes it feel like you couldn't have in any other way.
你不能将其视为失败。
You like, you can't see it as defeat.
每当你对此产生负面联想或消极念头时，若感到难以承受且人生转折，允许自己每天情绪低落。
Anytime that you, like, have a negative connotation or a negative thought about this that feels unbearable and life changing, you're allowed to feel crap day to day.
但每当你产生'这永远不会好转'或'这完全没用'之类的想法时。
But anytime you have a thought that's like, this is never gonna get better, This is completely useless.
'我整个人生code>生都在毫无意义地燃烧殆尽'。
My whole life is burning down for nothing.
重申一次，意义建构能将这场动荡重塑为你人生故事的组成部分。
Again, the meaning making can frame the upheaval as part of your story.
这是你认清自我的章节。
It's the chapter where you figure out who you are.
这是你明确人生所求、确定真正想要生活的篇章。
It's the chapter where you figure out what matters to you, what life you actually want.
这本身就会让这一切感觉更加可怕，但也更有意义。
That in itself will make all of this feel a lot more terrifying and more purposeful.
我还希望你对自己许下一个承诺。
I also want you to make a promise to yourself.
我会努力度过这个难关。
I am going to work through this.
我将生平第一次放弃一些控制权。
I'm going to give up some control for the first time in my life.
我会让自己随波逐流，让生活带我去它想让我去的地方。
I'm gonna let myself float through these changes and let life take me where it wants me to go.
我不会与之对抗。
I'm not gonna fight it.
这就是我要你做出的承诺。
This is the promise I want you to make.
我不会与之对抗。
I'm not gonna fight it.
我要真正允许自己感到惊喜。
I'm gonna actually allow myself to be surprised.
这是个非常斯多葛学派的想法，但你可能无法让这一章节变得更轻松。
It's a very stoic idea, but you might not be able to make this chapter easier.
你只能让自己少挣扎一点。
You can just allow yourself to struggle a little bit less.
另外，问问别人他们生命中这段时期的经历。
Also, ask people about their own period of this in their lives.
问问你的父母。
Ask your parents.
问问你年长的朋友。
Ask your older friends.
听听他们的故事。
Hear their stories.
每个我问过的人都说，如果没有土星回归期间或二十多岁末期的经历，我就不会是现在的我。
Everyone who I have asked has been like, I wouldn't be who I am today without what I went through during my Saturn return or during this period of the end of my twenties.
我会毫不犹豫地再来一次。
I would go through it again in a heartbeat.
它造就了今天的我。
It has made me who I am.
就像人们在交换战争故事一样。
It's like people exchanging war stories.
虽然很可怕。
Like, it's scary.
但对经历其中的人来说，又莫名地令人安心。
It's also strangely comforting for people involved.
对吧？
Right?
《The Cut》上有篇很棒的文章，标题是《七个土星回归的生存故事》。
There's this great article from The Cut titled seven Saturn Returns Survival Stories.
我想它可能设置了付费墙。
I think it's behind a paywall.
你还是应该获取免费订阅或者七天试用，阅读这些来自那些三十多岁、四十出头女性的非凡故事，她们已走过这段历程，能以事后之明反思，为我们提供你或许真正需要的智慧。
You should still get the free subscription or, like, the free seven day trial and read it because it is these stories from these incredible women who are on the other side that in their mid thirties, early forties, who are now have the hindsight to reflect and give us the wisdom on this period that you may really require.
我收到的另一个建议是，在这段时期选择一件事作为你的根基并保持忠诚。
Some other advice that I have gotten is to just choose one thing to ground you and stay loyal to during this period.
所以当其他一切都在变化时，找到一件稳定的事物。
So when everything else is is changing, find something that's stable.
开始为半程马拉松训练。
Start training for a half marathon.
开启一项阅读挑战。
Start a reading challenge.
坚持每晚写日记。
Commit to journaling every night.
戒酒。
Go sober.
领养一只猫。
Adopt a cat.
领养一只狗
Foster a dog.
专注于成为好家人、好志愿者、好社区成员
Focus on being a good family member, a good volunteer, a good community member.
启动一个新项目
Start a new project.
只需选择一件你能掌控的事作为重心，就像锚点一样可以随时回归，这个支点能让你始终拥有主动权，带来些许平静
Just choose something that is within your control to center you, kind of like an anchor that is gonna be something that you can come back to, this touch point that you can always have agency around that's gonna bring you a little bit of peace.
另外，写下日记、录制私人视频日志，为未来的自己记录此刻，真正吸收现在学到的所有教训
Also, write, record yourself, make a private video diary, capture this moment for yourself in the future to really take in all the lessons that you are learning right now.
我在经历第一次成年重大分手时就做过这件事
I did this when I went through my first adult big girl breakup.
我至今还保存着那些视频
I still have the videos.
虽然回看很痛苦， 但我建议每个经历艰难时刻的人都试试这个方法
I it's painful to watch, but I suggest it to anyone and everyone who was going through something really hard.
每次为这段关系感到低落、想哭或正在哭泣时，我都会录下自己的样子。
I recorded myself every single time I felt down about the relationship or I felt like crying or I was crying.
我一直坚持这样做，直到不再有这种冲动或不再需要为止。
And I kept doing that until I didn't want to or until I didn't need to anymore.
记录这些痛苦与变化的过程，会让它们显得重要且有意义。
And documenting that pain and these changes, it makes it feel like it's important and it means something.
你不必与任何人分享这些。
You don't share it with anyone.
说实话，我从未公开过那些视频。
Like, I've never shared that video.
嗯，准确地说大概有50段视频吧。
Well, I think there's like 50 videos, to be honest.
那些视频我从未与人分享过。
Like, I've never shared those.
它们更像是只属于我的私人记录。
It's kind of just for me.
当我回看那些视频时，最后那段大概就是我自己吧。
And when I go back and I watch it, like, the final video is was me, I think.
记不清是一年还是两年后了，但那段视频真的很暖心——视频里的我说着一切都会好起来的。
I can't remember whether it was, like, a year or two years later, but it was a really heartwarming it was just this video of me being like, it's gonna be okay.
而事实也确实如此。
And it was okay.
还带着一种释然的笑意。
And kind of laughing in a nice way.
我喜欢那个深陷绝望的过去的自己——那时的她根本看不到转机。
I like my this previous version of me who was so deep in despair, like, she did not see it getting any better.
而现在的我却在告诉她：事情确实好转了。
And here I was, like, telling her that it that it did.
我认为能为自己保留这样的见证具有非凡的意义。
And I think that having that that for yourself is truly powerful.
当你拥有未来回首时能笑着庆祝这段经历的能力，这确实令人欣慰。
And having the vision of a future you being able to look back in hindsight and celebrate this period is a lot of comfort in itself.
向你们传递满满的爱心。
I'm sending you guys a lot of love.
我认为你们只需要保持耐心。
I think you just need to have patience.
你们需要明白，这是人类成长必经的漫长而混乱的过程，也是二十多岁的必经阶段。
You just need to have patience that this is part of the long messy work of being human and of being in your twenties.
要知道，二十多岁的人生总想轰轰烈烈地落幕。
And your twenties, you know, they just wanna go out with a bang.
这段岁月已经教会了你太多。
Like, they've taught you so much.
它仍在持续给你带来无数启示。
They continue to teach you so much.
它想在你们开启人生新篇章前，把所有课程都塞进去。
They wanna, like, get all the lessons in before you enter this new chapter.
所以记得为这些成长留出空间。
So leave space for that.
给自己留出空间去学习、消化、哀伤，并与他人分享分享再分享你的经历。
Leave space to just, like, learn and process and grieve and share share share what you are going through with other people.
有时候最好的解药就是听到别人说：是啊，我也一样。
Sometimes like the best remedy is someone else just being like, yeah, me too.
然后就不再感到孤单。
And not feeling alone.
所以再说一次，祝你好运。
So again, good luck.
其实我真心为你感到兴奋。
I'm actually deeply excited for you.
当然，我并没有和你一起经历这些。
Obviously, I'm not going through it with you.
所以我猜如果我是你，可能也不想听别人这么说。
So, like, I'm sure if I was in your shoes, I would not wanna hear someone saying that.
很抱歉，但我确实真心为你感到兴奋。
So I'm sorry, but I am deeply excited for you.
我只是觉得会有太多精彩的事情即将发生，而你现在甚至都还不知道。
I just think so much amazing stuff is gonna come out of this that you don't even know yet.
这多酷啊？
How cool is that?
如果你喜欢这期节目，记得在下方留言。
If you enjoyed this episode, make sure to leave a comment down below.
告诉我你的土星回归是何时开始的。
Tell me when your Saturn return began.
是稍微早一点吗？
Was it a little bit earlier?
你还在经历这个过程吗？
Are you still going through it?
这段时间你学到了什么？
What are you learning during this period?
让我们在下方分享这些故事，希望人们浏览时能感叹：天啊，我感觉自己不再那么孤单了。
Let's share some of those stories below so that hopefully people can scroll through them and be like, oh my god, I feel so much less alone.
我要一如既往地感谢我们的研究助理Libby Colbert对本集的帮助。
I wanna thank our research assistant, Libby Colbert, as always for her help on this episode.
在我们共同整理这个主题的过程中，她教会了我许多关于占星学的知识。
She has taught me so much about astrology as we kind of put together, yeah, this this topic.
我非常感激她提供的所有协助。
So I appreciate her so much for all of her assistance.
记得在Instagram上关注@thatpsychologypodcast账号，观看幕后花絮。
Make sure that you are following us over on Instagram at that psychology podcast to see behind the scenes.
我们年底还将推出十二月嘉宾月活动。
We also have December guest month coming up at the end of the year.
如果你想了解节目嘉宾阵容，最好持续关注我们。
So if you wanna see who is going to be on the show, who you're gonna hear from, well, you you better follow along.
我们的文字稿现已登陆Substack平台，本集视频也在YouTube同步上线。
Our transcripts are as well now available on Substack, and this episode is actually on YouTube.
如果你正在收听这段内容，说明已经看完了整期节目，可能不需要再回看视频了。
You've kind of already finished it if you're listening to this, so you might not wanna go and rewatch it.
但如果你想观看节目未来的剧集，你应该在YouTube上关注我们《二十岁的心理学》频道。
But if you want to watch future episodes of the show, you should follow us over there, the psychology of your twenties, on YouTube.
但下次见之前，注意安全，保持善良，温柔对待自己。
But until next time, stay safe, be kind, be gentle to yourself.
祝你的土星回归顺利，我们很快、很快就会再聊。
Good luck with your Saturn return, and we will talk very, very soon.
你有没有听过那些真实犯罪节目，结果发现自己问题比答案还多？
Have you ever listened to those true crime shows and found yourself with more questions than answers?
这是什么？
And what is this?
这怎么会是个我们都不熟悉的故事？
How is that not a story we all know?
这...这是什么？在哪里？
What what's this u where is that?
为什么是湿的？
Why is it wet?
朋友们，我们有个精彩节目要献给大家
Boy, do we have a show for you.
由Smartless传媒、Campsite传媒和Big Money Players联合出品的《无犯罪》
From smartless media, campsite media, and big money players comes Crimeless.
我是调查记者乔什·迪恩
Join me, Josh Dean, investigative journalist.
还有我，喜剧演员罗里·斯科维尔，我们将一同颂扬全球最蠢罪犯们的'惊人'创意
And me, Rory Scovel, comedian, as we celebrate the amazing creativity of the world's dumbest criminals.
我们将深挖那些最滑稽的违法方式
We'll look into some of the silliest ways folks have broken the laws.
说实话，这更像是高级恶作剧而非犯罪
Honestly, it feels more like a high level prank than a crime.
谁会去网骗整座城市？
Who catfishes a city?
并认识几位令人难忘的反派角色
And meet some memorable antiheroes.
这里有成千上万只愤怒又饥渴的猴子。
There are thousands of angry horny monkeys.
如果你觉得她是个女巫就鼓掌，这让你毛骨悚然吧。
Clap if you think she's a witch, and it freaks you out.
他有X光透视眼。
He has X-ray vision.
我怎么能不追随他呢？
How could I not follow him?
老实说，我也得跟着他。
I honestly, I gotta follow him.
他能把我看得透透的。
He could see right through me.
请在iHeartRadio应用、苹果播客或任何你收听播客的平台收听《无罪》。
Listen to Crimeless on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
爸爸坚信魔鬼正在攻击我们。
Dad had the strong belief that the devil was attacking us.
两兄弟，一个虔诚的家庭，两条截然不同的道路。
Two brothers, one devout household, two radically different paths.
加布·奥尔蒂斯成为了德克萨斯州最高级别的执法官员之一。
Gabe Ortiz became one of the highest ranking law enforcement officers in Texas.
三十二年的执法经验。
Thirty two years, total law enforcement experience.
但他的兄弟拉里却留在原地，建立了完全不同的遗产。
But his brother Larry, he stayed behind and built an entirely different legacy.
他是这个帮派的头目，没人能对他发号施令。
He was the head of this gang and nobody was gonna tell him what to do.
你为事业推进界限。
You're push that line for the cause.
他收留了我们，向我们展示了他们所谓的游戏规则。
Took us under his wing and showed us the game as they call it.
当拉里被谋杀后，盖比被迫直面他试图逃避的过去，揭露了他从未预见到的秘密。
When Larry is murdered, Gabe is forced to confront the past he tried to leave behind and uncover secrets he never saw coming.
我父亲有过我们完全不知情的另一段人生。
My dad had a whole another life that we never knew about.
当时，我妈妈开始尖叫着我爸爸的名字，然后我只听到一声枪响。
Like, my mom started screaming my dad's name, and I just heard one gunshot.
《奥尔蒂斯兄弟》是一个扣人心弦的真实故事，讲述了信仰、家庭，以及两个生命如何渐行渐远，又以最惨烈的方式相撞。
The Brothers Ortiz is a gripping true story about faith, family, and how two lives can drift so far apart and collide in the most devastating way.
请在iHeartRadio应用程序、Apple播客或任何你获取播客的平台收听《奥尔蒂斯兄弟》。
Listen to The Brothers Ortiz on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
嘿，你好。
Hey there.
我是杰西·米尔斯医生。
Doctor Jesse Mills here.
我是加州大学洛杉矶分校健康中心男性诊所的主任，想向大家介绍我的新播客《邮件室》。
I'm the director of the men's clinic at UCLA Health, and I wanna tell you about my new podcast called the mailroom.
我是乔丹，这档节目的制作人。
And I'm Jordan, the show's producer.
和很多男性一样，我也有很多年没去看医生了。
And like a lot of guys, I haven't been to the doctor in many years.
我会提出那些我们本该问却一直没问的问题。
I'll be asking the questions we probably should be asking but aren't.
因为男性通常不会去看医生，除非脸上掉块肉或者骨折了。
Because guys usually don't go to the doctor unless a piece of their face is hanging off or they've broken a bone.
那得看是哪根骨头。
Depends which bone.
哇。
Wow.
这倒是实话。
That's true.
每周我们都会剖析男性健康这个独特领域，从睾酮、健身到饮食、生育能力，以及卧室里发生的事。
Every week, we're breaking down the unique world of men's health from testosterone and fitness to diets and fertility and things that happen in the bedroom.
你是指睡觉吗？
You mean sleep?
是啊。
Yeah.
差不多吧，乔丹。
Something like that, Jordan.
我们将用通俗易懂的方式探讨科学，为你真正好奇的问题提供实际答案。
We'll talk science without the jargon and get you real answers to the stuff you actually wonder about.
这会很有趣，无论你是27岁、97岁，还是介于两者之间。
It's gonna be fun, whether you're 27, 97, or somewhere in between.
男性健康不仅仅关乎六块腹肌和补剂。
Men's health is about more than six packs and supplements.
它关乎精力、自信和人际关系。
It's about energy, confidence, and connection.
我们不仅希望你活得更久。
We don't just want you to live longer.
我们希望你活得更好。
We want you to live better.
快去iHeartRadio应用、苹果播客或你常听节目的平台查看邮件室
So check out the mail room on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your favorite shows.
大家好啊？
What up, y'all?
我是你们的老朋友凯文，现在上台啦
It's your boy, Kev on stage.
我想告诉你
I wanna tell you
关于我的新播客《并非高光时刻》，我将在节目中与艺术家、运动员、艺人、创作者、朋友以及我钦佩的成功人士探讨他们遭遇的重大失败。
about my new podcast called Not my best moment, where I talk to artists, athletes, entertainers, creators, friends, people I admire who had massive success about their massive failures.
他们搞砸了什么？
What did they mess up on?
他们的心碎时刻是什么？
What is their heartbreak?
他们从中又学到了什么？
And what did they learn from it?
我被狠狠地批评了。
I got judged horribly.
评委们说，你太差劲了。
The judges were like, you're trash.
我不知道你是怎么上这个节目的。
I don't know how you got on the show.
嘘。
Boo.
有人准备了西红柿。
Somebody had tomatoes.
没有。
No.
我开玩笑的。
I'm kidding.
但如果他们真有西红柿，肯定会扔过来的。
But they if they had tomatoes, they would have thrown the tomatoes.
说实话吧。
Let's be honest.
我们都有过那些宁愿忘记的时刻。
We've all had those moments we'd rather forget.
我们撞到了头。
We bumped our head.
我们犯了错。
We made a mistake.
交易泡汤了。
The deal fell through.
我们感到尴尬。
We're embarrassed.
我们失败了。
We failed.
但这个播客正是关于这些经历以及我们如何渡过难关的。
But this podcast is about that and how we made it through.
于是当他们让我坐下时，
So when they sat me down,
他们先是寒暄了几句，然后就直接问：你有什么想法？
they were kinda like we got into the small talk, and they were just like, so what do you What what ideas?
我当时就懵了：哦，糟了。
And I was like, oh, no.
什么？
What?
在iHeartRadio应用、苹果播客、YouTube或任何你收听播客的平台，关注《非我高光时刻》节目，与舞台上的凯文一起回顾。
Check out not my best moment with me, Kev on stage, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.
大家好，
Hey there.
我是杰西·米尔斯医生，
Doctor Jesse Mills here.
现任UCLA男性健康诊所主任，我想向你们介绍我的新播客《收发室》。
I'm the director of the men's clinic at UCLA, and I wanna tell you about my new podcast called The Mailroom.
我是乔丹，这档节目的制作人。
And I'm Jordan, the show's producer.
和大多数男性一样，我已经很久没去看医生了
And like most guys, I haven't been to the doctor in
实在太久了。
way too long.
我会提出那些
I'll be asking the
我们本该问却没能问出口的问题。
questions we probably should be asking but aren't.
每周我们都会剖析男性健康领域，从睾酮与健身到饮食与生育能力。
Every week, we're breaking down the world of men's health from testosterone and fitness to diets and fertility.
我们将用通俗语言探讨科学，为你真正好奇的问题提供真实答案。
We'll talk science without the jargon and get you real answers to the stuff you actually wonder about.
欢迎在iHeartRadio应用、苹果播客或你喜爱的节目平台上收听《邮件室》。
So check out the mail room on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your favorite shows.
大家好啊？
What up, y'all?
我是你们的好兄弟凯文，现在在台上。
It's your boy, Kev on stage.
我想告诉你们
I wanna tell you
关于我的新播客《并非高光时刻》，在那里我会与艺术家、运动员、艺人、创作者、朋友和我敬佩的成功人士聊聊他们遭遇过的重大失败。
about my new podcast called not my best moment, where I talk to artists, athletes, entertainers, creators, friends, people I admire who had massive success about their massive failures.
他们搞砸了什么？
What did they mess up on?
他们的心率如何？
What is their heart rate?
他们从中又学到了什么？
And what did they learn from it?
我被狠狠批判过。
I got judged horribly.
评委们都说，你就是个垃圾。
The judges were like, you're trash.
我真不知道你是怎么上的节目。
I don't know how you got on the show.
请关注我和Kev主持的《非高光时刻》播客，在iHeartRadio应用、苹果播客、YouTube或任何你收听播客的平台都能找到。
Check out not my best moment with me kept on stage on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.
你有没有听过那些真实犯罪节目，结果发现疑问比答案还多？
Have you ever listened to those true crime shows and found yourself with more questions than answers?
谁会冒充整座城市行骗？
Who catfishes a city?
吸食人类骨灰真的安全吗？
Is it even safe to snort human remains?
这难道是《浑身是劲》的剧情？
Is that the plot of Footloose?
我是喜剧演员罗瑞·斯卡维尔，我要告诉你，乔什·迪恩和我新开了一档播客，专门歌颂世界上最蠢罪犯的惊人创意。
I'm comedian Rory Scovel, and I'm here to tell you Josh Dean and I have a new podcast that celebrates the amazing creativity of the world's dumbest criminals.
罪犯们
Criminals.
这档节目叫《无罪可犯》，是一档真实犯罪喜剧播客
It's called Crimeless, a true crime comedy podcast.
请在iHeartRadio应用、苹果播客或任何你获取播客的平台收听
Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
我知道他名声在外，但迟早会自食恶果
I know he has a reputation, but it's gonna catch up to
加布·奥尔蒂斯是个警察
Gabe Ortiz is a cop.
他的兄弟拉里是个谜团，加布本不想追查——直到为时已晚
His brother, Larry, a mystery Gabe didn't wanna solve until it was too late.
他曾是这个团伙的头目
He was the head of this gang.
你准备为这个事业越界吗？
You gonna push that line for the cause?
收我们为徒，向我们展示了他们所谓的‘游戏规则’。
Took us under his wing and showed us the game, as they call it.
当拉里遇害后，加布必须揭开一段危险的往事，这段往事可能摧毁他所有的认知。
When Larry's killed, Gabe must untangle a dangerous past, one that could destroy everything he thought he knew.
请在iHeartRadio应用、Apple播客或您获取播客的任何平台收听《奥尔蒂斯兄弟》。
Listen to the Brothers Ortiz on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
这是iHeart出品的播客《人类保证》。
This is an iHeart podcast, Guaranteed Human.
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