邦迪的恐怖与英勇：关于反犹主义恐怖袭击的已知信息——最新报道

这里是《卫报》。

This is The Guardian.

《秘密世界》揭露了一个诈骗网络，他们欺骗那些为孩子癌症寻求帮助的绝望父母。

World of Secrets uncovers a network of scammers deceiving desperate parents searching for help for their children with cancer.

我非常信任他

I trusted him a lot

而他却这样对我。

and this is what he did to me.

他们说从未收到以孩子名义筹集的款项。

Who say they never received the money raised in their children's names.

他们承诺给他玩具和任何他想要的东西，只要他同意拍摄视频。

They promised him toys and whatever he wanted if he agreed to film the video.

请帮帮我，求求你了。

Please help me, please.

BBC国际频道《秘密世界》报道的儿童癌症骗局。

World of Secrets, the child cancer scam from the BBC World Service.

请在bbc.com或您获取播客的任何平台收听。

Listen on bbc.com or wherever you get your podcasts.

我们起初以为是烟花声，但突然间，警笛声和救护车鸣笛声交织在一起，社区WhatsApp群组瞬间炸开了锅，基本上都在说邦迪那边出事了。

We heard what initially we thought were fireworks going off, but then all of a sudden, that was joined by police sirens, ambulance sirens, community WhatsApp groups lit up basically saying something's happening at Bondi.

别来邦迪。

Don't come to Bondi.

邦迪发生了一起骇人听闻的恐怖袭击事件。

There has been a devastating terrorist incident at Bondi.

这是一场针对澳大利亚犹太人的蓄意袭击，是邪恶的反犹主义行为，是恐怖主义对我们国家心脏的打击。

This is a targeted attack on Jewish Australians, an act of evil anti Semitism, terrorism that has struck the heart of our nation.

这里有许多社区正深受其害，遭受严重心理创伤，需要多年时间才能和解并理解这里发生的一切，尤其是犹太社区。

There are many communities here who are really suffering, are deeply traumatized and will take years to reconcile and understand what what's happened here, in particular, of course, the Jewish community.

关于邦迪海滩那起令人震惊的反犹恐怖袭击，我们目前掌握了哪些信息？

What do we know so far about the shocking antisemitic terror attack at Bondi Beach?

这里是《卫报》今日焦点栏目，我是露西·霍夫，为您带来最新报道。

From The Guardians today in focus, this is the latest with me, Lucy Hoff.

与我连线的是本·多尔蒂，他是《卫报》澳大利亚分社的资深记者。

I'm joined by Ben Doherty, who's a senior reporter at Guardian Australia.

本，非常感谢你能加入我们。

Ben, thanks so much for joining us.

我知道你那边已经很晚了。

I know it's late where you are.

你住得离邦迪海滩非常近，据我所知，你昨天听到了枪声。

You live very close to Bondi Beach, so you heard gunshots ringing out yesterday, as I understand.

请告诉我你意识到事态严重时的情形。

Tell me about when you realized that something serious was going on.

你好，露西。

Hi, Lucy.

是的。

Yes.

我确实住得非常近。

I do live very close.

我住在邦迪海滩的南端。

I live at the South End of of Bondi Beach.

我想你能看到我身后黑暗中隐约可见的海滩。

I think you can see the the beach in the darkness behind me.

我是南边塔玛拉玛海滩的救生员，昨天下午周日我还在巡逻值班。

I'm a lifesaver at the next beach south at Tamarama, and I'd been on patrol yesterday afternoon on Sunday.

那是个阳光灿烂、美好非凡的日子。

It was a glorious, sunny, brilliant day.

我回到家后正和家人在一起。

And I'd come home and I was home with my family.

我们起初听到的声音以为是烟花，并没有太在意。

And we heard what initially we thought were fireworks going off and didn't think too much of it.

但突然间，警笛声和救护车鸣笛声接连响起。

But then all of a sudden, that was joined by police sirens, ambulance sirens.

我们听到直升机升空，社区WhatsApp群组瞬间炸开，基本上都在说邦迪出事了。

We heard helicopters go into the air and WhatsApp groups, community WhatsApp groups, lit up, basically saying something's happening at Bondi.

有人知道邦迪海滩发生什么事了吗？

Does anyone know what's happening at Bondi?

别来邦迪海滩。

Don't come to Bondi.

我们很快意识到这是一起非常严重、极具戏剧性的事件。

And we realized very quickly this was a very serious, very dramatic event.

确实是一起非常严重的事件。

A very serious event indeed.

已有15人遇难，包括一名儿童，40人受伤。

There's been 15 people killed, including a child, 40 injured.

其中一名行凶者已被击毙。

One of the perpetrators was killed.

这是澳大利亚近三十年来最严重的枪击事件。

The worst shooting in Australia for nearly thirty years.

当澳大利亚开始正视这起事件时，民众对此有多么震惊？

How shocking has this been for Australia as it begins to reckon with what happened?

我认为你是对的。

I think you're right.

我认为在这个国家，这类大规模枪击事件非常罕见。

I think this is a country where mass shootings of this kind are very rare.

正如你所说，自1996年亚瑟港事件以来，还没有发生过如此规模的枪击事件，那次事件同样迫使全国进行反思，尤其是关于枪支法律的讨论。

As you say, there hasn't been a shooting on on this sort of scale since Port Arthur in 1996, which, like this, forced a a national reckoning, particularly around around gun laws.

我认为邦迪这里的社区，尤其是悉尼及全国各地的澳大利亚犹太社区，正努力理解所发生的一切，以及突然降临在这片土地上的极端暴力。

I think this is a community here in Bondi, and particularly the Jewish Australian community here in Sydney and and around the country is really trying to reconcile what's happened, the extraordinary violence that was all of a sudden visited upon this place.

这是一起蓄意针对犹太社区成员的袭击，目标是澳大利亚犹太人，确实如此。

The fact that it was such a deliberately targeted attack at members of the Jewish community, it was targeted at Jewish Australians, and Yes.

暴力的规模以及突然降临在这样一个著名地点的恐怖——悉尼许多人、全澳大利亚许多人都与之有深厚联系，世界各地也有许多人知晓——使得事件更加令人震惊。

The the scale of the violence and the sudden terror that that came to a famous place that lots of people in Sydney, lots of people around Australia have a very strong connection to, and lots of people around the world know made it all the more shocking.

是的。

Yeah.

这是一场在邦迪海滩后方公园举行的光明节庆祝活动。

So this was a a Hanukkah celebration in a park that's just behind Bundai Beach.

对吧？

Right?

两名枪手向聚集在那里庆祝本应充满团聚与欢乐的人们开火。

And it's two gunmen who opened fire on the people that were gathering there to celebrate what should be a day of togetherness of celebration.

这是犹太人的光明节，却演变成了一场致命悲剧。

It's the Jewish festival of lights, but turned very deadly.

遇难者名单令人心碎，其中包括一名儿童、一名大屠杀幸存者，以及一位出生于伦敦的拉比。

The list of the victims is just heartbreaking, but they include a child, a holocaust survivor, a rabbi who was born in London.

请详细说说我们目前掌握的关于这起悲剧中遇难者的情况。

Tell me more about what we know about people that were that were killed in this tragedy.

这次袭击是针对澳大利亚犹太人的。

This attack was targeted at Jewish Australians.

邦迪有相当规模的犹太社区。

There is a significant Jewish population in Bondi.

最年轻的遇难者是一名10岁女孩，名叫玛蒂尔达。

The youngest victim was a 10 year old girl called Matilda.

最年长的受害者是87岁的老人，正如你提到的，他是一位名叫亚历克斯·克莱德曼的大屠杀幸存者。

The oldest was an 87 year old man, as you mentioned, a holocaust survivor called Alex Klaidman.

其中一位组织者是以利·施兰格拉比，他是五个孩子的父亲。

And one of the organizers, a rabbi by the name of Eli Schlanger, was a father of five.

他刚刚再次成为父亲。

He'd just become a father again.

他最小的孩子去年十月出生，他是首批遇难者之一。

His youngest child was born in October, he was one of the first people killed.

本，我昨天读了你从现场发回的令人痛心的报道，采访了海滩附近目睹事件发生的民众。

And and, Ben, I was reading your very harrowing reporting from the scene yesterday, talking to people who were near the beach as this was unfolding.

其中有个细节整晚都萦绕在我心头，一位目击者描述他们（枪手）在现场停留了很长时间。

And and one of the lines that has just stayed with me overnight is someone who witnessed the account and said they were there for such a long time.

这显然是蓄谋已久的，他们甚至在警察和救护车赶到前还有时间重新装弹。

This was so premeditated that they were able to reload their guns in the time before police and ambulances were able to get there.

现在有数十段视频在社交媒体和WhatsApp群组中流传，几乎记录了袭击的全过程。

Dozens of videos are now circulating around on social media, around around WhatsApp group, showing almost the entire attack, some of those.

事实是这两名枪手基本上可以肆无忌惮地开火数分钟。

And it was the case that the two the two gunmen were essentially able to fire with impunity for minutes.

他们不断重新装弹。

They reloaded and reloaded again.

这使得一位名叫艾哈迈德的男子英勇行为更加震撼——他在视频中接近其中一名枪手并夺下武器，这段视频已在全球疯传。

Which makes the act of heroism of one man, Ahmed, Al Ahmed, who was able to approach one of the gunmen and and wrestle his weapon from him in a video that's gone absolutely viral all of around the world, even even more striking.

你说得对，露西。

You're right, Lucy.

当你看到这段难以置信的画面时，那是在所有残暴暴力中展现的非凡勇气，令人难以置信的英勇行为。

It's scarcely believable footage when you see it, an extraordinary act of courage amidst all of this brutal violence, this incredible act of bravery.

艾哈迈德·阿尔·艾哈迈德利用汽车掩护接近其中一名枪手，然后扑向他，抓住他的脖子和手臂，解除武装，夺下步枪，并用武器威胁着将他逼退。

Ahmed Al Ahmad creeps up using the cover of a car on one of the shooters and then lunges at him, grabs at his neck, grabs at his arms, and disarms him, takes the rifle off this gunman, and threatens him, pushes him backwards with it.

这是非凡的英勇行为，但并非没有付出代价。

It's an extraordinary active courage, but not one that came without sacrifice.

艾哈迈德目前正在医院接受治疗。

Ahmed Ahmed is currently in hospital.

他身中多达五枪。

He has up to five bullet wounds.

他最终还是中弹了。

He was ultimately shot.

他可能会失去手臂。

He may lose his arm.

他为保护他人做出了极其勇敢的举动，无疑拯救了许多生命。

This is an incredibly brave act that he's done in in defense of others, and he undoubtedly saved lives.

是的。

Yeah.

毫无疑问。

Undoubtedly.

他的家人已从悉尼向媒体发声，那些话非常感人，我们希望他能完全康复。

And his family have been speaking to the media from Sydney, which has been very moving to hear, and we hope he makes a full recovery.

但是，本，关于这些所谓的行凶者，我们了解多少？

But, Ben, what do we know about the alleged perpetrators?

我们知道他们是一对父子，而且小儿子几年前曾因可能与伊斯兰国有联系而受到情报人员的调查。

We know that they are a father and son, and that the youngest son had been investigated by intelligence officers for possible links to Islamic State some years ago.

没错，露西。

That's right, Lucy.

纳维德·阿克拉姆今年24岁。

Naved Akram is 24.

他在2019年引起了澳大利亚国内情报机构ASIO的注意，因为他与某些人士的交往关系——包括他所接触和共度时光的人，但最终被认定不构成威胁。

He, in 2019, came to the attention of ASIO, which is our domestic intelligence agency, about associations that he's held that he held about people he was talking to and and and spending time with, but he was ultimately deemed not to be a threat.

他的父亲是萨吉德·阿克拉姆。

His father was Sajid Akram.

他持有枪支许可证，被允许拥有六件武器。

He had a gun license, and he was permitted to own six weapons.

警方表示已收缴全部涉案武器，并相信这些就是本次袭击中使用的凶器。

Police say they've got all of those weapons, and they believe those are the weapons that were used in this attack.

萨吉德·阿克拉姆在案发现场被击毙。

Sajid Akram was killed at the scene.

纳维德·阿克拉姆中枪并受重伤。

Naved Akram was shot and critically injured.

他目前正在医院接受警方看守。

He's currently in hospital under police guard.

而阿克拉姆警官能够获取持证武器的事实，在过去24小时里引发了澳大利亚民众的深切担忧和激烈辩论，人们再次审视枪支法规。

And and the fact that sergeant Akram was able to access licensed weapons has been a source of real concern and debate in the last twenty four hours with Australians looking again at gun law regulations.

确实如此。

That's true.

我认为这类似于1996年亚瑟港事件的情况，当时塔斯马尼亚州发生了骇人听闻的枪击案。

And I I do think it's a situation analogous to that of Port Arthur in 1996 where there was a dramatic shooting in Tasmania.

35人遇难。

Thirty five people were killed.

作为回应，当时保守党政府出台了非常严格的枪支法律，特别是针对半自动和自动武器，并通过政府强制回购计划收缴了约65万件武器。

And in response to that, a a then conservative government brought in very strict gun laws, particularly around semiautomatic and automatic weapons, and about 650,000 weapons were part of a a compulsory government buyback.

所有这些武器都被从街头清除。

So all of these weapons were taken off the streets.

长期以来，澳大利亚一直有一种认知，认为我们的枪支管控法律堪称黄金标准。

And for a long time in Australia, there was this perception that we had these gold standard of of of gun control laws.

萨吉德·阿克拉姆能够成为枪支俱乐部的成员，拥有六件武器，并利用这些武器对社区实施恐怖袭击的事实，现在引发了进一步的讨论。

The fact that Sajid Akram was able to be a member of a gun club, was able to own six weapons, and were then able to use these weapons to inflict this terrorist attack on this community is now the subject of further debate.

总理今天表示，他希望看到澳大利亚枪支法律的改革，特别是重新评估民众持枪的权利，许可证不应一发了之、永久有效，同时也应限制个人持有武器的数量。

The prime minister has today said he would like to see reforms to Australia's gun laws, in particular around reevaluating people's right to own guns, that licenses shouldn't just be set and forget, that that they shouldn't just exist in perpetuity, and also limits on the number of weapons that someone can hold.

是的。

Yeah.

本，我的意思是，你就住在这起事件发生地附近。

And I mean, Ben, you live very close to where this all happened.

想必会有守夜活动。

Presumably, will be vigils.

人们在那里献花，前来表达哀悼之情。

There was flowers being left there, people coming to to to pay their respects.

悉尼的澳大利亚民众，尤其是犹太社区，在面对这起事件时，整体氛围如何？

What's what's the mood like as Australians, people in Sydney, the Jewish community in Sydney in particular, come to terms with what's happened?

你说得对。

You're right.

这里有许多社区正深受其害，遭受严重心理创伤，需要多年时间才能平复并理解这里发生的一切，尤其是以邦迪为中心的犹太社区。

There are many communities here who are really suffering, are deeply traumatized, and will take years to reconcile and understand what's happened here, in particular, of course, the Jewish community that is centered here on Bondi.

如果你现在走上街头，会发现整个社区仍处于震惊之中。人们在街上驻足交谈，相互拥抱。

If you go out on the streets now, it is a community in shell People in the streets are stopping and talking to each other and hugging in the street.

不久前我走上街头，看到大批民众手持鲜花沿山坡而下，前往邦迪凉亭后方设立的临时守夜点。

I walked out in the street a little while ago, and there are floods of people walking down the hill carrying flowers to a makeshift vigil that's been set up at the back of Bondi Pavilion.

我相信英国很多人对邦迪海滩和那里的大亭子都很熟悉。

I'm sure lots of people in Britain will be familiar with with Bondi and the big pavilion there.

人们正在点燃蜡烛。

People are lighting candles.

人们去那里唱歌，团结一致地聚在一起。

People are going there to sing songs and just be together in solidarity.

邦迪海滩是一个让许多人怀有深厚感情和联系的地方，通过这个充满欢乐、阳光与嬉戏的地方，突然变成了极度恐怖和难以想象的创伤之地，这对社区来说将非常难以接受和理解。

Bondi Beach is a place that so many people have such a deep affection and connection to, that through it, this place of joy, this place of sunshine and and play, all of sudden become this place of great terror and extreme unimaginable trauma is going to be so difficult for this community to to to reconcile and to to come to grips with.

本，非常感谢你，也谢谢你的报道。

Well, Ben, thank you, and thank you for your reporting.

非常感谢，露西。

Thanks so much, Lucy.

今天就到这里。

That's it for today.

感谢收听本期《今日聚焦》的最新晚间版，您也可以在YouTube上观看。

Thanks for listening to this episode of the latest, the new evening edition of Today in Focus, which you can also watch on YouTube.

再次感谢《卫报》澳大利亚资深记者本·多尔蒂。

My thanks again to Guardian Australia senior reporter Ben Doherty.

您可以在theguardian.com上持续关注他对邦迪恐怖袭击的所有报道和滚动更新。

You can keep up with all his reporting and rolling coverage of the Bondi terror attack over at theguardian.com.

《今日聚焦》明天早上将再次与您见面，明晚我们也会回来。

Today in Focus will be back with you tomorrow morning, and we'll be back tomorrow night.

本期节目由我——露西·霍夫为您呈现。

This episode was presented by me, Lucy Hoff.

资深制作人是Ryan Ramgobin。

The senior producer was Ryan Ramgobin.

首席制作人是Zoe Hitch。

The lead producer was Zoe Hitch.

这里是《卫报》。

This is The Guardian.

《秘密世界》揭露了一个诈骗网络，他们欺骗那些为患癌子女寻求帮助的绝望父母。

World of Secrets uncovers a network of scammers deceiving desperate parents searching for help for their children with cancer.

我非常信任他

I trusted him a lot

而他却这样对我。

and this is what he did to me.

他们说从未收到以孩子名义筹集的善款。

Who say they never received the money raised in their children's names.

他们承诺如果他同意拍摄视频，就会给他玩具和他想要的任何东西。

They promised him toys and whatever he wanted if he agreed to film the video.

请帮帮我，求求你了。

Please help me, please.

BBC国际频道的《秘密世界》揭露了针对儿童癌症患者的骗局。

World of Secrets, the child cancer scam from the BBC World Service.

您可以在bbc.com或任何播客平台收听本节目。

Listen on bbc.com or wherever you get your podcasts.