必备要素：高管风范

您正在收听的是《哈佛商业评论》的《职场女性》。我是艾米·伯恩斯坦。欢迎收听第四季“精华”系列。在这个系列中，我和艾米·G通过把技能专家与希望提升这些技能的听众聚在一起，来探讨关键的职业技能。我们喜欢把这些节目扎根于具体女性的真实经历，因为这样能让管理原理不再只是理论，实用建议也更接地气——不仅对参与对话的那一位女性有帮助，也对各行各业所有听众都有启发。

You're listening to Women at Work from Harvard Business Review. I'm Amy Bernstein. Welcome to season four of the essentials. This is a series in which Amy g and I cover key career skills by bringing together experts in those skills with audience members who are looking to get better at them. The thing we like about grounding these episodes and the specifics of individual women's experience is how it makes management principles less theoretical and practical advice more realistic, not only for that one woman participating in the conversation, but for all our listeners in all sorts of industries.

在HBR，我是副总裁，我相当自信自己看起来像个领导者。但往前倒两份工作，大概十五年前，我当时有高管头衔，可据当时的老板说，我表现得并不像。事实上，她直接告诉我：“艾米，你得提升你的高管气场。”我当时一头雾水。

Here at HBR, I'm a vice president, and I'm pretty confident that I come across as a leader. But a couple of jobs back, let's say fifteen years ago, I had an executive title, and yet, according to my boss at the time, I didn't act the part. In fact, she told me so. She said, Amy, you need to work on your executive presence. I was baffled.

我完全不明白她在说什么。我冲回办公室，谷歌了“高管气场”。这才意识到她指的是：我太拘谨，很少主动站出来，表现得好像要等别人给我许可才敢上前一步。

I had no idea what she was referring to. I ran back to my office, and I googled executive presence. I realized what she was talking about. I was reticent. I rarely put myself forward, and I behaved as if I was waiting for someone to give me permission to step up.

于是我不得不对自己下狠手，承认这条反馈基本属实，这打击很大。我开始换个角度看世界，发现那些一周前我还会退缩的机会，逼自己迎上去。可能只是开会时发言，只要我有想法。起初小心翼翼，后来随着信心增长就越来越自然。我接下了那些吓人的活儿。

So I had to be really astringent with myself and own that the feedback was pretty much on target, and that was devastating. So I kind of started to view my world a little differently, and I started to see opportunities that I would have shrunk from, you know, just a week earlier and forced myself to go for them. It might have been just speaking up in a meeting if I had something to add. At first timidly, and then less timidly as as I built up my confidence. I took on the scary stuff.

对我来说最大的考验是董事会会议，那帮人令人闻风丧胆。尤其是其中一位，要是你准备不足，他能把你撕成碎片。于是我思考我能掌控什么：外表——我穿什么？

The big test for me was a board meeting, and the board was terrifying. They were the type of people, and there was one person in particular, who would slice you to ribbons if you didn't know your stuff. So I I I thought about what I could control. I could control the way I looked. What did I wear?

我有一套很不错的西装，配真丝衬衫，其实这份工作我穿得一直挺讲究。另一件我能掌控的是对材料的掌握。于是我深挖细节，所有事实、所有数据都烂熟于心。

I had a very nice suit with a nice silk blouse. I actually dressed really well for this job. The other thing I could control was my command of the material. So I dug in. I had every fact, every figure.

我提前跟很多更懂行的人交流，征求反馈。等到真正做演示时，我几乎能闭着眼完成。董事会成员提问，我都有答案；对可能答不上来的问题，我也做好了准备。

I had socialized a lot of it. I'd run it past people who knew more to get their feedback. And by the time I was doing the presentation, I could almost have done it with my eyes closed. When members of the board asked questions, I had answers. But I also had prepared myself for not having answers.

于是我可以回应：“好问题，我得查一下再回复您。”直到今天，我仍觉得那场表现算稳拿B，但对我来说已是胜利。我还有很多要学，还有很多自我审视要做，但那一次改变了我对自己角色、未来道路以及对自身前途责任的看法。

And then I could respond, you know, good question. I'm gonna have to find the answer and get back to you. And I will still tell you that I think that I gave a solid b performance, and that represented a victory to me. I had a lot more to learn. I had a lot more self examination to do, but it it changed the way I thought about my role, my path forward, and my responsibility for my future.

后来我加入HBR，接触到西尔维娅·安·休利特的观点。她对高管气场的阐述非常清晰。西尔维娅是经济学家，运营一家智库，她调研并访谈了大量商业领袖，从中总结出能把人区分开来的领导特质，这些特质分三类：庄重感、沟通技巧、外表。

Then I came to HBR, and I encountered the ideas of Sylvia Ann Hewlett. Her thinking on executive presence is so clear. Sylvia's an economist who runs a think tank, and she has surveyed and interviewed a lot of business leaders. From that research, she's identified the leadership traits that set certain people apart. Those traits fall into three categories, gravitas, communication skills, and appearance.

我来具体说说。庄重感包括自信、果断、包容、尊重他人、远见和正直。沟通技巧则指掌控全场、读懂听众、保持真实。真实感也是第三类“外表”的要素之一，此外还包括精致的形象和愿意亲自到场。

Let me tell you about them. Gravitas consists of a bunch of elements. Confidence, decisiveness, inclusiveness, respect for others, vision, and integrity. Communication skills include the ability to command a room, to read an audience, and to be authentic. Authenticity is also an element of the third category, appearance, along with a polished look and a willingness to show up in person.

尽管外表在Sylvia看来是最不重要的因素，但听众Mary Calmer目前缺失的正是那种愿意亲自露面的部分，她对此感到担忧。Mary是一名保险承保人，希望未来能成为高管，她正试图在一家她还算新人的公司里，完全远程工作的情况下取得进展。

Even though appearance is, according to Sylvia, the least important factor, that willingness to show up in person piece is one that listener Mary Calmer is missing at the moment, and she's worried about it. Mary's an insurance underwriter who wants to be an executive at some point in the future, and she's trying to figure out how to make progress while working fully remotely at a company where she's still pretty new.

我的一个担忧是，我的可见度不够高，我没有像那些每天来办公室的人那样多的面对面时间，比如在午餐室偶遇CEO之类的机会。

One concern is that I'm just not visible enough, and I don't have as much FaceTime as the people who are in the office every day and, bumping into the CEO in the in the lunchroom and things like that.

她主要通过电子邮件与同事和客户沟通。视频通话很少，仅有的几次也通常是与她导师或老板的一对一会议。

She mostly communicates with colleagues and clients over email. Video calls are rare, and the few she does are generally one on one meetings with either her mentor or her boss.

说实话，我做了很多独立工作。所以很难让自己被看到，但这正是我一直在努力改进的一点。

I do a lot of work independently, to be honest. So it's hard to put myself out there, but it that is one thing that I've been working on.

为了获得动力，她在LinkedIn上关注像Megan Bach这样的领导者。

For motivation, she follows leaders like Megan Bach on LinkedIn.

我最初是在一个面向保险行业女性的播客《Bound Determined》上听到Megan的，她的背景让我很有共鸣。她最初也是从承保人这样的类似岗位起步，一路晋升为公司COO。她现在在各地参加论坛、出差，做这些很棒的事情，我把她视为榜样。

I first heard Megan on a podcast for women in insurance called Bound Determined, And I really resonated with her background. She kind of started in a similar role as an underwriter and worked she's worked her way up to COO of her company. And she's speaking on panels and traveling all around doing these great things, and I see her as a role model.

这位榜样慷慨地同意加入我们的对话，利用她的行业专业知识，直接为Mary提供如何在完全远程的情况下成长和竞争的建议。同时加入我们的是认知语言学家Laura Sicola，她指导高管如何进行战略性沟通。不过，Megan和Laura的建议不仅是为了Mary，也是为了你。让我问问你，Megan。

One who graciously agreed to join this conversation and leverage her industry expertise to advise Mary directly on how to grow and compete as a fully remote employee. Also with us is Laura Sicola, a cognitive linguist who coaches executives on how to communicate strategically. Megan and Laura's advice isn't just for Mary's benefit, though. It's for yours too. Let me ask you, Megan.

你认为高管气质在你在保险行业乃至科技行业的晋升中起到了多大作用？

To what extent do you think executive presence contributed to your rise through the insurance industry and into tech?

我想说，高管气质确实是一个促成因素。它是持续晋升或获得机会的一部分，甚至可能是起点。但最基本的，是你的专业知识。

I guess I would say executive presence is definitely a contributing factor. It is a part of and perhaps even the impetus for continued promotion or opportunity. But like, table stakes is your subject matter expertise.

嗯。

Mhmm.

如果你根本不知道自己说的是什么，你就不可能真正拥有领导气场——这一点显而易见。

You can't actually have executive presence if you this is just so obvious, but if you don't know what you're talking about.

对。

Right.

所以对我来说，成长轨迹的第一步就是成为深度专家。我当时是承保负责人，对吧？因此我必须真正理解任何特定账户的潜在损失风险。例如，总承包商与道路承包商之间的损失风险有什么区别？如果这家总承包商在芝加哥、纽约、南佛罗里达工作，与在内华达或加州或其他地方工作，又有哪些细微差别？

And so I think that this sort of growth trajectory for me was was number one, becoming a deep expert. You know, I was an underwriting leader, right? And so I needed to actually understand what the risk of loss was in any given account situation. For example, what's the difference between the risk of loss to a general contractor versus a street and road contractor? And what's the nuance if that general contractor works in Chicago or New York or South Florida versus Nevada or California or or somewhere else.

我不会用答案来烦你，但我可以告诉你，我知道这些答案。因此，首要的是理解专业知识；在此之上，领导气场——你如何呈现自己、如何沟通——能帮助你的信息传播得更广。而领导气场并不会自然而然地产生。

And I won't bore you with the answers to those, but I can tell you that I know them. And so first and foremost was understanding the subject matter. And then on top of that, the executive presence, the how you show up, the how you communicate helps your message be spread wider. And then executive presence doesn't just happen naturally. Yeah.

我认为你必须刻意去练习它。

I think you actually have to work at it.

那我们把话题转到Mary身上，她是一位资深商业险承保人。当你处在她那个职业阶段，比如十年前或十二年前，你具备领导气场吗？你看起来像个高级领导吗？

So let's relate this to Mary, who is a senior commercial lines underwriter. When you were at that point in your career, say ten or twelve years ago, did you have executive presence? Did you look the part of a senior leader?

我觉得，无意中是有的。我是这样想的：我讨厌购物，这简直是噩梦。所以为了满足“我想看起来体面，但又真不想花时间”的需求……

I think, unwittingly, yes. And and here's what I mean by that. I hate shopping. It is literally my nightmare. And so in order to satisfy sort of, like, well, I want to look nice, but I really don't want to spend any time doing this.

我发现Nordstrom有免费的私人购物服务。你只要去告诉他们你的尺码，他们就会把所有东西搭配好，让你看起来棒极了。只要你刷卡买单，就全部搞定。

I found that Nordstrom has a free personal shopper service. And so you can just go and tell them your size, and they pull everything together to make you look fantastic. And as long as you put down your credit card and buy it, then it's all done.

对。

Right.

但我认为其余部分在于：第一，专业知识；第二，我总是为会议做准备——了解背景、明确会议目标、清楚自己的观点，并且带着立场参会。

But I think that the rest of it is, first, the subject matter knowledge. Second, I always prepare for a meeting. That means understanding what's going on, understanding where I want the meeting to go, what my perspective is, and I come with a with a point of view.

那你一定是在展现自信。

So then you must be projecting confidence.

没错。而且你要带着信念发声。

Exactly. And you speak up with conviction.

嗯。

Mhmm.

要知道，愿意并自在地与房间里的人交流，无论他们在层级中的职位高低，我认为这也很重要。我见过其他人被这一点绊倒。如果你面前是一位真正的高级领导，你可能就没准备好或不太想发言或提问。而更好的做法是反其道而行之：仍然发声，表达观点。

You know, being willing and comfortable to engage with people in the room regardless of their level in the hierarchy, I think is also important. And that's one thing that I've seen trip other people up. If you've got a real senior leader, then perhaps you don't feel prepared or want to sort of speak up or ask a question. And it's much better to go the opposite direction. Still speak up, have an opinion.

最坏的情况，也不过是变成一场激烈的辩论。

You know, worst case, it turns into a robust debate.

玛丽，让我问问你，这些对你有什么启发？当你听到梅根描述她如何准备，也在打磨高管气场这些细节时，你听到自己在哪些方面需要发展？你的差距在哪里？

Mary, let me ask you how all that is landing with you. As you hear Meghan describe how she prepares, also has worked on the finer points of executive presence, where are you hearing areas for development for yourself? Where are the gaps for you?

我觉得这很有道理。你得先把本职工作做到顶尖，才能被提拔，你得证明自己已经准备好迈向下一步。我可以努力的领域是，让自己站出来，练习公开演讲，用更有力的声音说话。我有时会嘟囔。我丈夫说我把情绪都写在脸上，尤其是负面情绪。

I think that makes a lot of sense. You have to be a rock star at your job before you can get promoted and, you know, you have to prove yourself that you're ready for that next step. Areas that I could work on, putting myself out there and working on public speaking, speaking with a more strong voice. I have a tendency to mumble sometimes. My husband says I tend to wear my emotions on my face, especially my negative ones.

所以我肯定也得在这方面下功夫。

So I definitely need to work on that as well.

劳拉，你是演讲专家。玛丽刚才说的，一定让你产生了一些想法。

Laura, you're an expert in speech. So what Mary just said must have raised a few thoughts for you.

首先，我认为我们需要重新定义“公开演讲”这个概念。因为在我看来，公开演讲其实是你跟除自己以外的任何人说话的时刻，无论是一对一会议，还是正式演讲，它都是在公开分享你的想法，争取认同，理解对方，并与他们建立联系。所以重要的是，我们要清楚自己的意图，并让这一意图驱动我们的专注点和沟通方式。是需要一点轻松感？还是要展现热情和信念？

Well, first, I think it's important that we redefine the concept of public speaking. Because public speaking, at least from my perspective, is really anytime you're talking to someone other than yourself, whether you're having a one on one meeting, whether it is a formal presentation, it's publicly sharing your ideas and trying to get buy in, trying to understand the other person and establish that that connection with them. So what's important, I think, is that we are clear in our intentions, and we let that intention drive our focus and drive our approach to that conversation or to that presentation. Is it something that needs a little bit of levity? Is it something that needs to show some passion, some conviction to it?

这是需要一点外交手腕的事吗？不管是什么，先从意图开始，我们想要的结果是什么？反应是什么？心理和认知、情感、行为层面，我们希望人们如何接收和回应我们说的话？把它当作GPS坐标。

Is it something that requires a little diplomacy? Whatever it is, starting with the intention, what is the result that we want to get? What's the response? The mental and cognitive, the emotional, the behavioral, how do we want people to receive and respond to what we're saying? Use that like a GPS coordinate.

你把它输入进去作为目的地，然后计算路线，可以这么说。我认为这真的有助于让人们同时听到我们的内容和意图。当我们思考更正式的公共演讲这个概念时，我想你最初指的就是这个，我认为克服紧张、跳出自我思维最简单的方法，就是我喜欢称之为自信演讲的四字秘诀，那就是：这不是关于你。如果你在公共演讲，无论你是对一个人、一个小组、一次会议、一个观众讲话，你在那里是因为有人相信你有所贡献。也可能是你自己毛遂自荐，因为你相信自己有价值可以提供给观众。

You punch that in as the destination and then calculate the route, so to speak. I think that really helps to be more effective in having people hear both our content and our intent. When we think about the concept of more formal public speaking, as I think is probably what you were originally referring to, I think the easiest way to get past some of those nerves and get out of our own heads is what I like to call the four word secret to confident public speaking, which is simply, It's not about you. If you're public speaking, if you're speaking to a one on one, to a group, to a meeting, to an audience, you're there because someone believes you have something to contribute. And it may be you who threw your hat in the ring because you believed you had something of value to give to that audience.

所以他们不会靠在椅子上、双臂交叉等着批判你说的每一个小细节。他们只是在寻找价值。所以给他们价值。

So they're not waiting leaning back in their chairs with folded arms to critique every little and that you say. They're just looking for the value. So give it to them.

你知道，我笑是因为我经常对自己说这句话，Laura。谢谢你提出来。

You know, I laugh because I say that to myself all the time, Laura. Thank you for bringing that up.

我确实想回来一下，抱歉如果我有点跑题，但我想回到你之前说的，Mary，在你最初的自我评估里。我觉得你不需要成为摇滚明星。听我说完。你必须有能力。

I do wanna come back and sorry if I'm going off script here for a moment, but I wanna come back to something you said, Mary, in your sort of original assessment of self. I need to be a rock star. I actually don't think you need to be a rock star. And hear me out. You have to have the competence.

你必须知道自己在做什么。你必须说到做到。但我觉得在某个特定角色里成为摇滚明星有点边际效应递减，因为那需要很多精力。我认为这些精力更好地用在比如主动举手参与特别项目，或者寻找与组织内其他人建立联系的方式。只要你有能力并达到预期，你就会获得那些机会。

You have to know what you're doing. You have to say what you're gonna do and do what you say. But I feel like it's a little bit of diminishing returns to be a rock star in a particular role because that takes quite a lot of energy. And I actually think that energy is better channeled into things like raising your hand for special projects, or identifying ways to connect with others in your organization. As long as you're competent and meeting expectations, you will be granted those types of opportunities.

正是这些特别项目让你以不同方式思考业务，让你与全国乃至组织内的其他人建立联系，这给你带来了原本不会有的视角。真正让你作为领导者脱颖而出。因为很可能在那个特别项目中，你拥有特定的承保技能。所以你说的话，你可能只是觉得是基本能力，但在那种环境下应用时，其实是一个很大的差异化因素。

And it is those types of special projects that get you thinking about the business in a different way, get you connecting with others across the country and your organization, which gives you perspective that you wouldn't have had. And a true ability to differentiate yourself as a leader. Because chances are in that special project, you're the one with the specific underwriting skill set. And so what you say, which you might just consider, you know, baseline competence, is actually a big differentiator when applied in that kind of a setting.

我很高兴你这么说，Megan，因为我觉得女性特别容易因为这种完美主义而贬低自己。我有点想知道，是不是我们大多数人其实都比自己想象的聪明得多。你知道吗？

I'm so glad you said that, Megan, because I think that women in particular tend to undermine themselves with this perfectionism. And I I kinda wonder if most of us are just a lot smarter than we think we are. You know?

我可以补充一下吗？当然，Laura。大约五分钟前，我写下“完美主义”这个词，然后画了个大叉，就在我听你描述的时候。说到，我要举手吗？我要主动请缨吗？

May I piggyback on that? Of course, Laura. About five minutes ago, wrote down the word perfectionism and put a big X through it as I was listening to what you were describing. And to the point of, do I raise my hands? Do I volunteer?

我要尝试贡献吗？很多人，男性和女性，但尤其是女性，如果觉得自己没有答案，就不太可能在会议上发言。但会议不是这个目的。会议是关于集体一起解决问题，因为每个人都有拼图的一块。这是知识共建，想法共建。

Do I try to contribute? So many people, men and women, but women in particular, will be much less likely to speak up in a meeting if they don't feel like they have the answer. That's not what meetings are about. Meetings are about group collectively working through stuff because everybody has pieces to contribute to the puzzle. It's co construction of knowledge, co construction of ideas.

我们不指望你单方面解决问题，但我们确实希望知道你能为这个过程、为团队贡献价值。不要把这一点对大家藏着掖着。

We don't expect you to unilaterally fix it, but we do wanna know that you have value to contribute to the process, to the team. Don't hold that back from everybody else.

玛丽，你已经朝这个方向迈出了几步。

Mary, you have already taken steps in this direction.

嗯哼。所以我被要求协助几个超出我工作职责范围的工作组。其中一个有点像项目管理。他们正在实施一个新系统，希望每个部门都有人提供反馈，看看这个项目要怎么推进，他们正在推出的这个平台。所以他们需要一个有核保视角的人。

Mhmm. So I've been asked to help on a couple working groups outside the scope of my job duties. One is kind of a project management. They're implementing a new system, and they want people from each division to give feedback on how this project is going to work, this platform that they're rolling out. So they want someone with an underwriting perspective.

我在想，你现在是否能找到方法，利用参与这个工作组的经历，进一步提升你的高管气场。

And I wonder if you can now see ways that you can use that experience being part of this working group to develop your executive presence further.

我——这信息量很大，但，是的，我觉得那里确实有些机会。

I it's a lot to wrap my mind around, but, yeah, I think there's some opportunity there.

梅根，你会给她什么建议？

Megan, what would you advise her?

这是个好问题。我会把你的参与方式想成是核保人的代言人。

It's a great question. And the way I would think about your engagement in that work would be as an underwriter advocate.

好的。

Okay.

你要确保自己不仅代表你个人的具体观点，而是代表整个团队、多个团队，甚至整个部门的观点，了解他们的痛点和需求。通过亲自收集数据并制定可执行的方案，第一，你会和同龄人建立更紧密的联系；第二，你会成为他们当中的变革先锋或领导者，被视为代言人；第三，对领导层尤其有效，真正推动这个项目所期望的变革。

You wanna make sure that you're representing not just your own specific perspective, but actually that of your team, or multiple teams, or those across the division, find out their pain points, their needs. And by actually gathering the data yourself and creating an executable plan that makes you, number one, better connected with your peers. Number two, a change champion or a leader amongst them. You're seen as the advocate. And number three, particularly effective to leadership in actually driving the change that's been a part of, of this project.

我想我听到的是，梅根，你的意思是，你希望玛丽证明她理解公司的战略，她能明确把自己的工作与公司战略联系起来，并且她在寻求扩大自己工作的影响力。对吗？

I think that what I'm hearing is that you're saying, Megan, you want Mary to demonstrate that she understands the strategy of the company. She can connect her work to the strategy of the company explicitly, and that she is looking to expand the impact of her work. Is that correct?

是的，完全同意。这比我整理的建议表达得更清晰、更简洁。我完全赞同。

Yeah. Exactly. That is a, much more articulate and succinct way of saying, what I had put together for advice. I totally agree.

嗯，总结一个聪明的想法比最初产生它容易多了。那么，Laura，请加入并帮我们理解我们正在

Well, it's much easier to summarize a smart thought than to have it in the first place. So so, Laura, jump in and and help us understand what we're

听到的内容。从我的角度来看，最重要的观点是，如果你想在职位、影响力和机会上有所提升，正如刚才所说，你必须能够证明你的工作不仅仅是完成任务，而是有更大的影响力。你不是机器中的一个齿轮，而且你有远见，能够看到并理解这种价值，并能够以一种战略性的方式表达出来。很多人感到沮丧，因为他们觉得自己是，我用你的词，他们特定任务或角色的“摇滚明星”，他们希望自己的工作能为自己说话。他们的工作可能确实能说明问题，但它并不能代表他们个人。

hearing here. Well, I think the the most important piece from my perspective was the idea if you're looking to rise in your role, in your influence, in your opportunity is exactly what was just stated with regard to being able to demonstrate that your work has greater impact beyond just being a task. You're not just a cog in the works, but also that you have the vision to see and understand what that value is and to be able to articulate it in a way that is strategic. There's a lot of people who are frustrated because they feel like they are, I'll use your term, rock stars at their particular task or role, and they want their work to speak for itself. And their work might speak for itself, but it doesn't speak for them as a person.

所以，如果你只以专业能力闻名，我们会让你继续留在那个岗位上，因为那是你最适合的地方，也是人们唯一认为你有资格做的事情。能够超越这一点，思考对于特定的受众——这些高级领导、运营、业务发展、市场营销、IT、人力资源等部门的人来说——我的专业知识和这个想法中哪些对他们来说是相关的？我如何将这种专业知识转化，让他们看到其中的“所以呢”，从而对他们有意义。

So if all you are known for is expertise, we'll keep you in that role because it's where you belong and it's the only thing people see you as being qualified to do. And being able to look beyond that and saying for this particular audience, these senior leaders, these people who are in operations, in business development, in marketing, in IT, in human resources. What of my expertise and of this idea is relevant to them? And how do I translate that expertise so that they see this so what involved? So it's relevant for them.

而仅仅表现出你在以这些方式思考，就是一种远见，本身就是一种领导力。大多数人不会这样思考。他们非常短视地只关注于“这就是我一直在转动的轮子，而且我转得很好”。问题是，你希望被视为团队中不可或缺的一员，还是被视为应该成为团队队长的人？

And showing that you're even thinking in those terms is visionary, is leadership in its own way. And most people don't think in those terms. They stay very myopically focused just in this is the wheel that I keep turning, and I'm really good at it. The question is, do you want to be viewed as an essential member of the team or as someone who should be the captain of the team?

那么，Mara，你已经听到了Megan的想法，也听到了Laura的想法。你打算如何以这些战略性的方式参与到你的工作小组中呢？

So, Mara, you've heard Megan's thoughts. You've heard Laura's thoughts. How do you imagine coming to your working groups in in these strategic ways?

哦，这是个好问题。首先，我仍然不太清楚，比如他们正在推进的这个项目，他们希望从承保人的角度获得一些看法。但目前我没有任何贡献。他们只是在向我们提供信息，向我们展示，比如，这将会是什么样子。我还没有发言。

Oh, that's a good question. So one, I still don't really know, like for the project that they're rolling out and they want an underwriter's perspective. I'm not contributing anything at this point. They're just feeding us information and showing us, okay, this is what this is gonna look like. And I have not spoken.

我还在吸收所有信息，我仍然不太清楚我为什么在这里。我只是被告知我会加入这个小组。所以我真的不太确定。

I'm just soaking it all in yet, and I still don't really know why I'm here. I was just told I'm gonna be in this group. So I'm not really sure.

不要犹豫去要求更多信息，去请求背景，去和主持这次会议的人安排一次一对一的交流。

Don't hesitate to ask for more information to request the context, to set up a one on one with the person who is, you know, facilitating the session.

好的。

Okay.

如果你有点困惑或者没有足够的信息，我可以向你保证，那个场合里肯定还有其他人也一样困惑。这正是你展现领导力的机会，可以说：嘿，我们这里的背景信息不够，你需要我们创造价值。我每周花两个小时。

If you're a little bit confused or don't have the information, I can guarantee you multiple other people in that setting are. And it's an opportunity for you to demonstrate some leadership to say, hey. We don't have enough context here. You need us to add value. I'm spending two hours a week.

比如，我们来谈谈这个问题。

Like, let's talk about it.

好的。

Okay.

我是说，当玛丽在讲话时我就在想，我会问：你们对这个小组的期望是什么？对吧？

And I I mean, I was thinking while Mary was talking, I would ask, what are your expectations of this group? Right?

我觉得我们在演口技，因为我一直在记笔记，然后梅根就把我想说的全说了出来。所以太神奇了。是的，要主动，提出问题。

I think we're doing a ventriloquism act because I keep writing down notes, and then Megan says exactly what I was thinking. So it's it's amazing. Yes. Be proactive. Ask the questions.

我记下了：问问我能贡献什么价值？

And I wrote down, ask what value can I add?

好的。劳拉，我远程工作，不确定如何让自己展现为领导者并提升我的高管气场。你对像我这样的人有什么建议吗？

Okay. So Laura, I work remotely and I'm not sure how I can put myself out there as a leader and enhance my executive presence. Do you have any advice for people who are in my shoes?

当然有。最棒的是，一些最有力的技巧其实最简单。比如你用的麦克风。大多数人就用电脑默认的，结果听起来像这样。你没意识到的是，当音质这样时，听众会下意识地贬低你说话内容的价值。

Absolutely. And the best part of it is that some of the most powerful tips are the simplest. So things like the microphone that you use. Most people just use whatever the default is in the computer, and they end up sounding like this. And what you don't realize is that when your sound quality is like this, it automatically makes the listener diminish the assumption of the value of what you're saying.

这会让他们不想听，也不喜欢这声音。实际上还给听众增加了认知负担，因为他们不仅要理解你的观点，还得费劲先听清词句，再去理解意思，然后判断是否同意或想补充什么。如果你让他们觉得像在眯眼、前倾、使劲集中注意力，人们就会想：唉，太费劲了。

It makes them not want to listen, and it makes them not like the sound. And it actually creates an increased cognitive burden on the listener because not just are they trying to understand what your point is, they're straining actually just to understand the words and then from there to figure out if they understand the meaning and then if they agree with it or what they want to contribute. And it's really hard if you feel like you're squinting and kinda leaning in because you're straining to concentrate and focus on what they're saying. That just makes people go, ugh. It's too much work.

于是他们就忽略你。但当大多数人听起来像这样，而你用不错的音质出现时，大家立刻坐直了，心想：等等，她听起来很重要，我得集中注意力。

And so they disregard you. But when Most people sound like this. And then you come through with a decent quality sound, people all of a sudden sit up and they go, wait. She sounds important. Let me focus in.

让我先听听她的想法。这些完全是潜意识的细节，但多花50或100美元，你的音质好坏会极大影响别人是否“觉得你听起来聪明”。这是第一点。第二，我想我们大多数人即便已经虚拟或混合办公三四年了，对出镜仍有某种内在抗拒。但如果你想与人建立关系，让他们了解你不只是交任务的人，而是能带团队的人，就得让他们看见你、信任你。

Let me listen to her. So they're totally subconscious and little details, but boy, does it for an extra 50 or a $100, the quality of your sound is a huge factor in whether or not people believe, quote, unquote, you sound smart. So that's the first piece. The second, I think most of us, even though we're maybe three, four years into this virtual or hybrid space, most people still have some sort of internal resistance to being on camera. But if you're trying to establish rapport with people, have them know who you are besides someone who submits certain completed tasks, you want them to have a connection with you and build trust with you as someone who they could see leading a group of people.

他们得看到你的脸，感受到你的能量。我不是指那种狂躁的动能，而是“我在这儿，我专注，咱们干活吧”的那种状态。

They need to see your face and the energy that you use. And I don't mean frenetic kinetic kind of energy, but just do you sense that, okay, I'm here. I'm present. I'm focused. Let's get stuff done.

我渴望听到你的想法，看看我们的进展。而大多数人却是：“好，我来了，今天第47场Teams会议。”整个人被榨干，如果你显得筋疲力尽、恨不得立刻消失，对方也会收到这种信号。对。

I'm eager to hear what you have to say and to see our status on this. Versus what most people do, is, Okay, I'm here. It's time for my forty seventh Teams meeting of the day. When there's that utter sense of energy having been sucked out of you, and it's like, if you seem drained and just wishing you could be anywhere else, that's the feeling that you will give to them. Yeah.

那么，Megan，你还有什么补充吗？

So, Megan, I wonder if you have any further ideas here.

我完全同意开摄像头、保持连接是最佳方式。不知道你怎样，反正八到十小时Teams会议后，我可不想盯着自己的画面。所以我干脆隐藏自己的视图，这样焦虑或认知刺激就少了，能真正专注在会议和在场的人身上，就像面对面一样。

I completely agree that camera on and connected is the best way. I don't know about you, but after eight, ten hours of Teams calls, I don't love staring at my own picture. And so I actually do the hide self view so that I'm not looking at myself. And it actually lowers that level of, like, I don't know, anxiety or cognitive stimulation because then I really am just focused on my meeting, the people who are there as if we're in person.

Mary，你觉得呢？

Mary, how does that land for you?

很有帮助。我确实尽可能开摄像头，因为很少有机会跟同事面对面，听你这么说我就放心了。

That's very helpful. I do I do try to be on camera as much as possible because I don't get the chance to be in front of my colleagues face to face very often. So I'm glad you said that.

Laura，我再问你一个问题。你讲的很多内容都在说“读懂观众”，对吧？读房间的能力是商界领袖最看重的技能之一。

I wanna ask you another question, Laura. So much of what you're talking about really speaks to reading your audience. Right? Reading the room. And the ability to read an audience is one of the top things business leaders expect of other business leaders.

Sylvia Ann Hewlett 问过几百位商界领袖，发现这一点。但远程读房间很难。你得一边演示一边盯聊天，脑子被切成好多块。对此你有什么建议？

Sylvia Ann Hewlett found this when she asked a couple of 100 business leaders that question. But remotely, reading the room, this virtual space, is really tough. Yes. You know, you're toggling between presenting and you're checking the chat, and your your mind is divided amongst so many different activities there. So how do you advise people to do this well?

我觉得你得更主动、更明确地用语言引导大家。讲完一段或一个重点就停下来问：“在我继续之前，目前有什么问题？”然后等待。最糟糕的两个提示是“你们明白吗？”和“还有问题吗？”——它们都是是非题，完全起反作用。

I think in part, you have to verbally prompt the rest of the group more proactively and more explicitly. So get to the end of a segment or of a point that you want to make, stop and ask, what questions are there so far before I go on? And then wait. The worst prompt to ask, there's two of them and they're totally counterproductive, is do you understand and are there any questions? Because they're both yes or no questions.

而当你问“还有问题吗？”时，你会听到一片沉默，或者只看到摇头，他们会说“没有”，这完全是假话。答案是“有”，他们只是不想第一个举手。或者你会问：“你们明白了吗？”

And when you say, are there any questions? You'll hear silence or you'll maybe see head shake and they'll say no, which is a total lie. The answer is yes. They just don't want to be the first one to volunteer. Or you'll say, Do you understand?

他们会说“明白”，这也是假话，因为答案其实是“不明白”。你知道有人需要被点拨一下。干脆别用“是或否”，先停顿，说：“让我这样问：到目前为止你们有什么问题？来吧，在聊天框里打出来，或者解除静音。”

And they'll say yes, which is also a lie because the answer is no. You know somebody needs to prompt on something. Just get rid of the yes or no and pause and say, let me ask this. What questions do you have so far? Go ahead, type it in the chat or unmute yourself.

让我们听听在继续之前需要澄清什么。然后至少数到五，最好数十下，慢慢地。大多数人提问后停顿不到两秒，有研究说有时甚至不到一秒。

Let's hear what needs clarification before we progress. And then count to at least five, if not 10, slowly. Most people will ask a question, pause for literally less than two seconds. There is research. Sometimes it's less than one.

结果什么也听不到。大家连静音键都没找到，就算有话想说，也来不及在聊天框里打完字，你就已经说：“哦，没人提问，那继续吧。”

Hear nothing. People haven't even found the unmute button yet if they do have something that they want to contribute or they couldn't have typed it in the chat fast enough and you're already going, oh, no. Okay. It's silent. I guess we'll move on.

于是他们就会想：既然她根本没真心给我机会，那我还费劲参与干嘛？

And we go. So they just go, why bother trying to contribute when she's clearly not truly giving me the opportunity?

嗯。

Mhmm.

你说得对，人们确实需要一点时间解除静音才能提问，不可能瞬间准备好。

You're right. People do need a moment to take themselves off mute and ask their question. They're not gonna be ready instantaneously.

我突然想到另一个办法：当你提问或寻求反馈时，可以让大家用非语言方式回应。比如，行为上可观察的：各位，在继续之前，如果你觉得自己已经清楚并准备好了，请在聊天框里写“OK”或发个竖起大拇指的表情；如果有疑问或不确定，就打一个问号。简单快捷，他们暂时不用组织语言，但至少让你知道他们有疑问。

The one other thing that dawned on me that you can do when you're asking the question, looking for feedback, etcetera, is to request a nonverbal response from the group. So something that's behavioral unobservable, like, for example, okay, everybody, in the chat, before I move on, if you feel like you're clear and ready, please write, Or give me a thumbs up emoji. And if you have a question or are unsure, just put a question mark. So something quick and simple. They don't have to fully think out and articulate the question yet, but at least they've given you the indication that they have one.

这样你就能进一步邀请他们发言，给他们留出贡献的空间——很多人正需要这个，他们会因此非常感激你。

So then you can ask them from there and give them the space to contribute, which so many people need. And they'll be extremely grateful to you for that.

我们已经聊了一会儿，你们在这通视频里能看到我。能否请你们每人给我一条反馈，告诉我该如何提升我的高管气场？

So we've been talking for a while now, and you can see me over this call. Can I get one piece of feedback from each of you on how I could improve my executive presence?

玛丽，首先，我很难想象有比举手说你想做作业、做播客、认真思考更好的提升领导气质的方法了，对吧？你必须设定意图，并真正花时间和精力去改进。

Mary, first and foremost, I can't imagine a better way of improving executive presence than raising your hand and saying you'd like to actually do some homework, a podcast, really think about it, right? You have to set the intention and actually spend the time and energy to make those improvements.

谢谢。

Thank you.

其次，你参与了对话，你在微笑、点头，你的肢体语言表明你投入其中，对吧？这样就能与会议参与者或任何一对一交流的人建立联系和共鸣。所以我觉得这很棒。我建议你可以继续改进的一个方面是，对即兴评论的舒适度和参与度。我是这么想的。

Secondly, you're engaged in the conversation, you're smiling, you're nodding along, your body language says that you're in it, right? And so that creates that connection and that empathy, you know, with your meeting attendees, with whoever you're having a one on one or whatnot. So I think that's excellent. I would suggest that one area that you could continue to work on or improve is your level of comfort and engagement with sort of off the cuff commentary. And here's what I mean.

对吧？当然，这有点刻意。我们在做播客，所以轮流发言。但对话有自然的起伏。这是你很感兴趣、有信念的事情。

Right? Certainly, this is a little bit constructed. We're doing a podcast, and so we're sort of trading off. But there's a natural ebb and flow of conversation. And so this is something that you are excited about, into, have convictions on.

尽管插话，把一个想法展开，让它更有力地表达你的观点。如果我有一条反馈，那就是你的参与感有点保守或受限。我鼓励你从肢体语言或语言上，让自己走出那个框框。

Feel free to interject, to take a thought and let it unroll in a way that's going to drive your point home. If I had a piece of feedback, it would be that your engagement feels a little bit more guarded or in a in a box. And I would encourage you to, just from a body language perspective or from your words, to kind of let yourself out of that box.

好的。谢谢。

Okay. Thank you.

劳拉。

Laura.

梅根刚才说的所有优点我都赞同。你主动站出来 volunteered 这件事，本身就是很好的开始，因为你在把自己暴露出来，在公众面前展现脆弱，也让别人从你身上学习，这非常有力且慷慨，是优秀的领导特质。

Ditto on everything that Megan just said as far as the positive. The fact that you stepped up and volunteered for this is a great beginning right off the bat because you're putting yourself out there. You're being vulnerable in public, and and you're letting others learn from you. That's really powerful and generous. That's a great leadership trait.

至于如何增强参与感，我实际写下的是“能量变化”，因为我们有不同的能量类型。我问你，你更偏向内向还是外向那一端？

As far as how to increase the sense of engagement, what I actually wrote down was about energy variation because there's different kinds of energy that we have. Let me ask this. Do you self identify more along the introverted end or the extroverted end of

这个

the

光谱？内向。好的。这确实能体现出来。再说一遍，没有好坏之分。

spectrum? Introverted. Okay. And that comes through. And again, neither is better or worse.

但我经常从更内向的人那里听到的是，这大概就是我的能量所在。我就是那种悠闲、随和的人。这就是我正常的说话方式。这就是我。所谓的“这就是我”。

But what I often hear from the more introverted people is that this is kind of where I live energy wise. I'm just I'm a I'm a laid back, kinda easygoing kind of person. This is my normal speaking. This is this is me. Quote unquote, that's just me.

给自己贴标签——你并没有这么做。我在替你说话，但我经常从别人那里听到的“这就是我”并不是关于真实性，因为你并不是那种非黑即白、单一维度的人。每个人都有高潮低谷、强烈与随和的一面。学会挖掘并分享这些。如果我们想谈不同的能量，有头脑能量，我在思考事情。

And to label yourself in that you didn't. I'm putting words in your mouth, but what I frequently hear from others with the phrase that's just me is not about authenticity because you're not that black and white unilateral mono dimensional of a person. Everybody has the highs and the lows and the intensity and the easygoing and those kinds of things. Learning how to dig a little bit more and share that. And if we want to think about different energies, there's the head energy, the I'm thinking about things.

我在追求“庄重感”，这个词已经被用烂了。还有心灵与共情能量。你之前提到你很容易把情绪写在脸上。我们想让这种共情流露出来。所以允许它出现，当然，要在合适的场合、合适的时间、合适的程度。

I'm going for the gravitas, which is a totally overused and overextended word. There's the heart and the empathy energy. You mentioned earlier that you wear your emotions on your face very easily. The empathy, we want that to come through. So allowing that in, of course, the right place, the right time, the right amount.

来点乐趣。这段对话对你来说有趣吗？上节目、和Amy、Megan以及大家聊天让你兴奋吗？如果能听到一点兴奋感，或者哪怕是一点决心、一点强度，都会很好。再次强调，不是要你夸张，而是多一点强度、多一点变化，这样听起来你真的相信并感受到你话语中所表达的内容。

Having a little fun. Was any of this conversation fun for you? Is it exciting to be on the show and to get to talk to Amy and to Megan and to everybody? It would be good to hear the excitement come out a little bit or even just a little determination or a little intensity come through. Again, not looking for you to be over the top, but a little more intensity, a little more variation so that it sounds like you truly believe and feel what your words are claiming.

当所说的内容和表达方式之间达成一致、形成同频时，听起来就像你真的相信自己所说的，于是我们也相信你是真的相信。这就是可信度作为核心领导技能的基石。

When there's that alignment, that congruence between the what you say and the how you say it, then it sounds like you believe what you're saying, and then we believe that you believe it. And that's the cornerstone of credibility as an essential leadership skill.

我完全同意Laura和Megan刚才说的。我只想补充一点：没有什么比听到演讲者因兴奋而发光更能让听众振奋的了。这是一次连接的机会。你真的感觉像是看到了对方，而且这很鼓舞人心。所以，别害怕自己的灵感，别害怕你激励他人的能力。

I agree with everything that Laura and Megan just said. And the only thing I'll add, nothing turns on a listener like hearing the speaker light up with excitement. It is a chance to connect. You really feel like you see who you're talking to, and it's inspiring. So don't be afraid of your own inspiration, your ability to get people motivated.

我想接着Amy的话再说一句。我在这场合记了一条笔记：找到你的话题。什么是你充满热情、有坚定立场、希望朝某个方向推进的主题？让人们能从你的声音里听出微笑，让人们因为对你的观点感兴趣而前倾。不是每件事都这样，我有几个让我真正兴奋的核心主题。所以每次被邀请演讲时，我都确保它在我的赛道里。

I wanna just pile on to what Amy just said. I had written down a note for this conversation, which was find your topic. What is the subject that you're passionate about, that you have conviction that you want to see go in a certain direction, where people can hear the smile in your voice, where people will lean in because they're interested in your perspective on it. And it's not everything, I have a couple of core topics that get me really excited. So whenever I'm asked to do a presentation, I make sure that it's actually in my lane.

这是我在乎或有见解的事吗？如果不是，我就婉拒。如果是，我就知道我能把它讲得引人入胜，不是因为我演讲技巧完美，而是因为那种兴奋和投入。找到你的甜蜜点，这将真正帮助你建立起那种高管气场。

Is this a thing that I care about or I have perspective on? If not, I'm going to pass. But if it is, I know I can make that actually very compelling, very engaging, and not because of my pristine public speaking abilities. But just that level of excitement engagement, you know, find your sweet spot, and that will really help you establish yourself with that executive presence.

好了，Mary。我看到你在那儿笑得合不拢嘴。你对刚才听到的有什么看法？

Alright, Mary. I see you smiling broadly there. What do you think of what you just heard?

说实话，那种反馈很难获得，也很难给出。所以谢谢你，我真的很感激。我一直在思考的一件事是，在培养我的领导气场的同时，保持真实、忠于自我。所以，Amy，你有什么建议吗？

Honestly, that type of feedback is hard to get and hard to give. So thank you for that. I really appreciate it. One thing I've been thinking about is developing my executive presence while maintaining my authenticity and staying true to myself. So Amy, do you have any advice on how to do that?

有的。我意识到什么是“领导气场”以及自己需要多大改变时，碰到的最大障碍就是：去做那些不自然的事让我感到不适。公开演讲对我来说并不自然，但我明白我得能跟我的上司、上司的上司、董事会对话。

Yeah. I do. One thing that I know I bumped up against when I realized what executive presence was and when I saw how much I needed to do was to deal with the discomfort of behaving in ways that did not come naturally to me. Public speaking did not come naturally to me. But I realized I needed to be able to speak to my boss, my boss's boss, the board.

不一定是发表演讲，而是即使面对让我紧张的听众，也要能用有说服力、令人难忘的方式表达自己。于是我就不断练习。关键是，我认识到正是这种“不适感”阻碍了我实现目标；我也明白，这样做并不是“不真实”，只是“不熟练”——熟练后就自然了。

It wasn't necessarily making a speech, but I needed to be able to express myself in a way that was compelling and persuasive and memorable even when I was intimidated by my audience. And so I just kept practicing. But the important part was that I recognized that my discomfort was what was getting in the way of my achieving this goal. And I had to understand that it wasn't inauthentic to do this. It was uncomfortable until it became comfortable.

Laura，你怎么看？

Laura, what do you think of that?

很高兴你最后提到这一点，因为“真实”并不等同于“舒适区”。成长本身就意味尝试新事物，而新事物注定会让你不舒服——因为你还不擅长。但这不代表你在“装”。一旦我们说“那不是我的风格”，就等于把自己框死了。

I'm so glad that you ended on that point because authenticity is not synonymous with your comfort zone. Right. If anything, growth by default means you have to try something new, which by definition is going to be uncomfortable because you're not good at it yet. But it doesn't mean you're being inauthentic by trying it. And we really pigeonhole ourselves as soon as we utter that phrase again that that's not me.

我不喜欢公开演讲，我不想穿西装，我不喜欢这个那个……好吧，我喜欢用一个比喻，叫“棱镜之声”，因为真实不是非开即关的灯泡。

I don't like the public speaking. I don't want to have to wear a suit. I don't like the this or that. Okay. Well, the metaphor that I like to use is what I call your prismatic voice because authenticity is not a light switch that's on or off.

它不是二元的。你见过那种挂在厨房窗或汽车后视镜上的小水晶吗？阳光照进去，墙上会映出彩虹。同样，我们就像那束白光，所有颜色本就存在于我们体内。问题是，在这个情境、这个棱镜下，哪种颜色需要最亮，才能让我们此刻与听众产生连接？现在我用的是教练式、公开演讲的“紫色”声线。

It's not binary. If you've ever seen one of those little crystals that people maybe hang from the kitchen window or the rearview mirror in a car, and when the sunlight hits it, the little rainbow projects out the other side onto the wall. Similarly, if you consider that we are that white light and all of those colors are already in us, so the question is in this context, in this prism, which of those colors needs to shine most brightly for us to connect with the audience at the moment? So right now, I'm using kind of my coaching voice, my public speaking side. We'll call it my my purple.

但我家里有个七岁孩子，可想而知我不会这样跟他说话。那样不合适，也许一时有趣却尴尬。我不会用跟孩子说话的语气做这场采访，因为无法共鸣，也不合内容。

But I have a seven year old at home. It probably won't surprise you to know that I don't talk to him like this. And it would not be appropriate. It might be momentarily entertaining if a bit awkward, but I wouldn't do this interview the way that I speak to him because it just wouldn't connect. It wouldn't make sense given the content.

并非一个是“真我”、另一个是“伪装”，而是它们都是我人格里真实的部分。关键在于，此刻需要哪一面发光，以及如何让所有颜色都更亮，而不是只躲在舒适的“蓝色”里——偏好不代表唯一真实，你的其他颜色同样真实。

But it's not that one is the real me and one is me faking it. It's that they're both authentic parts of my personality. So figuring out which aspect of you needs to shine through in this moment and how to beef up all of those colors a bit, how to make them all shine more brightly and not just go to the comfort zone because your blue is your preferred. Preferred is not only authentic. The rest of you is authentic too.

我插一句，这描述得太准确了，Laura，我们每个人都拥有这样的光谱与多样性。我的“真实”之旅也是一段历程。十年前，处在你的位置时，Mary，我以为我得变得像那些跟我谈话的人一样。

Let me just chime in there. And I think that is so accurate, Laura, to kind of describe that that range and the diversity that we each have. My journey with authenticity has well, it's been a journey. Right? A decade ago, maybe when I was in in your role, Mary, I thought I had to show up like the people I was talking to.

在保险行业，有很多男性同事和同行。我假装自己喜欢体育，这样就有话题可聊。要是有人再深入问两层，我就完蛋了。多年来，我意识到，真实其实是与假装相反的东西。它意味着接受自己是谁，让个人与职业更融合。

And in insurance, that was a lot of male colleagues, counterparts. I pretended like I liked sports so that I would have something to talk about. God help me if somebody asked a question that was, like, two levels deeper. Over the years, I have realized, actually, authenticity is the opposite of pretending to be something you're not. It is getting comfortable with who you are and allowing that both personal and professional to be more integrated.

所以，我在私下的声音和在职场里越来越像。我觉得这就是梅根版本的真实。它让我能与听众建立连接，无论是朋友、家人、同事，还是保险机构的领导。这就是我理解的真实。玛丽，你的版本可能不一样。

So I sound a little more similar in my personal life as I do in my professional life. And I actually think that's the Megan version of authenticity. And it allows me to connect well to my audience, whether those are my friends or my family, or colleagues or the leaders of insurance organizations. That's my version of authenticity. And, Mary, yours will likely be a different version.

对吧？但我也想说，这仍然是一段旅程，仍然会有不舒服的时候。我是一家科技公司的首席运营官，现在不在办公室，因为我在出差。如果我在，我会给你看我电脑上的便利贴，上面写着：你想以怎样的状态出现？

Right? But I also want to say it will still be a journey. It will still be uncomfortable at various times. I'm I'm the chief operating officer of a technology organization, and I'm not in my office because I'm on the road. But if I was, I would show you the post it that I have hanging over my computer, which says, how do you want to show up?

问号，作为COO？所以每次开会前，我都会提醒自己：房间里都有谁？我要怎么和他们建立连接？确保梅根，你以你的角色、以你作为高管领导的身份出现。这并不是说很容易。

Question mark, as COO? So I am literally reminding myself before every single meeting, who am I in the room with? How am I going to connect with them? And make sure, Megan, that you show up as the role that you are, as the executive leader that you are. That isn't to say it's easy.

大多数会议我都需要提醒。但这关乎你如何准备、如何出现、如何整合，成为那个真实的你，从而建立连接、产生影响。我很高兴我们都在这条路上一起前行。

I need the reminder. Most meetings. But it is sort of about how you prepare, how you show up, how you integrate, and be that authentic version of you that can create that connection, can create that influence. And, you know, I'm glad we're all on this journey together.

是的。这提醒我们，即使你做了很多功课，走在这条路上，拥有出色的高管气场，仍然需要思考和专注。你必须记住关键一点：这不是关于你，而是关于你的听众。你想以怎样的状态出现？

Yeah. And it just reminds us that even when you have done so much of the work, you're on this journey, you have great executive presence, it still takes thoughtfulness, and it takes focus. And you have to remember that critical point that it's not about you. It's about your audience. How do you wanna show up?

我要感谢你们所有人的到来，坦诚地分享你们的故事和智慧。玛丽、梅根、劳拉，非常感谢。

I wanna thank you all for being here, for contributing with so much candor, sharing your stories with us, sharing your wisdom. Mary, Megan, Laura, thank you so much.

感谢邀请。能参与并与大家交流，我深感荣幸。玛丽，祝你好运。

Thank you for the invitation. It was really an honor to participate and to speak with all of you. And, Mary, good luck.

谢谢大家。我真的很感激你们的建议。

Thank you all. I really appreciate your advice.

很高兴与你交谈。玛丽，我们为你加油。

It was wonderful to speak with you. Mary, we're rooting you on.

谢谢。

Thank you.

本期节目就到这里。我是艾米·伯恩斯坦。下周，艾米·G将探讨建立和维护信任这一核心技能。

That's our show. I'm Amy Bernstein. Next week, Amy G covers the essential skill of building and maintaining trust.

你甚至可以对老板说，你知道，我感到很矛盾，因为我既想与团队建立信任，又想确保不失去你的信任。那么你怎么看？你有什么建议？

You could even say to your boss, you know, I feel conflicted because I wanna build trust with the team, but I also wanna make sure I retain your trust. And so how do you think about that? What advice do you have?

HBR还有更多播客，帮助你管理自己、你的团队和你的组织。请访问hbr.org/podcasts，或在Apple Podcasts、Spotify或你常用的平台上搜索HBR。《职场女性》的编辑与制作团队包括阿曼达·凯尔西、莫琳·霍赫、蒂娜·托比·麦克、罗布·埃克哈特、埃里卡·特拉克勒斯、伊恩·福克斯和汉娜·贝茨。主题曲由罗宾·摩尔创作。我是艾米·伯恩斯坦，你也可以通过电子邮件women@workathbr.org联系我以及艾米·G。

HBR has more podcasts to help you manage yourself, your team, and your organization. Find them at hbr.org/podcasts, or search HBR in Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen. Women at Work's editorial and production team is Amanda Kersey, Maureen Hoch, Tina Toby Mac, Rob Eckhart, Erica Trucksler, Ian Fox, and Hannah Bates. Robin Moore composed this theme music. I'm Amy Bernstein, and you can get in touch with me as well as Amy G by emailing women@workathbr.org.